[00:00:00] Luke: Man, if there's anything I like to talk about, gentlemen, it is water. I'm so excited to do yet another episode on this fascinating topic.

[00:00:10] Tony: We're--

[00:00:11] Nick: Excited to be here. 

[00:00:12] Tony: Excited be to be here.

[00:00:14] Luke: Two fellow water geeks, uh, of the highest order. I think because I've done so many podcasts about water, and by the way, guys, we'll link to all of my former-- I think there's 12 of them now, former podcasts. For the show notes, uh, where you'll find those and everything we talked about today is lukestorey.com/waterpod, lukestorey.com/waterpod. And you'll also find that in the show description on your podcast app. 

[00:00:41] But I think because I've done so many, I get so many questions about water, and I've become somewhat of a podcast ambassador. And just when I think I've learned it all, I meet some guys like you that teach me some more. So I'm excited to dive in. Let's start out, uh, just introducing both of you since there are two of you and those not watching the video, but only hearing the audio want to know who's who, if you want to start, Tony.

[00:01:02] Tony: Uh, my name's Tony Pennington with Ophora Water.

[00:01:06] Nick: And my name is Nick DeValk, and I wear the badge of water geek proudly.

[00:01:11] Luke: Awesome.

[00:01:12] Nick: Uh, with Ophora Water as well. So thanks for having us.

[00:01:15] Luke: Yeah, right on. You wore your blue aqua colored shirt, so we're in good company. And I'll just pose this question for each of you. What, um, instigated your passion about water in general?

[00:01:32] Nick: Oh gosh. In general, um, I grew up in Minnesota. I grew up on a farm. We had a lot of healthy living. We had our own garden. We got water from a well. It was really easy for me to live a holistic, healthy lifestyle. Um, but then when I started moving out of that little comfort zone, that little bubble where we had everything fresh, fresh eggs from the chickens, fresh beef from cows that you could see out your window, all of those things, um, I started to realize that everything's manufactured, and processed, and packaged, and water's not the same as it is that I was used to growing up on lakes, and rivers, and things like that.

[00:02:09] Um, so that was one of those aha moments of things aren't that simple. You have to actually seek out these things. Um, and then life progresses. As years went on, um, moved from Minnesota to Southern California, um, where water is a really hot topic. Um, turning on the tap and drinking the water, your body just feels bogged down. 

[00:02:32] Luke: People do that?

[00:02:33] Nick: Exactly. I didn't know any better. So bad oil in the engine, um, and there's got to be something to it. And I've always kept that in the back of my mind. Um, but then got, uh, linked up with Ophora just by circumstance and learned about what was going on there under that roof. And that was five, six years ago at the inception and just had one of those intuitive hits of just like, this is really cool. I resonate with this. I don't know exactly why I resonate with this, but let's explore it. 

[00:03:01] And as time progressed, the layers of the onion kept coming off and learning more and more and more about water just deep in my passion about why we do what we do. And there's just the wealth of knowledge and how intelligent water is. Um, it really speaks to me every single day, and I'm always curious and hungry to learn more. So yeah. 

[00:03:21] Luke: What astrological sign are you?

[00:03:22] Nick: I'm an Aquarius.

[00:03:23] Luke: Is that a water sign? 

[00:03:25] Nick: Uh, it's an air sign. Water sign.

[00:03:29] Luke: I always wonder if my obsession with water is because I'm a Scorpio and I'm a water sign. I don't know. I know very little about astrology, but I, dude, literally, when I'm driving and the map is on the navigation in the car on a road trip and I see a blue spot, I will drive off the road and find the water.

[00:03:49] Nick: Yeah.

[00:03:49] Luke: If it's accessible to get in it. So yeah, I share that too. I always wonder like, why some of us gravitate toward that particular element so much. How about you?

[00:04:02] Tony: I've just always been, similar to Nick, what he said, just always had this attraction to water and magnetism towards water. So my background, I worked up in the Central Valley of California on a lot of, uh, commercial large scale irrigation for agricultural irrigation and working with, uh, throughout the water structure there with the dams, and the distribution, and the aqueducts.

[00:04:29] And it just got to a point where I had to get out of it, um, and move on and better my life for my family, my wife and my kids. So we headed south to Santa Barbara, and I met Ken, uh, our founder. And I didn't want to go back into that space of living within parameters of just doing what's always been done, especially in the agricultural environment, like I saw up there. Um, so I met Ken, got into water, and just kept going with it and digging deeper and deeper and diving deeper into the science of water. And I've always been against the grain personality. I'm one of those I want to challenge the universe kind of people.

[00:05:11] Luke: You're a musician.

[00:05:12] Tony: And I'm musician. So yeah. 

[00:05:14] Luke: Most musicians are. That's music's great 

[00:05:16] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:05:17] Luke: Some of it.

[00:05:17] Tony: It's all vibrational, and it's something we feel in our soul, and it speaks a language that is universal. So water, I think, has the potential to do the same, and I think it does speak universal language when we're in Southern California, and we're on tier two drought, and the message is spoken. It doesn't even have to talk. It's just water is a scarcity, and listen to that and figure out how we can improve on that.

[00:05:48] Luke: Right on.

[00:05:48] Tony: Yeah, so I'm here, and learned a lot with Nick. I've learned a lot through ownership and the opportunities that we've been given. And there's a lot of change going on right now in the water space. So it's exciting to be part of the solution and change of how to better our water situation here on our planet through the human interaction. And I've got two kids, so I want to leave it, hopefully-- what's the saying? It's, basically, we're borrowing from our children.

[00:06:25] Luke: Yeah, yeah.

[00:06:27] Tony: I'll leave it there.

[00:06:27] Luke: We're in a big drought here too, uh, and I know that because, a, the lake down the street is exceedingly low. It really sucks for the people that bought lakefront property and they have the stairs going down to the boat dock. And it's like their boat dock is up in the rocks, unlike Travis.

[00:06:47] Tony: It is. Yeah.

[00:06:47] Nick: Blue spots on the map are no longer blue spots when you show up to them. 

[00:06:51] Luke: Funny. Yeah. And also I know because, uh, I mistakenly let them put in a smart meter on our water main on the street because we were on septic, and I didn't want that because I wanted a backyard that wasn't a leach field. So we got plugged into the city. And then when they came and did it, they're like, oh, we're putting this meter on, whatever.

[00:07:12] And I didn't really catch it. First, I was worried about the EMFs because we don't have a smart meter on the house, which thankfully you're able to opt out of. I tested it for EMFs, and it didn't have any, so I was like, ah, whatever. It's under the ground anyway, under that big plate. But what I didn't know was they are able to now monitor when and how much water we use.

[00:07:32] And so because of the drought, there's certain days and times that are allocated to you doing your irrigation, which we haven't landscaped here, so everything's dead. There's nothing to irrigate. I accidentally, uh, filled up the pool on the wrong day, and I get a warning email. You just got charged $700. Seriously. like I was like, yeah. Okay. I mean, respect. I don't want to put a burden on the water system.

[00:07:57] Tony: They're there to let you know, and remind you, and charge you.

[00:08:01] Luke: Yeah. I did forget after getting that bill. I was like, holy shit. Uh, give a shout out to your band.

[00:08:08] Tony: Oh, my band.

[00:08:09] Luke: And we’ll put it in the show notes.

[00:08:11] Tony: Yeah, so we finished our album that we actually wrote through COVID, and I'm glad we did because if we had nothing to show for, uh, locking down like that, I guess, or whatever-- but we just finished a new album. The band's called The Phone Booth, and, uh, yeah, we're on Spotify.

[00:08:25] Luke: Cool. We'll link to it in the show notes.

[00:08:26] Tony: Indie, old indie, original Dinosaur Jr. kind of indie inspired.

[00:08:33] Luke: It's good. You sent me a link a few months ago. I enjoyed it. Yeah. Did I ask? I think I did. You're from central California. You know the band Granddaddy, right?

[00:08:41] Tony: Yeah. I do.

[00:08:43] Luke: Did I ask you that before?

[00:08:45] Tony: We've talked about it, but quick story into that is how we came into each other's lives was, uh, uh, my wife, uh, she had found you originally in your podcast. So she's like, listen to this. You got to listen to this guy. I think you're going to vibe with him. Um, so I did. And in one of the episodes, you mentioned just a quick tidbit of how you liked the band Granddaddy. 

[00:09:07] Luke: That's funny.

[00:09:08] Tony: I looked at her, and I was like, are you kidding me? That's how that aligned? So I hit you up in your DMs, and I was like, dude, I'm from that town. Those dudes used to skate in my backyard and play in my living room. And that was the connection. And then, obviously, that was just doubling down on, I think, why I was into your podcast. That was just the icing on the cake kind of thing.

[00:09:35] Luke: funny. I totally forgot about that. Whenever I meet someone from, uh, a place like Modesto-- is that where y'all are from?

[00:09:42] Tony: That's it. 

[00:09:44] Luke: If a band breaks out of a small town, it's meaningful. And if, for some reason, I remember where they're from when it's an artist I like-- there's a million bands from LA, or London, or wherever, and you don't really-- they all came from somewhere else, and now they're from there. 

[00:09:57] Tony: Right. 

[00:09:57] Luke: But when someone makes it out of a small town and they're that good, it catches my attention. I'm just that way. When I meet someone from a small town and there's a great artist from there, I was like, do you know them, or know of them?

[00:10:08] Tony: Yeah, awesome guys. Awesome guys. Jason Lytle, the singer, is a genius songwriter, lyrically, and just structuring songs and chord progressions. Yeah. it's So many summertime theme songs out there, man, for just skating and what we did in Modesta-- going to the river and skating.

[00:10:26] Luke: Back in the late '90s, a friend of mine turned me on to them, and I was just like, these guys are like The Beatles of the '90s. The songwriting, like you said, the chord structures, the melodies, his sense of melody, the lyrics--

[00:10:37] Tony: Jason was a huge Kiss fan and a huge ELO fan, so that's big inspiration there on--

[00:10:44] Luke: That explains the sense. But there's a really cool, and I'm totally going on a side tangent here. Forgive me, folks. This is not about water, but I'm sure the band drinks it. But what was really cool about them is you have-- the foundation of the songs were, for the most part, Acoustic singer songwriter songs. That's the bed. 

[00:11:05] But then there's all these crazy, um, synthesizer loops and stuff over it. So it had this very organic campfire singer songwriter, but then you had this really futuristic weird ass overlay of all the electronic music. Yeah, it was just so great. So I encourage people to go listen to it.

[00:11:24] Tony: That's a great explanation and painting a picture of what they sound like so--

[00:11:27] Luke: It's their album covers too. They'd have a picture of some beautiful nature with old abandoned computer monitors and keyboards and stuff.

[00:11:36] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:11:37] Luke: With all this waste of the technical, uh, revolution, essentially, like littering nature. And that's very much what the music sounded like. They just had a full package deal.

[00:11:47] Tony: Yeah. That's right on.

[00:11:49] Luke: Yeah, and interestingly enough, I styled the singer Jason's, one of his solo, uh, music videos back when I was a fashion stylist. 

[00:11:58] Tony: There you go. 

[00:11:59] Luke: Small world.

[00:12:00] Tony: Yeah. Super humble guy.

[00:12:02] Luke: Yeah. Super cool.

[00:12:02] Tony: Well, thanks for bringing that up real quick. That was fun to talk about.

[00:12:05] Nick: Yeah. I like to shoot the shit. All right. We'll get back to it. What do you guys think about this idea of water being a carrier, or transmitter, or keeper of consciousness, of intelligence, of information? Absolutely. Um, yes, on all those fronts too. And, um, explaining that to people that aren't necessarily on board right out of the gate, um, the easiest way I can explain it, what travels faster through-- does sound travel faster through air through water? Does electricity travel faster through air through water?

[00:12:38] It's a conduit. Our bodies are made up of mostly water. And then we're electrical beings as well. So all that information transfer is going through all the water in our cells, um, that's been spoken about eloquently, like, um, Dr. Bush talking about the crystalline structure in our bodies and all of these things.

[00:12:56] Um, so there's no reason to believe that it can retain, transmit, store, influence, um, energetics on a massive scale. Absolutely. Yeah. Water's not an innate being, it actually has some life and intelligence, and it, and keeps, and transmits that information, and has since water's been on this earth.

[00:13:20] And it's meant to be respected. That's the hard part for me, is when I go and have traveled to third world countries, let's say, Thailand or Kenya and you see all these massive amounts of plastic that are floating on the river systems. Gosh, even here in the United States of seeing all these polluted, um, water ecosystems. And it's just like, no, this is sacred.

[00:13:43] This is meant to be protected because it just holds the key to so many things in our surrounding and how we interact and how our health is being threatened. So yeah. Water is an entity that's meant to be respected to the utmost. And unfortunately, right now, it's not. And that just keeps us charging forward on what we're doing and our mission to provide clean water the best we can.

[00:14:08] Tony: Yeah, we're both in total agreement on that. We basically share a brain and connected at the hip in what we do. So most of the things that Nick is going to speak to, I agree with wholeheartedly. Um, yeah, the intelligence of water, it needs to be respected. I listen to conversations, passing conversations, and things like that, and one point I brought up the other day was, uh, I was on a plane and just listening to people order water. 

[00:14:34] Of course, we don't recommend ordering water on a plane, but I it dawned on me how many people, start asking for water with, just water please, or I'll just have water, or it's like they've already discounted it in there ask, in the way that they're even communicating and bringing it to the person to drink. It's just this discounted perception, it's just water. And no matter what kind of drought we're in or what kind of atmospheric rivers we've just received from nature to at least give us a solid maybe for the next two years, um, it's still discounted. 

[00:15:18] Luke: Yeah, people, uh, I think for the most part, think of water as, uh, just a clear liquid.

[00:15:27] Nick: Right.

[00:15:27] Tony: Yeah. And that's with our human interactions. We all need to be like transparent and authentic and show our true selves. Well, water tries to do that, but we just keep discounting it. 

[00:15:36] Nick: It's the most transparent relationship we could have, and there's a lot going on in there and a lot of intricacies and complexities, but--

[00:15:46] Luke: either of you heard the episode that I did with, uh, Veda Austin?

[00:15:51] Nick: Absolutely. 

[00:15:51] Luke: I've just got to bring her up.

[00:15:53] Tony: Yeah. Amazing. That's what I was going to speak to, is that it's proven that even outside of what we think, she's proven it.

[00:16:01] Nick: There's the black and white right there.

[00:16:03] Tony: And that's what we love about that. 

[00:16:05] Luke: That conversation left me shooketh to core. Out of over 500 episodes or something now, it's one of my most popular. It's in the top 10. It might be number six, which is incredible. Uh, and I think speaks to the human intuition of our relationship to this substance, uh, because there are many other people that have been featured that are, um, much more known.

[00:16:34] She is relatively unknown. I don't even know if she'd been on many podcasts before that, and people love that episode. It was one of my favorites too. I mean, she's just such a lovely person, and so tapped in, but the information she shared with me about her experience with water, I don't even think I could believe the stuff she was sharing with me unless I saw her work, the photographs and things like that.

[00:16:58] One of them that really stood out to me. There's hundreds of examples of her work that are just totally mind blowing, but one of them involved what she does for those listening. And we'll put it in lukestorey.com/waterpod. We'll link to this episode to which I refer. But for those that didn't hear that episode, you guys will know this story. I think she talked about it. What she does is she takes a, um, what do you call that? 

[00:17:25] Tony: Petridish.

[00:17:26] Luke: A Petri dish. And puts a little bit of water in it, and then puts it in the freezer for around four minutes, takes it out, and then quickly photographs it. And so she'll do things that influence the water before she freezes it and photographs it. In this particular test, uh, or experiment, I guess she, uh, played the song Stairway to Heaven by Led Zeppelin in the room to the water, froze it, pulls it out, there's a fucking staircase in water. It's like, dude, come on. What is happening? And that's just one of dozens and dozens of different types of experiments that she's done.

[00:18:00] Tony: It took on the impression the sound.

[00:18:03] Nick: And it shows the intelligence and the sense of humor that water has too, because that could have vibrated and shown up in any different form. But the fact that the water picked up on that vibration and said, I'm going to make it relatable to you so you know how I'm communicating with you, right? 

[00:18:18] Luke: Totally.

[00:18:18] Tony: And this why they choose a stairway.

[00:18:19] Luke: Yeah, they could have put a big blimp.

[00:18:21] Tony: They put a big blimp or--

[00:18:23] Nick: Right. 

[00:18:24] Luke: But yeah, to your point, Nick, when you start thinking about water as a living, intelligent organism, which I think everything in nature is that, personally, I mean, animals, trees, plants, all the things. But water specifically has its own unique properties, I think, because it's the giver of life. But that's what makes it so heartbreaking to me when people pollute water. Natural waterways are just-- what we do to "sanitize" our water, which I understand, right?

[00:18:57] I mean, you don't want water with bacteria coming out of your tap. And there are many people, of course, millions of people around the planet that don't even have safe water to drink. And I acknowledge the privilege of guys like us sitting here having this beautiful Ophora water to drink during our podcast, but just zooming out from all the socioeconomic issues, just the lack of respect that many humans have for water is heartbreaking. And that's true of many things in nature.

[00:19:25] But for me specifically, because I have such a intimate relationship with and love for water. I just like, ah, it's so brutal, the way we treat it. Um, yeah. So we're going to get into different ways to treat it. I have a question. You guys may or may not know this because it's geeky. So water that has minerals has electrolytes, right?

[00:19:46] And you were mentioning how water is a conductor, a powerful fast conductor. And someone told me that if you were to fill up a bathtub with truly distilled water that's had all of the electrolytes or minerals removed, that you can't get electrocuted if you, say, dropped a hairdryer in the water. Do you think that's true? Not recommending anyone to try it.

[00:20:08] Nick: I'm not going to be the guinea pig for that. 

[00:20:11] Luke: Yeah. 

[00:20:11] Tony: I’m not going to assume that water wouldn't outsmart me in that situation in one way or another.

[00:20:16] Luke: The intelligence to make a staircase, it could be like, you idiot, you're getting shocked because you tried this. 

[00:20:22] Tony: Right. 

[00:20:22] Luke: But no, it's just interesting thinking about--

[00:20:24] Tony: That's an interesting concept to think about.

[00:20:25] Nick: Absolutely.

[00:20:26] Because there have been fads over the years, uh, with health nuts like me, uh, where people got into drinking distilled water, and that it purifies your body, and all of this. And then there's this other school of thought that if you drink distilled water, that it's going to act as a vacuum essentially, and start sucking the minerals out of your body. So I've just never been a fan of drinking distilled water. But wouldn't recommend it for any daily drinker or any sort of longevity. If you're going for a purge and that's the intent that you're using it for, go for it. We're not here to tell anybody how they should interact with water or what they should drink based on their own health, and wellness, and biology, and doctor recommendations. That's all well and good. But if you're taking distilled water, which is essentially a dead water that is stripped from minerals, it's just vapor distilled, it doesn't have that spark, that life essence that's put back into it, um, which is--

[00:21:24] Tony: Keep putting it in your car battery.

[00:21:26] Nick: Yeah. You put that in your car battery. You put it in your iron to iron your clothes. Um, and yeah, as far as water being a solvent, in its purest form, it's hungry. If it's in its pure form and it's stripped of everything that it's used to, it's going to want to attach and grab onto things just to bring it back to some homeostasis level that it's used to. So if it's doing that internally in your body for a one time purge, I'm sure it's doing a great job. But over time, that vacuum effect may start to take place, and you're starting to lose things through that water being as hungry as it is.

[00:21:58] Luke: Nice. 

[00:21:58] Tony: Yeah. I think you shouldn't just solely hyper focus on water as your source of mineral uptake either. I talked with a lot of people who hyper focus on that element of even our water, because we're not high mineral. And there's many other ways to uptake minerals in your life unless you're-- yeah. There you go.

[00:22:21] Nick: There you go.

[00:22:23] Tony: Too quick. You're going too fast.

[00:22:25] Luke: Yeah, well, that brings me to another point. So, uh, as I said, we're sitting here drinking this Ophora water, and I forget where I first found you guys. It might've been maybe at Erewhon, just buying bottled water.

[00:22:37] Nick: More than likely. Yeah.

[00:22:38] Luke: Back in the day in LA. And then, uh, tracked you down, Tony, and started coming up to visit you guys at your, um, headquarters in Santa Barbara.

[00:22:48] Tony: Yes. Before we moved. Yeah.

[00:22:50] Luke: Yeah. And a couple of times you allowed me to come in and gave me the VIP experience of doing the oxygenated, purified Ophora water cedar hot tub.

[00:23:00] Tony: Yes. No chlorine. 

[00:23:02] Luke: I've had that on my, uh, vision board now for many years. One day it's going to happen because I don't know if I've ever felt better. And we'll get into that later. But, um, what appealed to me about the Ophora water was as a long time, uh, super fan of spring water for most of the past 20 years, that's what I've drank, and oftentimes, water that I've collected myself or--

[00:23:27] Tony: Sure. The big Find A Spring push that you-- that was cool.

[00:23:30] Luke: Yeah. And my Chris, um, Daniel Vitalis created Find A Spring. And then my friend Chris from Alive Water acquired it. And so now he runs it. And then Chris would, uh, we used to go collect spring water together, and then he made this company, Alive Water. And then he started delivering throughout California, and it's great, great water. 

[00:23:50] Um, but there's something magical about just getting raw untreated natural water from nature. Of course, you can't just do that anywhere because it could be infected with pathogens and God knows what else, but his water's tested, and it's clean. But when I found Ophora water, it's the only bottled water I've ever found, and I'm not just blowing smoke because you guys are sitting here, that when it's cold, tastes as good. I mean we're talking about, uh, water sommelier level. Uh, taste as good as the best spring water I've ever had in my life.

[00:24:23] Tony: Thank you. That's amazing to hear.

[00:24:26] Luke: Yeah. And so that got my attention because I don't find that with other bottled waters and thus began my interest in your company and how you guys achieve that. So going back to the distilled water, um, maybe you guys could define for people what RO or reverse osmosis water is, and then I want to talk about this process of remineralizing. Because a lot of people, um, have questions about that. So break down RO and how you guys put minerals back in the water and all that.

[00:24:56] Nick: Absolutely, yes. To your point on the first initial reaction of drinking that water, um, yeah, thank you again, but, um, I never get tired of hearing that reaction from someone who drinks our water for the first time that is used to natural spring water. And we've had it ad nauseum, that feedback, um, which is great to hear, uh, because that's what we're trying to do. 

[00:25:18] Um, natural sources, if they're available to you, fantastic. But those are becoming so few and far between. Um, and the fact that, um, I personally don't agree with the commercialization of natural spring water and bottling it and selling it in mass. Because again, back to my original statement of treating water like, um, an entity that needs to be respected, we've got all this available water in our municipal infrastructure that has just been degraded, and bastardized, and beat down. 

[00:25:50] Why not try to reclaim that mechanically and use technology to our advantage and use that water that's just been discounted? And then you're going to a natural spring, bottling it in mass, drinking it, goes right back in the municipal system through the toilet, and you're just basically moving it from one location that it's pure to another location that it just gets discounted. 

[00:26:10] So again, not discounting bottled water, not natural source water or natural source water purists. Nature does it best. But if we're doing it in mass and just transporting water to different locations, why not? Let's use our resource that we have and use the technology that we have to bring it back to that pure state mechanically. So that leads into the RO thing. 

[00:26:33] Um, so reverse osmosis as a modality as a modality is the top tier of contaminant removal in water filtration these days outside of distillation. It's a whole different chemical process. But mechanical contaminant removal. Um, RO as a base, it's very tightly wound membrane. As water gets pushed through that, it removes the contaminants, um, upwards of 30,000 known contaminants in our municipal system.

[00:26:57] RO can get that down to 99. 999% effective rate. Nothing's ever a 100. We don't stick with definitives. Um, but we'll stick with micron size. So 0.001 microns. Triple zero. 0.0001 microns in pore size. So that's very, very small. Um, so that's what we use as a base, uh, for our filtration. Most purified waters out there use reverse osmosis as a base for contaminant removal, um, but that's where a lot of other, um, bottled water companies stop, with just-- 

[00:27:28] Tony: Or they don't even. 

[00:27:30] Nick: Or they don't. They don't have to. They don't have to. So there are mandates set, um, by, uh, the government of what is acceptable levels of contaminants in drinking water, um, and-- 

[00:27:43] Luke: Well, we can totally trust the government. I mean, come on.

[00:27:45] Nick: Yeah, exactly. 

[00:27:47] Luke: Dude.

[00:27:47] Tony: Right.

[00:27:47] Luke: We were going to put Ophora system in the house. I think it was for that. We did a water test, sent it to a lab, and I mean, this water where we live is really, really bad, but that's an independent lab. But if you just go on whatever EPA, City of Austin, or whatever it is, and they're like, is my drinking water safe? They're like, yes, the--

[00:28:10] Tony: Absolute blanket statement yes.

[00:28:12] Luke: Because of the allowable levels of things like fluoride, and bromines, and chlorine, and pharmaceuticals, and all that stuff, their threshold of safety is-- I wouldn't feed this water out of the tap to a farm animal.

[00:28:28] Tony: Right. And it won't kill you in a week, and that's what they're hoping. You'll get some life--

[00:28:35] Luke: You won't get Giardia.

[00:28:37] Tony: Yeah, you won't get Giardia from bacteria because there's-- 

[00:28:40] Luke: You'll get calcified pineal gland after 30 years.

[00:28:41] Tony: There you go. 

[00:28:42] Luke: You're going to be brain dead zombie watching CNN.

[00:28:46] Tony: Zombied out. I work all across the United States, and of course, I hear the comment, I've been drinking out of the hose, and I'm perfectly fine, and I'm just like, yeah, you're probably taking 18 medications to offset a bunch of different things. So yeah, you're not dead, but let's double down on throwing chemicals into your body just to sustain how you've been treating that body. Anyway, so RO is where we're at.

[00:29:12] Nick: Yeah, RO is where we're at. That's the start.

[00:29:14] Luke: I understand that, uh, fluoride is a really tiny molecule. That's why most things don't get it out. Is RO sufficient to get it out?

[00:29:24] Nick: It does.

[00:29:24] Tony: It's literally almost the only way to get it out. I don't care what countertop system someone is selling, and it's a flow through gravity percolated. It's not removing your fluoride.

[00:29:38] Luke: Yeah. I love this topic of water filtration because it's rife with controversy. One of the reasons I like to talk about it is demystify or debunk things. I get to, hopefully, the truth. There's certain industries. Water filtration, uh, saunas, if you want to really get people going fucking crazy, start talking about hydrogen water.

[00:30:00] Tony: There you go. Another-- 

[00:30:01] Luke: That one, I don't know why it is the most triggering topic, not for the people who consume it, not for the consumers, but for the people that sell the various hydrogen machines, the hydrogen pills. I did a show a few months ago, uh, about hydrogen, uh, making the water with the machine. This great thing we have downstairs, the HydraFix. I use it all day, every day with y'all's water. It's amazing. But I did that, and then the guy was talking about the hydrogen tabs, and he thinks they're toxic and no good, and then all the people in the tab industry freaked out on me. I'm like, yo, I'm just asking someone questions. 

[00:30:36] Tony: We're trying to have a conversation.

[00:30:36] Nick: Right.

[00:30:36] Luke: Talk to the guy who made the statement. They're like, you let him. But anyway, yeah, the water filtration, there's so much misinformation, and that brings me to your point, Tony, of a lot of the claims being made, like, um, I've seen some pretty damning, uh, videos about the Berkey countertop machines that make claims that they get out this chemical and that chemical, and then someone tests the water afterward and discovers they actually don't, and so on. 

[00:31:04] Tony: And it's a sliding scale too because you're dealing with, what is the contaminant level of the water based on the media and the contact time and the modality of that media? Because water needs contact time over media to be efficient. It needs to touch the media for a certain amount of time at the flow rate that it's coming in at to remove these contaminants correctly.

[00:31:28] You just don't buy something off the shelf because every municipality is different. Every well is different. Every person's experience with water is different. And that's the thing about water, is that there's just so many variables in the conversation that just because information that someone has true to them, it's probably true to them. 

[00:31:48] And I'm sitting here telling you, and Nick sitting here telling you our experiences of what we deal with water in the space that we work with it in, and that might not align with what that person thinks is true. And we're not discounting that. We're just here to speak with what we know and bring what we can add to the conversation about water.

[00:32:07] Luke: So you travel all over the country doing site visits, uh, Tony, for people that are interested in installing an Ophora system.

[00:32:15] Tony: Yes.

[00:32:17] Luke: Do you find a lot of variation between the quality of municipal water and well water? I mean, do you find wells out there that people are drinking, and they're like, oh, we're good, and their well water is as bad as some city water, for example?

[00:32:29] Tony: Well water more so.

[00:32:31] Luke: Really?

[00:32:32] Tony: Yeah.

[00:32:32] Luke: More variation. 

[00:32:33] Tony: More variation. 

[00:32:34] Nick: Absolutely.

[00:32:34] Tony: And we won't touch a conversation of providing solutions for someone on a well until we receive a current and updated well water report. So we recommend I send them a link to National Testing Laboratories in Michigan. Uh, they're a super reputable lab.

[00:32:52] Luke: Oh, cool. We'll put that in the show notes. National Testing Laboratories. That might've been where I sent mine in actually. Now I'm thinking about it.

[00:32:59] Tony: Okay. Yeah, they're pretty well known in the water space. And, um, that way, at least we have a definitive of the quality of water to speak to, um, and design that properly. Um, what's interesting is that on some wells that we build for, you actually have to extract that water from the well, put it in a treatment tank and either add chlorine or add hydrogen peroxide as a disinfectant because it's so bad in the bacteria. 

[00:33:26] Or you can use ozone and UV. It just depends on how much, like I said, someone wants to spend on their water treatment, um, or how little. Um, so you really need to pre-treat that water, take care of the bacteria, uh, the iron, things like that, and then you can run it through something like our UF system platform.

[00:33:45] Luke: Got it. 

[00:33:46] Tony: And then into your home.

[00:33:46] Luke: Do you ever, uh, come across potential customer inquiries wherein they're on a well, and they're worried about their well water being suboptimal, and you find that their well water is awesome and perfect?

[00:34:01] Tony: Trying to think.

[00:34:04] Nick: I haven't yet. 

[00:34:05] Tony: Yeah. We get a lot of reports.

[00:34:07] Luke: Because that's always been my dream, is like, I just need to get a place off grid with a well. And then I always hear these horror stories of well water sucking.

[00:34:15] Nick: Yeah. There's always something. There's always something can be improved upon. Again, it's a sliding scale. There's passable, and then if you just want to make a small few tweaks, let's say, there's some arsenic in your well, or there's trace amounts of fluoride and iron, let's say, and you want to address those.

[00:34:33] Luke: Like naturally occurring fluoride.

[00:34:34] Nick: Naturally occurring fluoride. And maybe some of those things are within acceptable limits, and that's considered potable and healthy for your lifestyle unless you see the alarm bells ringing of E. coli and all these-- yeah.

[00:34:46] Tony: 256 times the legal amount of arsenic in the EWG database. It's like, alarm bells. So in that scenario, on the lower end of that spectrum, it might just be like if this fits your budget and your lifestyle and you want to proceed with removing those small little things out to optimize to perfect water, go for it.

[00:35:04] Luke: My friend, Matt Blackburn, a fellow podcaster, he's got a property up in Idaho, and he sells a filtration system now. He's a water geek, like, I think, all us three. Um, but he is of the belief, last I checked, that all the spring water on the planet is all full of acid rain and all this nasty stuff. And I'm always trying to tell him, no, there are springs that are primary water that's never been through the hydrological cycle. It's actually water that is manufactured under the crust of the earth. It's new virgin water. It's clean. 

[00:35:36] He has a spring-fed lake on his property up there, and his whole house is on spring water. And it's like a 30 TDS, which for those that aren't water geeks listening, is great mineral contents, very low minerals. So it doesn't have a bunch of crappy calcium and shit in it. 

[00:35:52] Tony: Right.

[00:35:53] Luke: But he still filters the whole house. And I'm like, dude, you got probably the best water. But I don't know if he's tested his spring. Do you guys ever have inquiries from people on a property with a spring-fed system, spring water in their home, and then you test the spring water and the spring water sucks?

[00:36:13] Nick: I haven't seen anything like that. Nothing that stands out.

[00:36:16] Tony: Yeah, not on the spring as being good.

[00:36:19] Nick: And TDS, just on that point real quick, that's a great marker of just a blanket what's in your water? Um, but in order to understand the definitives, the black and white, that's where that full panel test really comes into handy because there are contaminants that won't show up on a TDS meter, um, like microplastics, for example, and those are wrought in our water supply, um, air supply. Let's not open that can of worms yet because we can have a two-hour conversation on that. 

[00:36:52] Tony: But if you do Ophora water test, I think it's fun to do on the outside of, whether you're on a well-- I'm working on a property right now for a plumber and builder in Chicago, so that's third job we're getting there. We've already worked the contractor twice another two homes. But the home owner is on city water, and he wants to have a full panel test done on it anyway.

[00:36:57] And I'm like, you're awesome, man. Let's see. Let's break it down. And then we can compare it to what your city is reporting to you from some outdated safety guidelines. And it's not like you can do anything. I guess you can if you want to challenge that to the city, but at least, I don't know, to us, it's just fun to geek out and just see what those differences are as opposed to what the--

[00:37:31] Luke: The information being provided.

[00:37:32] Tony: Information being provided.

[00:37:33] Nick: Yeah.

[00:37:33] Tony: It's like anything else. It's like, why wouldn't you want to test your water?

[00:37:36] Luke: Absolutely. I mean, many of us, I'm sure majority of people listening go through the grocery store and look at the ingredients and everything we buy. Hopefully, people are doing that, looking for seed oils and all the nasty shit in our food. That's how I think about water too. And to that point, there's so many-- I'm sorry, I'm talking so much. I'm getting excited about this topic.

[00:37:58] Tony: It's fun.

[00:37:58] Luke: One of the issues I have with water and people understanding the implications of drinking tap water, many people drink a good bottled water, they get an Ophora system in their house or some other purification system because they understand how gross most municipal water is. I think that many people don't understand that anytime you drink a canned or bottled drink, unless they've gone to great lengths to take care of the source water, that you're just drinking tap water with a better flavor in it. Think about like Coors Light or something? Are they putting their water through RO?

[00:38:34] So one thing that I do like I gave you guys, uh, kava, um, a true kava drink, and you had an Update drink, my two favorite bottled drinks. Actually, two of three, Hydroshot is another one. And I've literally reached out to those companies on their website or talked to their CEO or founder because I work with them in some capacity. I'm like, I need to know exactly what your source water is because we drink these every day.

[00:38:58] And they're like, oh, it's triple filtered, RO, whatever it passes my guidelines. What do you guys think about the municipal water that goes into most bottled and canned drinks, your kombuchas and all this stuff that you might find at a healthy store like Whole Foods?

[00:39:13] Tony: Well, I think they should be treated. That's your baseline additive. If you think about it, everything else is-- that's your baseline product that you're mixing with. Everything else you're adding. I don't know how those specific drinks react to whichever water quality they work best with. Um, I know coffee needs a certain TDS to be flavorful. You know what I mean? So there's markers outside of those specific drinks that I can't speak to, but I think at least it should be addressed in some way.

[00:39:45] Luke: Do you think that if you're buying a bottled or canned drink at the grocery store and the first ingredient just says the word water and then the rest of the rest of the stuff that it's suspecting? 

[00:39:54] Nick: Proceed with caution. 

[00:39:56] Luke: Right. The funny thing is I've asked some brands. I'm like, dude, I don't want to drink your product. It just says water. And they're like, oh no, it's all reverse osmosis, legit. And I'm like, why don't you say that in your ingredient deck? I'm not the only nut that's reading the deck, being, I'm not going to drink this because it's tap water. I don't see the marketing value in indicating to the consumer that the water has been purified.

[00:40:21] Tony: Yeah, I think the conscientiousness is growing towards that even in just the wellness space as a whole, whether it's a facility, or a beverage, or anything else. There's all these mixed drinks that we see promoting the packets with whatever it helps you do, and they're adding it to a bottle of water, and it's like, but what is that water?

[00:40:42] It's like, what are you absorbing? What are you using to absorb that up into your-- to hydrate with. So I hope it's something as good as what you just paid and what you believe in that product that you just dumped into it, and you're mixing it with now because you're just--

[00:40:59] Nick: Rather than being overlooked and focusing on the sweeteners and the mushroom elixirs, or tinctures, or whatever else is going drink. Water as a base nees to be respected first and foremost.

[00:41:11] Luke: Take me back to the RO thing. So in the house here, finally-- this has been a lifelong dream to have a whole house filtration system. So I'm so excited. It's also been a dream to have what I think is the best I've found based on my research, which is the Ophora system. And then we also have this Bio-Quantum, uh, water, uh, cooler and heater, water cooler, like you'd have in an office, but inside it, inside the guts is all of this filtration and UV and ozone, oxygen, all this crazy shit.

[00:41:45] But one thing I noticed about what you guys do is after you run the water through reverse osmosis and you're essentially stripping it down into what you referred to, I think, as a dead water, there's these cartridges that have, I don't know, they look like a bunch of crystals and rocks and stuff in them.

[00:42:02] One of them, I think, polishes the water and another one adds the minerals in. So talk to us about what is necessary to restore water to something closer to its original state, which has the right minerals you want after you've stripped everything out because this is a really important, uh, piece for people.

[00:42:21] Nick: Sure. Um, I took RO. 

[00:42:24] Tony: Yeah, so after the RO, I could speak to the mineral process and a little bit to the restructuring, and then, um, so yeah, after you strip the water of everything, you want to add minerals back into it. Like you said, you don't want to be drinking dead acidic water. So, uh, we use, uh, bioceramics, NSF certified, naturally sourced bioceramics, uh, which are just compressed, uh, minerals into beads, um, and then the water passes along those again at the correct flow rate and has the correct contact time to, uh, take on those minerals to elevate the pH.

[00:42:58] So, um, we have a board of advisors that we've worked with for years in many different backgrounds of health and wellness, and we all have agreed that anywhere landing between 8 and 8.5 is a really healthy, uh, pH. We don't try to exceed 9.5, 10. We don't see a real reason. It can start to lead to small migraines, things like that. There's not really a benefit to that. Um, and then the polishing aspect, that's an organic coconut shell carbon that we use, and that helps with taste and odor. Um, and all these things that we add are very much a part of water treatment done correctly in the stages done correctly, and then we restructure that with vortexing and rose quartz, uh, spheres.

[00:43:48] Luke: Oh, so I am seeing crystals inside--

[00:43:51] Tony: So we do add the vibrational aspect and what that brings to, uh, the adding love and intention back in the water as, as good as we can. Like we said, we're working within a space that we've been given. It's not spring water, but again, we're throwing all the intention and everything we can both scientifically and from a spiritual aspect because we believe in both. 

[00:44:14] We're not this way or this way. It's our own version of biohacking, I guess, in the water space. It's bringing the two together to create this harmony, um, for a finished product, um, so through vortexing the rose quartz. Um, so that's on that system. That's on the Bio-Quantum, the water station that you have. 

[00:44:38] We also provide that on the under the counter system. And one of those systems comes complementary with our home system. Um, but on our bottled water production, we also do that in real time. Basically, we're trying to recreate the way water oxygenates itself in nature through cascading, and hydraulic pressure, and things like that. Um, so that's what we've been able to create. And then most recently, we've gone ahead and just finished building a 528 hertz frequency generator that puts 528 hertz frequency into our treatment, our processing tank.

[00:45:21] Luke: For the bottled water.

[00:45:22] Tony: For the bottled water. So it's getting all the scientific aspects in water treatment, removing everything, restructure, rebuilding it, adding the rose quartz. So that cycles over that, rose quartz vortexing, restructuring device 24/7. So it's in constant flow over that. And then in that tank, we're also adding 528 hertz to it.

[00:45:44] Luke: That's cool, dude.

[00:45:46] Tony: We also, uh, play crickets to it at night. We're like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:45:50] Nick: Let's do everything. 

[00:45:53] Luke: What if, uh, Veda Austin did one of her photography experiments?

[00:45:58] Nick: Veda, if you're listening, please, I will send you some water.

[00:46:01] Luke: Was it 528 or 532?

[00:46:03] Tony: 528 hertz.

[00:46:04] Luke: What if she did it and it was 528 in the water?

[00:46:06] Nick: Let's find out. 

[00:46:08] Tony: It'd be interesting to see what it shows. Yeah. 

[00:46:12] Luke: That's super cool. 

[00:46:14] Nick: That'd be really cool.

[00:46:14] Luke: Yeah. And so in terms of the options for people, if they wanted to work with you guys, you have either the whole house system or you have something called an estate system, which is, I'm assuming, for a bigger property or commercial property. And then you have the under sink unit that can be purchased a la carte or the Bio-Quantum water cooler dealio that can also be purchased a la carte. But if somebody gets the whole house system, then that comes with the under sink system as well.

[00:46:45] Nick: Correct.

[00:46:46] Luke: If someone has the whole house system, what's the purpose of the under sink system?

[00:46:51] Nick: Great question. Yeah. We do have a lot of product lines, and we're unique in that space under the Ophora umbrellas. We have products that fit certain applications, and lifestyles, and budgets. Um, but to answer your question specifically, the under the counter system is a reverse osmosis based system.

[00:47:10] So that's stripping out all the impurities that we can, um, to the highest level that we can, um, also reintroducing the minerals, the rose quartz, the vortexing, um, for ingestion. So the alkaline, um, nature, the 8.0 to 8.5 pH range for ingestion, um, doing that on a whole home level starts to become very cost prohibitive. It does waste a lot of water if you're using RO on large volumes of water for the property. 

[00:47:37] So the whole home system, that's ultra-filtration based, not RO based. They're both membrane-based filtration. Um, UF, a little less on the contaminant removal, but not by much, and certainly better than any of the traditional tank style systems that are carbon based that you see nowadays.

[00:47:53] Um, so you're getting great filtration for the entire house when you're interacting with your water outside of ingestion. But when you want to go to drink or cook, you've got that, assuredly the most pure mineralized, restructured water for internal use. 

[00:48:07] Luke: Perfect. 

[00:48:08] Tony: Yeah. And just to give you a sense of where those three filtration processes land as far as micron size. So basic carbon tanks, your life source or anything like that off the shelf, you're only really filtering down to 2 microns, which in our world is still very large.

[00:48:25] Nick: To give example, um, thread of human hair is about 10 microns in size. 

[00:48:32] Luke: And if you're talking about things like fluoride, pharmaceutical residue, microplastics, they're much smaller.

[00:48:39] Nick: Sub micron.

[00:48:42] Tony: Yeah. Anything smaller than two micron is getting through. Like I said before, if it's contacting with the media in its proper time. And most of the time, those carbon tanks end up channeling anyways, so the media becomes solidified in certain areas, water chooses the path of least resistance, and it's just ripping through that media and a channel and it's not percolating through the media as it's designed.

[00:49:05] So when we talk about our home systems and what you have, we've removed that. We've just removed all the pain points that we've found in the water treatment space. Um, so carbon is 2 micron. Your whole home system, uh, the UF system, uh, UF is down to a 0.015 micron, so you're sub micron filtration already right there.

[00:49:28] Um, and that's just those membranes. That's not including the quick connect cartridges that are post that before the UV sterilization on your system. Um, and then like Nick said earlier, RO is 0.0001 micron, which is for fluoride and trace pharmaceuticals, trace hormones, things like that.

[00:49:48] Nick: Even in the mechanical, the 0.15 on the ultrafiltration membranes, that's extremely robust, even enough to mechanically remove viruses, bacterias, and cysts. It's that size range. 

[00:50:01] Luke: Wow. So for--

[00:50:03] Tony: They use UF on blood dialysis.

[00:50:05] Luke: Oh, really? 

[00:50:06] Tony: That's the, uh, comparison. So I guess that's the similar--

[00:50:09] Nick: Medical application-- 

[00:50:10] Tony: That's the medical application. 

[00:50:10] Nick: Tweaked but in water is the same style of membrane-based--

[00:50:15] Luke: Yeah. So needless to say, if one has the whole house system, which is doing all of your bathing water,--and by the way, I'm so stoked to be able to water all my plants and all that stuff, and of course, bathe in that. So if you have that, then the under sink unit or the Bio-Quantum, you're running already super purified water into now RO, the remineralization, the restructuring, the polishing, all stuff that comes afterward, which is-- okay, that explains why the water like spring water at the end.

[00:50:48] Tony: Because you're not running the smaller system at 6000 RPMs. You're not having to have it work at such a stressed filtration level because you have basically pre filtration before that.

[00:51:04] Luke: That's so epic.

[00:51:05] Tony: So you get the longevity out of the filters as well as--

[00:51:10] Luke: Oh, right. Um, and then what minerals are you guys putting back in? I'm still confused about this, and I don't know if you guys will be able to answer this, but we're talking about TDS, total dissolved solids, like the water in Texas, tap water, even spring water, like a mountain valley spring water from nearby Arkansas, again, talking about some people are more privileged in their access to water. 

[00:51:37] If I had no better water, mountain valley spring water would be wonderful. But if I'm being super picky about it, and I've worked really hard my entire life to be able to be really picky about water, mountain valley spring water is really high TDS. And you can tell because if you put it in a pot and boil it, it leaves like that lime scale, um, scum, this chalky substance, which to me, is some shitty way too much calcium. You get plenty of calcium from your diet. What we don't get is silica and magnesium and some of the other minerals that we need.

[00:52:10] So I look at that as like a hard water, wherein it's inorganic minerals that are basically ground down rocks, limestone, likely here in Texas and in Arkansas. And what I understand is that your body can't really assimilate that much calcium, especially in that form. Has to do with the ionic exchange of it or something. And so drinking water like that can lead to calcification, your arteries, joints, etc. 

[00:52:40] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:52:41] Luke: I'm still not totally clear on a high TDS is bad, but maybe only depending on the ion exchange of those minerals, the form the minerals are in and the ratio of them. So maybe, I don't know how much you guys know about that part of it, but I'm still wanting to understand and learn the total dissolved solids, which minerals we want, which form, which ones we want more of, less of, etc.

[00:53:06] Nick: Yeah. Um, well, we're not doctors. You pose an interesting question that I want to do some more research on myself, um, to--

[00:53:15] Tony: We did have that experience.

[00:53:16] Nick: Yeah, we did. Yes. 

[00:53:18] Tony: The builder in Angeles that we came across. He showed up to a job one day, and I was there working on a system, and we make really good relationships with the builders we work with in the trades that we work with because we work within that whole structure in Southern California. And, uh, one of the great builders who work with Robert is just like, man, my-- he was in the hospital again for kidney stones.

[00:53:37] And he's just having kidney stones every second. I'm all, dude, what kind of water are you drinking? And he's like, uh, I'm not going to say the water, but he's drinking a high pH water, high TDS water, high mineral content water.

[00:53:48] I'm like, dude, drink a case of this and let me know if it goes away, how many times you're having these issues. And now he's just like, we're hooked. He saw a different-- and I think his body is prone to hyper, uh, I guess, creating--

[00:54:10] Nick: Kidney stones--

[00:54:11] Tony: Kidney stones. Calcification with body. And I'm like, you should not be drinking that water. And he's just like, thank you. No one's ever told me about anything like that before. And like we said, I'm not a doctor, but I'm like, dude, what kind of water are you drinking? And I knew right away it was a high mineral water.

[00:54:27] And he's just sucking it down because it's inexpensive. It's in plastic. It's familiar, so it's popular. Um, and it was branded well, so he's super thankful. And we're low TDS. Our whole thing, we're not trying to be spring water. Um, and we're not trying to push high pH or high TDS. Um, we like the lower TDS because we want that taste profile with what we do with our hyperoxygenation. Um, and we've won quite a few first place awards, uh, on the East Coast for International-- 

[00:55:04] Nick: International Bottled Water. Yeah. 

[00:55:06] Luke: Many people probably don't know there are water flavor competitions. I know in Europe, I think it's a bit bigger. There's all these different, um, boutique spring water companies, and, uh, Italy, and Greece, and around the Mediterranean, I guess, and maybe, um, Switzerland, places like that. And there's this whole subculture of water fanatics that are like wine fanatics.

[00:55:33] Tony: Sure. Water sommeliers and all that.

[00:55:34] Luke: Yeah. So you guys have won some awards based on taste? 

[00:55:38] Nick: Best purified water. Yeah, for, um, it was three-- 

[00:55:41] Tony: Three times we've won that first place.

[00:55:43] Nick: Yeah.

[00:55:43] Tony: One year, we're second. Um, and it's a new judge panel every year. And it's blind. 

[00:55:50] Luke: Oh, really? 

[00:55:51] Tony: Yeah.

[00:55:51] Nick: And minerals have a lot to do with taste in water too, which a big respect for water sommeliers with that discerning palate, again, just treating it like the artisan source from the earth, like you would get a different style of grape, um, picked at a different season for a certain variety of wine. There's those little nuances, um, that come up for the water profile, um, but those are direct results of minerals in the water, which is the taste of our water is it's clean, it's pure, it's airy, it's got that effervescent mouthfeel to it.

[00:56:20] Tony: Without being a sparkling

[00:56:21] Nick: Um, without being a sparkling water, um, which is great because a lot of people can take that, and then do their own manipulations on the tail end of that. So if there's a certain mineral blend that works well for your body, might not work well for my body, might not work well for a pregnant woman's body. But if there's anything that they want to put into it, knowing assuredly that's the base product that they can--

[00:56:43] Tony: Which what we were talking about--

[00:56:43] Nick: Exactly. 

[00:56:44] Tony: And it's room for additives. 

[00:56:46] Nick: Right. 

[00:56:46] Tony: Add your goodness to this too.

[00:56:47] Nick: If you want at all.

[00:56:48] Luke: Yeah. And in any case, going back to the RO and distilled water thing, I mean, it's recommended that people put minerals back into their water once it's been stripped regardless of the flavor profile and wanting it to taste good, right?

[00:57:02] Nick: Yeah.

[00:57:02] Tony: It becomes aggressive. If you're running it through copper, it's leaching copper. If you're running it through PEX, it's leaching PEX. If you're running it through Schedule 40, it's leaching-- you know what I mean? It's going to be aggressive water if it's not balanced. And it doesn't even have to be 8.5. It can be 7.1 or 7.0-- as long as it's not in the range of-- and a lot of the wells we test are pretty consistently around between 6 and 6.8.

[00:57:32] Luke: Oh, really? So a little on the--

[00:57:34] Tony: Slightly acidic.

[00:57:34] Luke: Acidic side.

[00:57:35] Tony: But all sparkling water is 4 pH-- highly acidic. 

[00:57:38] Luke: Really? 

[00:57:39] Tony: And people are just chugging that stuff.

[00:57:40] Luke: That's funny. I didn't know that.

[00:57:41] Tony: Yeah, it's super acidic.

[00:57:42] Luke: There was a time, uh, many years ago, and I'm somewhat embarrassed, but I was new to the water game, and I got roped into the Kangen water MLM thing, and I was like, this is going to be my new business. And we would do these tests where you get the pH drops. And show all the different drinks and everything is so acidic. Little did I know, long story short, I was essentially drinking very poorly filtered tap water through my Kangen machine. I still get questions about this. I'm like, people haven't figured this out. The filter is four inches high.

[00:58:16] If you look at the filter in my garage, it's 6"4 foot, big cartridges just to get the shit out of the water. A Kangen machine is not going to do that. Um, but the acidic thing is really interesting. And I didn't know that about, uh, the sparkling water. And I'll also say, I don't think it really matters if you have an acidic drink here and there. And I definitely don't find any benefit in drinking super high pH water simply for the fact, and this is just my Flintstonian understanding of human biology, your digestive system is what? Two?

[00:58:56] Tony: Two or three. Yeah.

[00:58:58] Nick: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:59:00] Tony: Stress less. Don't get ulcers, but--

[00:59:04] Luke: Why would you drink 11 pH water? And if you wanted that too, you could just take a teaspoon of baking soda and mix it in your water if you feel like you want some alkaline water that day.

[00:59:15] Tony: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:59:16] Luke: I don't know. 

[00:59:16] Tony: You ever saw a bath bomb in a water?

[00:59:17] Luke: Exactly. The whole like alkaline water thing and Kangen machines, and I'm sorry you Kangen distributors out there. I'm not trying to shit on your business. If it works for you, good for you. This is my opinion.

[00:59:30] Tony: We've been challenged sideswiped by that conversation in the same group of just unknown. Challenged by that, uh, representative. Um, and it's interesting, um, but the way we remineralize our water is through, uh, flow and allowance. 

[00:59:52] Nick: Delivering the minerals to the water for it to accept rather than the technology of electrolysis.

[00:59:59] Tony: Forcing it. We're a big believer in that process, just like anything else we do outside of the body. We want to be allowed, and accepted, and we want to absorb things that we're attracted to. Not be forced into a certain state. And that's what most water companies do to balance their pH or elevate their pH, is they just dzz, dzz.

[01:00:23] Luke: The electrolysis is what the alkaline water machines do. Essentially, they're electrocuting the water and changing the pH by that. And what you're seeing is the Ophora water system is purifying the water. The water then is hungry to get back to its natural state, find its homeostasis. So it only picks up as much minerals running through that cartridge as it wants or needs, essentially.

[01:00:51] Nick: Not that flow within that amount of time that it's contacting those. And which is tweaked to the point where you get that 8.0 to 8.5. 

[01:00:59] Luke: Interesting. And then what minerals are you guys putting back in the water?

[01:01:03] Tony: Potassium, magnesium, calcium, and a little bit of sodium for electrolyte. So nothing major, but it's a blend and yeah, we're not trying to check everything and go nuts, but the essentials. Yeah.

[01:01:19] Luke: And as you said, you're not trying to create a mineral water. You're just trying to create a water that's close to natural.

[01:01:27] Nick: Right. 

[01:01:27] Luke: Like an optimal spring water would have in it or something.

[01:01:30] Nick: Yeah.

[01:01:30] Tony: Yeah. Just a good balance, man. Talking back to what you're saying about having a spring water every now and then, it's like I think I literally classify myself as like a modetarian. I'm just like, if I want to do something early, I'm just in moderation. My life is about balance. So there's certain things that probably aren't the healthiest thing for me to do, but occasionally I'll do them, and then I bring in all the healthy-- it's a balance is what I'm trying to say. So that's what we're just trying to do with that process, is give it a good balance.

[01:02:09] Luke: I know you guys have, uh, UV or ultraviolet light integrated into, uh, is it in the Bio-Quantum?

[01:02:17] Nick: It's in both the systems.

[01:02:18] Luke: Oh, okay. So the water's running through that to, um, disinfect it essentially, make sure no pathogens make it through. I have one of those on my pool now because I'm always in the war of trying to get rid of chlorine, and I have not succeeded yet, and we're going to talk about that in a few minutes because I know you guys figured out how to do that. But, uh, I really like the idea of UV light. It's a man made light, but it's essentially like putting something out in the midday sun.

[01:02:46] Um, I interviewed a guy named Robert Slovak, who's a advocate for-- he's got a company called Water and Wellness, and he, uh, reps the AquaTru countertop system, which by the way, folks, I still love. Uh, it's great. Um, it's very affordable if you live in an apartment and you can't afford an under sink system or whatever. And he's the guy that brought the Quinton sea minerals to the States. And so he recommends remineralizing your water. 

[01:03:10] Tony: Yeah. That's the ampoules.

[01:03:11] Luke: Yeah, I've seen those.

[01:03:12] Tony: Okay. Cool.

[01:03:12] Luke: So you just put one of those in. So you guys have that as an affordable option. Um, and we'll put that in the show notes too. But one thing that he taught me, he was an early pioneer in the RO space, uh, when it was used in car washes just because the hard water would leave spots on the car.

[01:03:29] Tony: Spot free rinse. 

[01:03:30] Nick: Spot free rinse. 

[01:03:31] Luke: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Spot free rinse. I don't know if he was the guy that figured out, oh, we should do this to drinking water, but he was involved in that in the beginning somehow. So we've had a number of in depth conversations because he really understands RO, and water filtration, and stuff. Yeah. Very knowledgeable, very cool guy. 

[01:03:47] But one thing he shared with me is he said, Luke, if you have an under sink water purification system, which I used to have one that will remain unnamed-- I don't want to shit on them. But if you have an undercounter RO system and it has the holding tank or whatever the overflow tank is, he goes, if you don't have UV in line after that, you're very likely going to end up with some harmful bacteria in your drinking water. He's never do that. So I stopped doing that just at his advice. Are you guys aware of this phenomenon of the potential of harmful bacteria growing in the RO tank? And is that why you put an additional UV bulb in line with the under counter sink?

[01:04:31] Tony: It is. It's a redundant protection. Um, and if you're on city water, obviously they're chlorinating the water so much that there shouldn't really be the potential of bacteria to initially get into your filtration system. But if it does, there is that redundant protection, and we do that with all of our systems. 

[01:04:49] That's just water treatment 101, and the UV always goes last in line. So if you ever go look at a water system and there's a UV and then you've got like a post 5 micron sediment filter, you're jacked because you need the UV less because there's nothing fibrous for a bacteria to grow in.

[01:05:08] So if UV and then a post sediment filter, there's a potential for that bacteria to grow in that sediment filter after the UV and then go into your house. So UV in the water treatment spaces, that's water treatment 101. 

[01:05:20] Nick:  Yeah. 

[01:05:20] Tony: When you talk with a water specialist, yes, if you're adding UV, I'd recommend it and put last in line. 

[01:05:28] Nick: We've implemented that on a scale version of large home systems that we've done. We had a big home in Belevery Hills. We did a large estate style system at the bottom of the hill, very long plumbing run up to the estate. So recognizing that the water is traveling, um, without chlorine in it, pure UV light.

[01:05:45] Number one, it's going through these pipes that may not have been changed. There might be some stuff going on in that pipe. So we put the point of entry in the basement of the home another UV light. So it's like your last bit of protection. And then throughout the home, there's multiple under the sink. So there's UV light there. Yeah. 

[01:06:03] Luke: You guys are hardcore.

[01:06:05] Nick: We take that into consideration. 

[01:06:09] Tony: We do it properly because we do ultimately have the client's health in mind because we know how quickly water treatment can get out of control. And when it's done incorrectly, it can really screw you up. And of course, we're a company, man. You're trying to grow, not collapse. So if we don't offer the correct way to do it-- if you can afford it, cool. If you can't, then we're like, that's fine too. Uh, but if you're going to work with us, this is the way we need to do this.

[01:06:45] Nick: And water is the most intimate part of your home. Just stop and think of how many interactions you have with water throughout your day in your home from start to finish. Just count them, you waking up, getting a glass, brushing your teeth, taking a shower, that's four within the first half hour of your day, doing-- 

[01:07:03] Luke: Doing a party.

[01:07:04] Nick: Yeah, exactly. All of that.

[01:07:06] Tony: All of it.

[01:07:08] Luke: You're speaking my language. Uh, I want to say, before I forget, for you guys listening, if you go to ophorawater.com/luke, by the way, you're going to get a discount if you want to work with them, and as well, get some free bottled water if you choose to get a system. ophorawater.com/luke. And I'll put that in the show description and make it clickable for you guys. 

[01:07:28] Um, now, when I first found y'all, I don't know if you had the Bio-Quantum cooler, and the, uh, under sink thing as a la carte items that people could get. I think it was just the whole house, and I was renting at the time, so it didn't make sense to do a whole house filtration system, and it was way far out of my budget at that time anyway, even if I had owned a house. Are the two a la carte things relatively new? Because we're talking under the sink thing is what, 3,500 bucks?

[01:08:04] Tony: Mm-hmm, 3,500. 

[01:08:05] Luke: And the other one's around five grand for the Bio-Quantum. 

[01:08:08] Tony: Yeah. Right around there. 

[01:08:11] Luke: From my research, and I've represented a lot of different filtration companies and looked at them myself, that's around what most of them cost.

[01:08:20] Tony: For anything that's done properly.

[01:08:21] Luke: And it's a lot of money for people, I acknowledge, but I was really stoked to find that you guys had those two options because for people that are renting and live in an apartment like I was, or just people that don't have the coin to drop on a whole system, that's pretty attainable to make sure that you have really delicious, totally pure, mineralized, structured, all the things, water on tap. 

[01:08:47] Tony: Absolutely. Um, for yourself and your pets. 

[01:08:49] Nick: Mm-hmm. 

[01:08:50] Luke: And plants.

[01:08:50] Tony: And plants.

[01:08:52] Luke: I think one of the reasons most people think they suck at houseplants is because they're giving them tap water. 

[01:08:55] Tony: Sucky water.

[01:09:00] Luke: I still have the Alive spring water here when guests-- I use it sometimes, and when guests come over, if they don't want cold water, then I'll offer them the Alive spring water. Um, but I was using so much of that Alive spring water to water my plants. And I noticed when I started doing that, it was worth it because they started doing better. So my plants were getting weird. I don't know. Do you guys know about the Analemma wand? little--

[01:09:26] Nick: Yes. We do.

[01:09:27] Tony: We do.

[01:09:27] Luke: Restructuring wand. Because I'm a geek, I started taking the Alive spring water and stirring it with the Analemma wand, and then water my plants, and my plants went bananas.

[01:09:38] Tony: Really?

[01:09:38] Luke: Yeah. There's only one, which unfortunately is the money tree that I can't keep alive. I've tried it in different locations. It hates this house or something, which is probably not a bad omen.

[01:09:49] Tony: Yeah.

[01:09:50] Luke: Buying water systems and shit. But yeah, it's crazy, dude. Of course, we think about ourselves, our family, our kids, our pets, but for those of us that are plant fans, and I think of plants as my friends, they're part of my family. I'm just that way.

[01:10:05] Tony: They're a part of family.

[01:10:08] Luke: I think that's a really cool thing too, is if you're a plant lover, is to really be conscientious about the water you're giving your plants. And it's amazing the difference it makes versus just giving them dead toxic tap water. 

[01:10:20] Nick: It's a great feedback. Yeah. Most definitely.

[01:10:22] Luke: You guys should put that on your website marketing. I don't know if anyone cares as much as I do, but I think there's something to it. Um, actually, Robert Slovak, I was asking him about it. He told me that one of the problems with feeding your plants tap water is, if you have a really high TDS water, a really hard water, like we do here in Texas, that it, um, all that calcification, um, smothers the root system, and it basically just turns into a big rock and kills the soil. 

[01:10:52] That's part of it. And then the other thing is, with all of the chloramine, and chlorine, and all this stuff, it kills the microbiome of the soil. And so you're not getting the nutrients to the roots that comes from the-- 

[01:11:05] Nick: It never makes it. It just gets blocked up.

[01:11:09] Luke: Yeah, all the microorganisms, essentially, that turn the dirt and rocks into minerals that the plant can then use as food, you stop that process. It's really interesting.

[01:11:17] Tony: If it's killing bacteria in your water, then it's not allowing the right bacteria to interact in the soil, so it's just, I think, messing up the whole life of how that works naturally. 

[01:11:29] Nick: It's just the biome of the dirt. Plant's not just a cool leafy beautiful thing that sprouts out. There's the whole workforce down there to make it so. 

[01:11:39] Luke: Yeah. if we took the soil of any house plant and put it under a microscope, you would see a whole universe in there, right?

[01:11:44] Tony: Yeah. And then this tree starts talking to this tree underground. Oh, this property sucks. This guy's never going to give good-- it's like they're all communicating underground. We think we're all awesome up here, but-- 

[01:11:55] Luke: Yeah. All the mycelium is like, stay away from 214 Elm Street. Uh, let's talk about some of the other nitty gritty stuff like, um, microplastics and some of the stuff that's in water. I think many people realize it's important to drink purified water, but I just want to impress upon people, again, going back to bottled and canned drinks, and even if you drink bottled water, you have filtered water. There's so much weird shit in our water, and microplastics is something I didn't use to hear about, and now I'm hearing more about it. Can you talk to us about what that looks like and means?

[01:12:36] Nick: Yeah. The information's is out there. So anybody that's interested in just going down a pretty scary rabbit hole, just start Googling microplastics in water. Um, what we found is, um, bottled water is a big contributor. Bottled in plastic is a big contributor to not only the microplastic problem in our waterways, but also what's inside that bottle for ingestion because that will-- PET out in the sun gets baked.

[01:13:05] All of these microplastics are sloughing off that you can't see within the bottle. You're ingesting it. Microscopic. Again, we're looking at submicron levels. Um, but I just read an interesting study about, even in the oceans, by 2050, they're projecting that the amount of microplastics will outweigh the number of fish in the oceans, which is terrifying. So the problem is real. It's showing up everywhere. 

[01:13:34] Tony: And we're not talking about something we saw on TikTok. 

[01:13:36] Nick: It's showing up in women's placentas.

[01:13:39] Luke: Real studies, not TikTok studies?

[01:13:40] Nick: Yeah. It's showing up in women's placentas, and that's being transferred to new life. 

[01:13:48] Luke: I guess I can't get my head around what microplastics means because I'm just thinking you take a polyester blanket or something and you shake it, and you can see the dust coming off it essentially, that it's disintegrating. And I think of that as microplastics, but are we talking about bits of plastic that are truly microscopic?

[01:14:10] Tony: So microscopic, that they can break through the blood barrier and get into your bloodstream. There are sub-micron nanoparticles.

[01:14:19] Nick: Sub micron plastics. 

[01:14:22] Tony: That are plastic that are out there they're fighting in--

[01:14:27] Nick: Uh, placentas and fish bloodstreams. And, um, another study I just saw recently is, um, the phytoplankton in the ocean that is responsible for about 10% of earth's, uh, oxygen. So that whole biome that's working in our oceans, um, microplastics are affecting their oxygen production directly. Um, they're not putting out as much because they're getting smothered by these microplastics.

[01:14:54] Don't understand the direct mechanism or deeper level than that. And then there's legacy plastics that are floating around the earth, blowing off the garbage patches in the Pacific, and mixing with the jet stream, and raining down, and it's just in the fabric now of what we do. 

[01:15:12] Luke: The transference of--

[01:15:16] Nick: It's a scary thought, um, but back to what we do, um, we've got our we water third party certified as microplastics, um, free, which is great. Yeah. We'll take the win.

[01:15:28] Tony: We sent in samples and had it lab certified by, uh, SimpleLabs, which is a-- I know a lab that a lot of people we work with use and trust because I see their water reports coming from SimpleLabs. So I'm like, I'm going to use that one as well. So that's what we did.

[01:15:46] Nick: And California actually just became the first world government to, um, test and mandate acceptable levels of microplastics, Uh, which is-- 

[01:15:56] Luke: That's not acceptable level of microplastics. 

[01:15:58] Nick: We'll the win because of the awareness of what's going on. It's what's being acknowledged, but acceptable levels, they're getting there. It's something conscious--

[01:16:07] Luke: Just think about the effect of plastics on the endocrine system.

[01:16:11] Nick: Yes. 

[01:16:12] Tony: Yeah, it's one fertility issue leading to fertility issues, I'm sure, um, lots of many things. 

[01:16:18] Nick: It's been linked to obesity. 

[01:16:18] Luke: And there's also 17 genders now that are recognized.

[01:16:22] Tony: That's right. It's a brand new world.

[01:16:24] Nick: Yeah. 

[01:16:24] Luke: There could be something about gender dysphoria and all of the microplastics swimming around in all these poor kids' bodies.

[01:16:30] Nick: And linked to obesity.

[01:16:32] Luke: Honestly, totally off topic, but I think a lot of that's probably parents who are just brainwashed with some social contagion and just don't let their kids be kids. But anyway, off topic. 

[01:16:44] Tony: It's everything. It's the world of influence.

[01:16:47] Nick: The pharmaceuticals and hormones that are in municipal water sources now. There's no proper way of taking that out on the municipal level. Um, if they want to, it's very expensive, um, and you don't have to. It's not mandated.

[01:17:00] Luke: So if you have millions of women on pharmaceutical birth control and they're all urinating in the municipal water and then that water in most cities, if I'm not mistaken, is then "cleaned," and then recycled into the municipal drinking water supply, anyone who's drinking that water is essentially microdosing birth control.

[01:17:26] Tony: Pharmaceutical cocktail.

[01:17:27] Luke: Prozac, and God know else. 

[01:17:29] Nick: Yeah. There's a-- 

[01:17:31] Tony: Even if it's trace, it's still going into your body.

[01:17:36] Luke: Yeah.

[01:17:36] Tony: And the energetics of all that too if you want to level up and go to the energetics of that. That's where it's coming from. You're not doing anything at the point of entry to your home to speak to that before it enters the home, or reshape that, or give it a hug, whatever you want to do.

[01:17:54] Luke: Run it over some quartz crystals.

[01:17:56] Tony: Run it over some quartz. You pay for it, and, uh, you put it in your body, and you interact with it. So let's level up and--

[01:18:08] Luke: To Veda Austin's work, I wonder how much impact, say, one just doesn't care to or can't afford to purify the water in their home-- I wonder how much impact, intentionality, and prayer could have on water, the practice of praying over your food. I'm assuming you're all food has a bunch of water in it. You're probably changing the molecular structure of your food just by putting that intention out. It's got to be helpful. I wouldn't think it's enough, but--

[01:18:40] Nick: How that would counteract, the physical contaminants with a spiritual shotgun. 

[01:18:46] Luke: Yeah. You have a special picture of your tap water. If you have to drink tap water, you have a special picture of it, and you pray over it or write intentions on it or something. Dr. Emoto's work.

[01:18:59] Nick: Absolutely. He's the pioneer in all of that.

[01:19:02] Tony: Yeah.

[01:19:03] Luke: I mean, I wouldn't rely on that alone, but it's-- 

[01:19:05] Nick: I wouldn't rely on that exclusively, but it's a good little extra layer in understanding your relationship with water.

[01:19:13] Luke: Better than nothing.

[01:19:15] Tony: Doesn't hurt. 

[01:19:16] Nick: Yeah. Doesn't hurt 

[01:19:18] Luke: Okay. What about, um, let's see here. Oh, what are forever chemicals? This is something I'm starting to hear about in the thought sphere, and I don't really know what that means. Do you guys know?

[01:19:33] Tony: The PFASs and all that fun stuff. So I believe those are the chemicals that are formed of other byproduct chemicals that end up coming together to form a forever chemical that doesn't really dissipate. Most chlorine, if you have chlorine in your water, you can usually leave it out in a pitcher for a day or so, and it'll off-gas.

[01:19:55] But what cities are doing with chloramine is mixing chlorine and ammonia to basically try to turn it into a forever chemical because it's less for them to dose a forever chemical made by a chemical bond than to just add chlorine and have it dissipate. So they add that bond, so it stays in the infrastructure longer.

[01:20:19] And those can be removed. Carbon can remove those, uh, reverse osmosis, obviously, because that's removing fluoride and trace pharmaceuticals and trace hormones. So yeah, removing those can be done.

[01:20:36] Luke: So it's the synergistic alchemical process of what we don't really even know when different chemicals combined.

[01:20:45] Tony: Right. What we do in chemistry class. 

[01:20:47] Luke: Yeah. They make a new chemical. 

[01:20:49] Tony: Yeah. So they meet, and it's a marriage.

[01:20:53] Luke: That's interesting. Yeah, that explains why my pool guy insists on pouring a shit ton of chlorine in the pool every week when he comes. I'm like, dude, you just put it all in. He goes, it's all gone.

[01:21:06] Nick: Right.

[01:21:06] Luke: Because it's in the sun.

[01:21:07] Tony: Then if they want to add the stabilizer to that, that's the bigger fist punch right there. That's the bromine. 

[01:21:12] Luke: Oh, what's that?

[01:21:13] Tony: That's the bromine. So they add the chlorine and the bromine in the pool. That combo, it's a stabilizer. Stabilizer is a pretty generalized term used in many different, uh, worlds. So yeah, they want to keep it in there longer. So it stays longer. I mean, it's really inexpensive anyway. So I'm like, whatever.

[01:21:40] Luke: You guys do, uh, I remember when you visited last year, whenever that was. I think it was right when we moved in, and I was like, oh man, I'm trying to get ozone in the pool and UV. And you're like, oh, we make systems. And they were a bit out of my budget. So I haven't taken that plunge, but do you guys do whole pool systems that just eliminate chlorine? How does that work?

[01:22:02] Tony: Uh, we do. Yeah, yeah. Um, Ken, our founder, had, uh, one of the original patents on that a while ago, and it's, uh, a certain process of components in a certain structure or pattern, um, and how we do that. So yeah, it's definitely ozone, um, high output ozone and UV, uh, in a certain order. And then, uh, the sanitizer is, uh, the food grade hydrogen peroxide, so 34%.

[01:22:27] Luke: Yes.

[01:22:28] Tony: But it's very unstable. Um, it needs to dose 24/7, uh, micro dose. Uh, we're able to do that, um, but the hydrogen peroxide is, um, very expensive. Um, it only really comes in 55-gallon drums.

[01:22:44] Luke: I've researched it.

[01:22:45] Tony: Yeah. And this is ever since the whole COVID pandemic, whatever, and it was difficult for us to get hydrogen peroxide because they were using it for so many different, what, hand sanitizers and everything else. Um, so after that, the price on that bulk item even went up for us, um, even as a direct purchaser of food grade hydrogen peroxide. Um, but a lot of those companies, uh, revoked all their blanketed shipping, um, discounts because they're such big companies.

[01:23:21] So they would allow us to have these drums delivered throughout the US, uh, at a lower rate because they got a better rate. So after all that happened, they came, revoked that from all their vendors, so it forced us to have to look to third party, uh, LTL carriers for that. And that is very expensive. So we can do it. Uh, it is coming at a cost, and some logistics. Uh, we do have people out there who love it, and it works great.

[01:23:49] Luke: I've looked into the, uh, 35% hydrogen peroxide and looked into the big drums of it. 500 bucks or something.

[01:23:59] Tony: Five to 700 bucks, including shipping. 

[01:24:02] Luke: And I thought, oh, that'll last you four years or something.

[01:24:05] Nick: Not the case.

[01:24:06] Tony: Not in a pool. 

[01:24:07] Luke: Really? 

[01:24:08] Tony: This is what your pool's evaporating, too. You're losing hundreds of gallons of water a day just to evaporation.

[01:24:13] Luke: I've wondered about that because here in the summer, my pool, I swear, goes down like two inches a day, and I'm like, is there a leak or something?

[01:24:19] Nick: Oh, in the Austin heat, uncovered, it's--

[01:24:20] Luke: That's just evaporation?

[01:24:21] Tony: Yeah, exactly. That has to be calculated into a lot of aspects of building pumps and things like that as to the evaporation. 

[01:24:29] Luke: So there's really no quick fix to get the chlorine out of your swimming pool.

[01:24:34] Nick: A quick and budget friendly fix, unfortunately not. Um, there is a way to do it. We found out the way to do it. It's expensive and can be cumbersome, but if you're willing to accept that for what it is and don't want to swim in chlorine, we can do it.

[01:24:50] Luke: Right. What I thought I do is just buy a bunch of the peroxide, get the little testing strips, and have my pool guy switch over. I sent him an article on it, and his mind was totally baffled. He wouldn't even have the conversation.

[01:25:08] Tony: And that's the next step, is, I guess, the essential teaching an old dog new tricks. Unless the person who's maintenansing this wants to step outside of their comfort zone of the last 30 years and learn a whole new thing, then they have to be up for that as well.

[01:25:27] Luke: But you're saying the hydrogen peroxide has to be microdosed. It has to be on a drip, going in continuously. Not a once a week shock the pool kind of thing that you do with chlorine.

[01:25:37] Tony: Right. So you want a residual in the pool constantly of 30 to 50 parts per million of hydrogen peroxide.

[01:25:42] Luke: Wow.

[01:25:43] Nick: That's also-- 

[01:25:44] Luke: That's a lot.

[01:25:45] Nick: Coupled with ozone diffusion and the UV light. Ozone, again, excellent sanitizer, oxidizer.

[01:25:52] Luke: Right.

[01:25:53] Tony: And that's the thing, is pools are so different. I've got a pool. It's covered. It's shaded. It doesn't get a lot of use. Um, they don't let their dogs swim in it, which is like adding 50 people to the bather load of, um, so they're running on, what, 15 to 20 parts per million of peroxide? They don't have a lot of evaporation because they have an auto pool cover, so there's not a lot of escape in that way.

[01:26:19] We have a client up in Montecito. They actually prefer their peroxide level slightly higher because they have three kids, and pool gets a lot of use. Uh, they get a pool service, uh, I think for a while there, it was twice a week in the summer because it was such a big bather load. Um, we have an awesome pool guy there, Josh Johnson, um, and he's great. Aqua pool builders there. And, uh, yeah, every pool is different, and it takes a lot of peroxide to keep that sanitized. 

[01:26:51] Luke: And generally speaking, even if one had UV and ozone, that's not enough.

[01:26:59] Tony: You need a sanitizer. We also work with people outside that-- we did one job. Uh, we couldn't even access the pool for a drum delivery because now you have the logistics of getting that 55-gallon drum, which weighs about 550 pounds, to the pool system when it's time to swap those out.

[01:27:18] So we worked with them, and we got them a really good ozone system and a high output UV. And he's like, at least if I'm going to be on chlorine, let's get to the lowest absolute residual. So that helps support that. And even salt systems, those are still generating chlorine. A salt system generates the chlorides and the sodium chloride into chlorine.

[01:27:41] You're just not dumping chlorine into your pool. You're dumping salt, which is elevating the TDS drastically, which is calcifying all your tile work. And then if you have an infinity edge, all that tile is going to start falling off the side of the masonry, and then you're going to have to get your pool rebuilt. Anyway, we work in the pool space too.

[01:28:01] Luke: Thank you for illuminating that. Literally, as you said, saltwater, that was going to be my next question. Because I'm posting about the pool journey of trying to biohack the pool, and people are like, oh, just use peroxide. I'm like, it's not that easy. Obviously, now I know why. And many people are like, oh, just use saltwater. And I'm like, that's still, as you said, making chlorine. It doesn't solve the problem. But if you have a saltwater pool, is the net amount of chlorine less than having to use chlorine only?

[01:28:31] Tony: Yes, it is. There's a generator that the chlorine passes through, and it generates the chlorine from the salt.

[01:28:38] Luke: Got it. Okay. I didn't know we were going to go so deep into the pool thing. It's a topic at hand.

[01:28:45] Tony: Yeah. But we touch on so many different-- like we said, within the way you interact with all water in your home. We've gone into that space in one way or another, and it's pools, spas. Don't get me started on chlorinated spas that are basically vaping chlorine off-gas. It's like, man, if you ever smoked anything, how quick does that get into your bloodstream?

[01:29:05] Or showering in chlorine. If you're breathing that in-- most people have their hot water heater set at like 140 degrees, so that is a gaseous form, and you're in a chamber breathing that in along with everything else that is in there, ammonia and heavy metals. And so you're vaporizing that.

[01:29:25] Luke: Vaping it.

[01:29:25] Tony: Vape it.

[01:29:26] Nick: Vaping it.

[01:29:27] Luke: Yeah, that's a funny experience when you go to a lower-end hotel while traveling, and you're like, oh, they got a hot tub. Let's go take a hot tub. And you get in there just like-- I've always used pretty good shower filters and the little bathtub filter. I've done my best even before I had a whole home system, so I'm not used to a lot of chlorine. I generally swim in nature, not in a swimming pool. 

[01:29:51] Tony: Mm-hmm. 

[01:29:52] Luke: But yeah, I've noticed that, man. Go to a hotel, and you get in the hot tub. You can feel your skin burning. Your nose and eyes are burning. Your lungs are burning. It's so nasty.

[01:30:01] Tony: You can smell it in the lobby through the glass doors sometimes.

[01:30:05] Luke: Yeah.

[01:30:05] Tony: If it's an indoor pool it's just like, whoa.

[01:30:08] Luke: Actually, I was Utah last--

[01:30:09] Tony: Is this the YMCA? Did I just walk in the YMCA? 

[01:30:11] Luke: I was in Utah last year, and they had an indoor pool in the hotel, and there's all these kids in there and stuff. And I was like, ah, maybe I'll just go for a dip. Exactly. I opened the glass door, poked my head in, and I was like, oh hell no. Those poor kids. And I never went in.

[01:30:25] Tony: And what the crazy thing is is that I'm a parent, man. And I got a 17-year-old daughter and a 12-year-old son, Oren and Harlow. And I grew up in the '80s, and none of this was discussed then. And I was in the YMCA pool, and in the public pool, and it's just that I have kids now, and it's like there's not really anything I can do about it outwardly in that regard, but it's just knowing better. It's whether I can do something about it or not, it's like I have the knowledge now, and it's almost like, damn. And that's why we want to educate people and at least offer solutions or help you find solutions and understand it, so you can address it however you can in your lifestyle. 

[01:31:08] Luke: Talk to me about the oxygen piece. So the Bio-Quantum cooler and the bottled water that we're drinking here has oxygen infused into it, which I'm assuming in nature, like in a river, or spring, or something like that, the water's vortexing over the rocks and is picking up oxygen. Is that what you guys are mimicking, is the natural process?

[01:31:30] Nick: We take that natural process and turn it into a mechanical process, um, but we actually have four patents on that process that elevates the level of oxygen, um, significantly in our bottled water. Um, so if you were to take a dissolved oxygen meter, um, we've got a really robust one. It's the best way to measure dissolved oxygen in water. Tap water, you're going to get anywhere between five to eight parts per million of dissolved oxygen at 90 to 98% saturation. 

[01:31:59] Our bottled water, um, after it's run through not only the filtration, the mineralization, the restructuring, um, feather in the cap, what we're doing is the oxygenation. Um, so we're bottling at 40 plus parts per million. 

[01:32:14] Luke: Really?

[01:32:15] Nick: Yeah. 40. So a significant jump, um, at about 300% saturation. Um, crack a bottle of that, you notice it doesn't off-gas, like a carbonated drink. Um, we've actually done tests pouring that into a pine glass open to the air. Takes about 72 hours for that to degrade back down to that five to eight normal level. Yeah. 

[01:32:39] Luke: That's crazy.

[01:32:40] Nick: So yeah, it has everything to do with, again, opening up the molecular structure in the water, giving it what it's hungry for, showing a little bit of love. It takes that, accepts it. And, um, try it out. Put it in a pine glass. Let it sit for about 15 minutes. It's looks like a carbonated beverage. You'll start to see all the bubbles collect on the outside of the glass.

[01:33:00] Luke: And what's the, uh, parts per million in the Bio-Quantum cooler.

[01:33:05] Nick: Different process, but we are elevating the, uh-- 

[01:33:08] Tony: 10 to [Inaudible] 12.

[01:33:09] Nick: 10 to 12. Um, so that's done through an ozone diffusion process. Um, so it's twofold. So the ozone is doing great for sterilizing the water.

[01:33:18] Tony: Mm-hmm. That's in a timed setting.

[01:33:20] Nick: It's on a time setting. Um, and then as a byproduct of ozone doing its thing, O3 breaks down into O2. So that's where we're getting that bit of a boost.

[01:33:28] Luke: Wow. That's super cool. And do you think drinking a bottle of this 40 PPM water is any different, um, benefit-wise than just taking a few deep breaths? You know what I'm saying? 

[01:33:41] Nick: We don't have gills yet.

[01:33:43] Tony: Yeah, yeah.

[01:33:45] Luke: I wonder about that because, um, to me, it's like, yeah, of course. Your body loves oxygen. Drink something with oxygen in it. But I was thinking about it the other day, and I'm like, could I just do two minutes of breath work and get my blood oxygen level up to 99 or whatever?

[01:34:00] Nick: Put that together. Marry that. Do that breathwork practice of how your body accepts oxygen the correct way, through your lungs. But then supplement it, um, with hydration, because that's going through your internal organs. Um, so the cool thing, feedback that we get is better digestion.

[01:34:20] Um, we've had people come back saying, my meals are more normalized. My hunger levels are more normalized. If you're ingesting that, it's supporting a healthy gut biome. All those little guys working in your gut thrive on oxygen, like it would in a potted plant in the soil.

[01:34:36] So all of those gut biomes are working extra hard because they're being powered with hyper oxygenated water. So a lot of those other little things, um, outside of just the breathing mechanism supporting the whole biorhythm of soaking that. After a hard workout, lactic acid is produced as a hypoxic event in your body. Um, and it takes water, oxygen, and time to flush that out. And we've got a lot of high profile athletes that are drinking our water that have come back to us and said my recovery times are quicker, especially with lactic pressure.

[01:35:13] Luke: Badass. 

[01:35:14] Tony: And again, we're not salesy. They find out about us, we give them a case. If it resonates with you, give us a ring. 

[01:35:21] Nick: And we're open to feedback. Good, better, and different.

[01:35:23] Tony: We get calls. 

[01:35:24] Nick: And we love the comments. I have one guy call and tell us his dreams improved or something. Just everything outside of the physical.

[01:35:32] Luke: I'm glad we've covered the oxygen piece, uh, because I think it's really novel and interesting, but also, um, some smarty pants-- I posted, I was so excited about my Bio-Quantum machine. I made a reel. You guys probably saw it. And I was like, dude, game changer. Just having clean water, but also, I love having really cold drinking water because that's how I prefer to drink it. But the hot water, dude, no more, I don't know. It's five minutes every morning. You count that times80years. times80years 

[01:36:05] Nick: Sure. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. 

[01:36:06] Luke: A lot of times, in their boiling water. Now some people are clowning on me like, is it really that hard to boil water? Whatever. That's part of the ritual. Okay. I get it. But still, it saves me time in the morning, and I like saving time. But one smart ass was like, oh, that's stupid. Water doesn't retain oxygen. You can't oxygenate water. I'm like--

[01:36:28] Nick: We have.

[01:36:29] Tony: We've tested it with a certified 3,500-dollar a DO. 

[01:36:39] Nick: Dissolved oxygen meter. 

[01:36:42] Luke: Take that, Mr. Negative, whoever that was.

[01:36:44] Nick: I understand that though, and I understand where that's coming from as water being H2O, Hydrogen, oxygen. How can you add more O? We're not changing the molecular structure of water. We're not reinventing the wheel. We haven't created some new element, um, but through the processes that we use and then adding the O2 to it, the water is hungry and is able to hold onto it just a little bit longer than it would in a bastardized, beaten to death environment.

[01:37:14] So everything that we do has a part to play of the oxygen levels. You take one card out of that pyramid, everything's going to fall down, and we're not able to balance the pH without the purity. We're not able to restructure without the minerals, and so on and so forth.

[01:37:29] Luke: Well, I'm glad to hear that that--

[01:37:32] Tony: Yeah. A lot of the time--

[01:37:33] Nick: It's not H2OOO. It's H2O with just a little bit more O.

[01:37:39] Luke: I think sometimes people just want to make you wrong because it makes them feel better to be right.

[01:37:47] Tony: But that's fine. Bring it on. It ups our conversation. You know what I mean? Like Nick said, man, we're the face. I'm talking to builders in the middle of Cleveland. They're out there working in 32-degree weather in short sleeve shirts, and I'm a guy from California showing up to have him help me hook up this oxygenation system.

[01:38:10] Believe me, I've been in challenging situations. Face-to-face with, whether it's someone online or a concrete guy in Cleveland in February. So it's fine. It helps educate both parties, I think. We're not here to just put everyone on blast, and we're the best, blah, blah, blah, blah. That conversation's last century, whatever.

[01:38:36] Luke: That brings up another point with, uh, say either one of the a la carte systems or the whole house system. I was fortunate to have my friend Marius, who's the jack of all trades and just easily knew how to do the electrical and get the plumbing right to do the whole house, and then he cut a hole in the drywall to put the Bio-Quantum thing, so the laundry door--

[01:38:57] Tony: Oh, cool.

[01:38:58] Luke: And looks pretty sexy. It looks like it's built into the kitchen, which I think was probably his idea or something because it wouldn't quite fit. Um, it'd be rad to, if you were building a home, just to have a recessed cavity for that. So it's totally flush. Mine pokes out little bit. But anyway, I was fortunate. I didn't have to try to explain to a local Texan electrician and plumber, what the hell I'm doing with all these water contraptions.

[01:39:23] Um, how do people find, uh, the right trades people and contractors and stuff to have these things installed. Would any plumber know how to install the under sink system just by following the directions, or is there more to it than your average?

[01:39:38] Nick: That's the cool thing about what we do. Everything's based in traditional plumbing knowledge. We do recommend getting a plumber just because they have that knowledge, and they're licensed, and they're insured, and they're going to be removing pipes and putting things back. But as far as the installation is concerned, everything's pretty comprehensive.

[01:39:55] We got manuals for everything. Um, we're available. So if Plumber X in Cleveland has a problem, he can call any one of us on our team, and we can walk him through it. So we ship these systems all over the United States without us actually going there and holding any hands. Um, we have in the past, so that's where we learned how to be able to dictate that information, um, remotely because--

[01:40:17] Tony: Mm-hmm. That helped us-- 

[01:40:19] Nick: We can't be everywhere.

[01:40:20] Tony: Yeah. That helped us design what we're doing now, is removing all those pain points from a design that shows up on your door because we went out and traveled the US and worked with plumbers in Cleveland, and plumbers in Manhattan, and plumbers in Austin, and plumbers in Colorado, and plumbers in Florida, and teams.

[01:40:38] A big space that we realize is missing from the building space, and this is where we're trying to really make a name for ourselves, is, like you said, maybe it'd be great if it was built in completely to the wall. The conscientiousness of water is gaining so much traction, and what we see is every time we show up to a job, plumbers can talk about the plumbing, the concrete guys can talk about the concrete, the designers can design, but there's always no room for water treatment.

[01:41:08] And nobody can speak on behalf of the water itself as how it works within the home and what it does. So we're really trying to get in with builders. People are going to still keep building homes, and people are going to be tearing down their homes and building new homes. Why shouldn't water treatment in the design phase of a home be respected just as much as the placement of a hot water heater or the placement of an oven? You know what I mean? So every time we're going to these jobs, we got to walk away from lot of jobs because there's no room to do it correctly. So I don't why water treatment in a home hasn't been turned into--

[01:41:46] Nick: Part of the whole process. 

[01:41:47] Tony: Part of the process. 

[01:41:48] Nick: Marble countertops from Italy and chandeliers and gold brass fixtures, what are those going to do over time if you're not treating the water correctly, calcify rust, water spots, all of these investments that you place in the material inside of your home should be protected as much as the human element.

[01:42:06] Tony: And the warranties aren't covered unless you have some scale control or softening before them. So if you read the fine print on a tankless hot water heater, if it fails because of over calcification, let's say in Santa Barbara, where we have 27 grain hardness water, which is extremely hard, when you're talking about potable water, um, if that calcifies that hot water heater and you're not treating it, and you send it in for a warranty claim, they're going to be like, sorry, says here on the fine print, you don't have any scale control in front of it, or softening, so you got to buy another tankless water heater.

[01:42:44] So these are costs that if you don't treat your water, I think correctly and protect, not just yourself, but your investment of your home and the appliances within that, you'll be paying one way or another. It's like you're going to pay in the end. It's a slow death at that point.

[01:43:03] Luke: It's funny you mentioned that because when Marius was putting this system in and he was so excited about the water softening part of it, he's like, oh dude, aside from just the health aspects, he said that, um, he's been in construction for 30 years. He goes, you know how many homes we've had to redo all the plumbing just because the pipes all fill up with calcium, and minerals and stuff? Yeah, and they just eventually close off, and then a leak, then you get mold, and then you get to basically tear your freaking house down because you mold. 

[01:43:34] Tony: We see it. 

[01:43:34] Luke: You do?

[01:43:35] Tony: When we work in that space, we see people's houses. They'll be like, yeah, we had to rip out and excavate this whole half of our house on this cliff because we had water damage, and there was black mold and blah, blah, blah. We're just like, whoa.

[01:43:48] Luke: Yeah. So you were telling me something, I think, when we were talking about testing my water and getting a system here, about the way you guys do the water softening is some proprietary way that's different than just going to Home Depot and getting a water softener, and that it wastes less water. Apparently, softening water traditionally wastes a lot of water.

[01:44:09] Tony: They do. So the system you have, that's a traditional, uh, using salt or potassium chloride is more of a old school traditional way of removing the hardness from the water, um, which-- 

[01:44:21] Luke: Which is why you see big bags of salt at the exit at Home Depot?

[01:44:25] Tony: That's right. 

[01:44:25] Luke: That's what those are for, right?

[01:44:26] Tony: Exactly the--

[01:44:26] Luke: I finally figured it out.

[01:44:28] Tony: Yeah. Um, so you have to refill that tank, which, just from a maintenance perspective, is every time I go to a house where someone has a water softener and I open that brine tank, it's always empty. Nobody fills it anyway, so it's not even softening the water in the process that it should. So remove that aspect of it.

[01:44:46] Those waste a ton of water. Again, they channel. The resin goes bad. So we actually address the hardness. We don't remove the hardness. What happens is that the hard minerals get coated, and this allows them the capacity to scale within your home. So we're talking about softening water with someone who isn't as versed with what we're doing on their home. They're like, I just hate water softeners. They make my skin feel slimy. It's like, cool. We don't do that. So the minerals are still there. You just allow the capacity for them to scale, which is the real detriment of those hard minerals being in your water.

[01:45:23] Luke: Interesting. And then the under sink unit would take them out with the RO--

[01:45:27] Tony: Exactly.

[01:45:28] Luke: Oh, cool. Does that process make the job any easier for the RO to get them out, or is it same?

[01:45:35] Nick: It'd be the same. It's the same bulk matter, um, even less than if you're using just the RO exclusively, since it's already pre-treated with the whole home system, you're not just ramming contaminants down its throat. It's parsed down enough where it's focusing just on those hard minerals. Non-issue. We recommend annual filter replacements for all of our systems just to ensure that they're fresh.

[01:45:59] And that's another great aspect of our design with that scale control, is that, um, now we get to, speak more with people who are on septic systems because you can't send salt brine in a high usage home into a septic tank because it messes with the makeup. It can create a heavy sludge, which then you lose the capacity in that storage tank. And then minerals start overflowing.

[01:46:29] Tony: It's a whole nightmare.

[01:46:30] Nick: It's a whole nightmare. now we get to go in because our system only backwashes for 10 or 20 seconds once every 24 hours.

[01:46:39] Luke: I hear it sometimes when walk by, and I'm like, what is that? I'm not used to that sound.

[01:46:42] Tony: Yeah. And it's cool because that those are the only two actually moving parts on the whole system. So we don't have gears like softener heads and carbon tank heads that go through different, uh, stages for teeth to break off. Everything is designed off pressure. The only two moving parts on this whole home system that you have are the drain valve solenoids, which only open once a day for 10 seconds. So there's nothing to fail as far as a motor, or a gear, or something to get blocked up in that sense.

[01:47:12] Luke: I also noticed, uh, the one in the garage, there's a digital timer on the life of the UV bulb, I think. Is that what that-- 

[01:47:21] Nick: Yeah. Exactly.

[01:47:22] Luke: It's like you have 380 days till you change this bulb. That's freaking cool because you can't see if it's on inside there. 

[01:47:28] Nick: Yeah.

[01:47:29] Luke: My pool, when you tilt your head and see the lights on or not, but yeah, that's pretty interesting. 

[01:47:35] Tony: I gives you a countdown, and then, uh, again, that's probably the same time to change out the other four filters.

[01:47:40] Luke: Smart.

[01:47:42] Tony: Which a lot of the scale control, and the carbon media, and things like that, for removing chlorine, chloramines, heavy metals, ammonias, things like that, are done in those cartridges. But speaking back to how traditional tanks channel, this was our way of getting away from that channeling of a tank because you're replenishing those medias once a year through these quick connects. 

[01:48:03] So you have that peace of mind that your water is evenly flowing through new media. You don't have a tank that's been sitting out there that has gobs and streams of mineral remnants out of a leaking canister, which most media tanks look like. They're this black tank with all these lines of white calcification hanging off the side.

[01:48:27] Luke: Oh wow. And you were telling me when you were here last time about, uh, I now have a cartridge filter system on the pool, but I used to have the, uh, diatomaceous earth or DE. Yeah.

[01:48:38] Tony: Yeah. 

[01:48:39] Luke: And I think you were telling me that for the pools, you don't like the DE because the water will just channel around the medium and evade the filtration capacity.

[01:48:49] Tony: That, and you can't use hydrogen peroxide with diatomaceous earth.

[01:48:53] Luke: Oh, cool. So I did good by switching that out.

[01:48:57] Tony: Yeah. And diatomaceous earth does actually filter, uh, slightly smaller than a cartridge filter. Um, but if you're running your pool equipment correctly and it's being serviced properly, the cartridge filter with either peroxide or, if you choose to use salt, it's great.

[01:49:17] Luke: Cool. Well, thanks for the tip because I ended up having to switch it up. What kind do you want? I was like, I think Tony said, do the cartridge. So I did.

[01:49:25] Tony: Yeah. So if you ever do decide to try dipping in some peroxide yourself just to see you know if you want to buy some 35% peroxide and get all mad scientists on your pool, you can do that because it'll destroy the diatomaceous earth.

[01:49:38] Luke: Noted. Uh, last thing I think that I want to ask you guys about-- oh, by the way, I should have mentioned this earlier, but we're going to shoot some video when we're done with this conversation, uh, just be roll, showing what these systems look like. So if anyone made it this far in the conversation, which I hope everyone did, uh, you can watch the YouTube video, and we'll show what we're actually talking about.

[01:50:00] Hopefully, we can sync it when we were talking about it. I always like to see how stuff works personally when I listen to podcasts. I'm like, oh man, I wish I could see what they were talking about. So we're going to throw that in there. Uh, but I want to know about this cedar hot tub that I had the pleasure of soaking in a couple of times in Santa Barbara.

[01:50:17] As I understood it, it was obviously the trademark, uh, super pure Ophora water with no chlorine and no funky stuff in it, but it was also oxygenated, I think. Tell me all about that because what I remember is long drives from LA to Santa Barbara, a couple of hours. I'm always going to be sore after a ride like that. And I got in that freaking hot tub, and it felt like I got a full body massage for 90 minutes.

[01:50:46] It was insanely awesome, and it was so pronounced that it literally went on my vision board. I'm like, whatever that was, that has to happen in my life someday. So I felt freaking amazing. And so did my friends. We brought Scott from, uh, Sun Potion, and a couple of other friends, and they were just like, dude, what is this? We have to get this. I'm like, it's a little expensive, but one day, we'll all get there.

[01:51:12] Nick: Um, so I can mirror that feeling that you had, going back to my introduction at the top of the podcast, that intuitive hit that I had that I'm like, I have to be involved with whatever this is, um, came from that hot tub, when I sat down and felt-- because what it is basically is our bottled water in hot tub form at 102 degrees. Um, it's got all the hyperoxygenation, the rose quartz, the restructuring, uh, no chlorine, no salt water, but you're using hydrogen peroxide. It's a marrying of our pool systems and our bottled water systems for soaking.

[01:51:49] Luke: So basically soaking in pristine bottled-- 

[01:51:51] Nick: Exactly.

[01:51:51] Tony: Soaking and drinking. And that's the-- 

[01:51:54] Luke: So could you get in that hot tub and just take a cup and just drink some of the water?

[01:51:58] Nick: You could. I prefer from--

[01:51:59] Tony: You just-- there's skin and stuff in there. 

[01:52:02] Nick: There's all other stuff in there, but--

[01:52:04] Luke: . Wood flakes.

[01:52:05] Nick: From experience, um, experiential standpoint, you felt it. Other people come and feel it. Getting out, just feeling just lifted, floaty. Um, you're not breathing in. Again, we're sitting at about 30 parts per million of dissolved oxygen in the tub at 200% saturation in a hot environment that's off-gassing. So you're breathing that in also. 

[01:52:26] And your skin is just soft. Um, so we're sitting in an open, poor environment, in a hot environment with all those small oxygen molecules. Your body's just sponging. It loves it. You're not coming out with super wrinkly fingers like you do in a chlorinated pool. Um, oh gosh. The list on and on and on.

[01:52:45] Tony: The testing too.

[01:52:47] Nick: Yeah, we've done the testing. We've done some phase angle testing as it relates to soaking in the tub and drinking at the same time as a double modality. Um, we've got the test results we can share with you, but we did see an increase in phase angles over the course of three hours.

[01:53:03] Luke: What are phase angles? 

[01:53:04] Nick: Um, it's a really, really hard metric to move. Um, three, you're dead. Twelve is unachievable. So that's the spectrum right there. And it has everything to do with measuring the conductivity of electricity through your body, through structured water in your cells. So how efficient your body is at communicating electrical impulses through water, like we're saying, the traveling of water through your body that way. Um, and it's one of the best markers for biological age, um, that your body can have.

[01:53:37] Luke: And you saw people [Inaudible] from drinking the water and soaking?

[01:53:42] Nick: Yeah, we can share that with you. And we saw actually a 30% increase in oxygen levels in the bloodstream measured by a, um, partial pressure oxygen meter from a half an hour soak.

[01:53:53] Luke: That's epic 

[01:53:55] Nick: It's incredible. And you can actually see it, the little oxygen molecules collected on your skin in tub.

[01:54:01] Tony: Yeah. And done through, uh, like I said earlier in the conversation as well, there are quite a few people behind us from the wellness and medical community. So that was, uh, performed by Compton Rom with Ascended Health out of, uh, Salt Lake City, Utah.

[01:54:17] Luke: Wow. 

[01:54:18] Tony: Yeah. So if you haven't heard of him, he's major to--

[01:54:20] Nick: He's a great guy. 

[01:54:21] Luke: Really? 

[01:54:21] Nick: Yeah. He's a molecular biologist. 

[01:54:23] Luke: Oh, cool.

[01:54:23] Nick: Wicked smart guy.

[01:54:25] Luke: I love interviewing the super level geeks. What about for people listening that have something like a wellness clinic, biohacking spa? A lot of these places, thankfully, it's a great trend of popping up where people have things like float tanks, and ice baths, and stuff. I'm happy they exist, but bummed that you go into an ice bath place, and it might have beautiful design and decor, super high vibe, and I'm like, oh, what's the water? And they're like, it's just water. 

[01:54:58] Nick: Uh, that just water is still--

[01:55:00] Luke: Taking an icebath in tap water? You spent all this money designing and building out this space, and you got-- most of them seem to be pretty successful. I don't think I've seen any go under. It's becoming so popular. Especially for people that can't afford or don't have space for their own sauna, and ice bath, and float tank, and all this stuff, it's great, man. Every town should have, uh, a wellness center. But what about the water? Are you guys available to help business owners like that, to make all the water pristine in a commercial setting?

[01:55:33] Nick: Absolutely. Yeah. Anything that we can do residential, we can scale that up to meet the demand of a commercial setting.

[01:55:39] Tony: Yeah. We have clients that have commercial-size homes that are four-inch water feed lines that are ridiculous. You know what I mean? So that's basically a commercial space. So we can level up to that to treat that.

[01:55:51] Luke: Don't you think like any place that has ice baths, hot tubs, uh, float tanks should have pure water?

[01:55:59] Tony: At least get a carbon filter and be filling those flow tanks with a carbon filter. So you're at least removing the-- take care of the immediate surface contaminants, the chlorines and things like that. Um, but I know in California, uh, by law, they have to ,uh, a wellness space does have to maintain a specific residual of chlorine in the water,

[01:56:20] Nick: Actually, public facility. So chlorine or bromine, um, say, our whole hydrogen peroxide, uh, ozone UV wouldn't fall under that, um, but in a private setting, yes.

[01:56:34] Luke: I remember that stupid California law. God bless California, but man, they got some communist ass laws out there. You’ve been to Beverly Hot Springs in Korea town?

[01:56:46] Nick: I haven't. 

[01:56:47] Luke: Dude. All right. If you're in Southern California, in Korea town, where there's a lot of these Korean spas, where they have a hot tub, and a cold plunge, massage, and all this kind of stuff, there's a place called Beverly Hot Springs. It's on like Vermont and Beverly. And it's an actual geothermal hot spring right in the middle of freaking LA. And it's in a building that's a Korean spa, but it's just spring water.

[01:57:14] And I went there for years and years, and it's killer high mineral, super silky, amazing spring water. And then at some point, I started going there, and I smelled chlorine. And I was like, what? The water's recirculating constantly, thousands of gallons an hour. There's no way you could have bacteria or something in it because it's not the same water an hour later, 

[01:57:40] Yeah. So I went, being a little Karen that I was, complained to the front desk, and they're like, dude, we're sorry, but the LA, um, health inspectors come once a week now, and we have to put chlorine. But he also told me, he's like, if you come on Thursdays, they never come that day. And it goes through the-- it only has to be there when they show up to test it.

[01:58:00] Because the water's constantly recycling because it's just endless supply of geothermal, uh, hot water. And so he told me the days to come where it would not be present, and he was right, but I was so heartbroken. Again, back to the beginning of the conversation, not only for the people who are soaking in its health, but it's like, you guys, the water hates this. This just sucks for the water. This is beautiful, natural water just spewing forth for our health and enjoyment. So yeah. I get it. I also don't want to go and get an ear infection from soaking in someone's poop or something.

[01:58:35] Tony: Right. And the people that are delivering massive amounts of water within an infrastructure in your area are definitely lawyered up and trying to protect their ass. So they're going to put as much chlorine in that so nobody gets sick, right?

[01:58:47] Luke: Right.

[01:58:48] Tony: So it's everyone's protecting their value. So water distribution, they have a different value. Then a homeowner has value on their health and wellness. 

[01:59:00] Luke: I'm such a hippie. I'll take risk to have unsafe, but natural water, I guess. Uh, so back to the hot tub piece, uh, I love the cedar hot tubs, the brown wooden, like the Japanese soaking tub style. And that's what you guys had at your HQ. But I was on your site today, just getting caught up. And you also have one of the hot tubs that's some modern stainless tub looking fancy thing. What's up with that one?

[01:59:28] Nick: Yeah. Those are really cool. Same process, um, just a different vessel. Um, so that's one thing, um, for anybody who's listening, that we got to make sure we communicate, is that the production of the water and the vessel, they go hand in hand. So it's a very specialized marriage of both of those things. One won't work without the other. Um, so putting our whole processing equipment onto a standard, let's say, a fiberglass hot tub, it's not a plug-and-play like that. 

[01:59:54] Luke: Yeah, I got that. Because you guys, you're not a hot tub company.

[01:59:58] Nick: Exactly. 

[01:59:59] Tony: And even with the stainless steel version, I went to, uh, Colorado and worked with their team, and they helped us design a specific design that would accommodate what we do within that vessel of water. So you have your traditional-- 

[02:00:15] Nick: Diamond spas in Colorado.

[02:00:16] Tony: Yeah, diamond spas in Colorado who we worked with. 

[02:00:20] Nick: It's just a different option. Same water. Same processing power 

[02:00:23] Luke: So just aesthetic feel. Just depends what you like. 

[02:00:26] Nick: Yeah, exactly.

[02:00:26] Tony: Yeah, and in the wood, now we're offering more, I think, the Burmese teak than the Western red cedar because the harder wood doesn't pull up as often. Because there is maintenance, the wood tub. I offer a service. I go in. Even in the whole Santa Barbara area, pulping tubs. They call me, I go in, dry them out, torch them, uh, re-sand the whole inside. 

[02:00:50] Luke: Really? 

[02:00:50] Tony: Yeah, it's a whole process. So they're beautiful, but man, they're more high maintenance. 

[02:00:53] Luke: Good to know. 

[02:00:55] Tony: You're going love it.

[02:00:58] Nick: Yeah. 

[02:00:59] Luke: Cool. 

[02:00:59] Nick: It's like anything organic. You just got to show a little extra love.

[02:01:02] Luke: Yeah, I'm excited, though, that there are more companies. There's a company called, uh, Forest Cooperage, I believe they're called. I've been in talks with them. They're up in Canada, and they make these really cool, uh, Japanese hot tubs, even a two-person tub, and they're wood-fired and stuff. 

[02:01:16] Tony: Oh, cool.

[02:01:16] Luke: Super cool. Yeah. They're just really beautifully designed and look really well made. Yeah. I love the barrel saunas and all these different cedar tubs and this kind of stuff.

[02:01:26] Tony: Yeah, we've also done a cold plunge too. 

[02:01:28] Nick: We've done a couple of cold plunges.

[02:01:29] Luke: Oh, for real? 

[02:01:29] Nick: Yeah.

[02:01:30] Tony: I've done custom of cold plunges, uh, in the Western red cedar oval.

[02:01:33] Luke: Dude.

[02:01:34] Nick: That's really cool.

[02:01:36] Tony: And that's peroxide. That's hyperoxygenated.

[02:01:38] Luke: That's epic. 

[02:01:39] Tony: Everything. So it's not a small portable footprint like you would see from Plunge or Morozko. I think is-- 

[02:01:47] Luke: Morozko Forge. 

[02:01:47] Tony: Morozko Forge Yes I think there's called Odin now.

[02:01:51] Luke: Yeah. Yeah. That one looks really nice. 

[02:01:55] Tony: They look cool.

[02:01:55] Luke: Yeah. My friend James just ordered one of the Odins. Those look really--

[02:01:59] Tony: Yeah, that one looks pretty too. 

[02:02:00] Luke: Yeah, because they're cider on the outside and then stainless shell inside.

[02:02:03] Tony: Sure.

[02:02:04] Luke: They're pretty sexy.

[02:02:05] Tony: Yeah, so we'd love to, get it. I have to build them still as one offs because we haven't partnered with another company. So I can have the capacity to build them myself. They're just not as streamlined as someone who's just having that one product as their product. As you know from our conversation--

[02:02:26] Nick: We're flexible.

[02:02:27] Tony: We have many products.

[02:02:28] Luke: That's cool.

[02:02:29] Nick: Make it to the liking of the customer. And someone comes up with a great idea.

[02:02:34] Luke: I can't wait to see you guys develop that out, find a great partner that does a cold plunge and have the ultimate-- 

[02:02:40] Tony: Morozko and do the rose quartz.

[02:02:43] Luke: Dude. 

[02:02:44] Tony: I know you're only in it for three minutes, but man, let's make it even better.

[02:02:48] Luke: I'm in mine way more than three minutes. In the summer here, I'm in that thing three to five times a day. I was in there three times twice before you guys got here. When you came up here and I was like, I have to go change, I went and jumped in.

[02:03:02] Nick: Jumped in one more time. Yeah.

[02:03:03] Luke: Because it gets quite hot up here, I'll be in there one or two more times today. So what I do with mine is I went on Amazon. I found the best garden hose filter I could get, and I just turn it on very low to get that more surface time on whatever medium's in there. And then I take my, um, uh, Analemma wand and I go in there and structure the water.

[02:03:26] And it's funny, I know the Analemma wand works because I also put a lot of, um, Epsom salt, and magnesium flakes, and stuff in there just because why not? And one day, I put a whole bunch of that in there, and then it freezes it. The Morozko is cool because it actually makes ice, and then there's a heating coil on the bottom that makes the ice, uh, float up, and then you break it up. And it breaks up a lot easier if there's a bunch of magnesium and stuff in there. It's slushy rather than hard, dense-- yeah. 

[02:03:54] So anyway, I put a bunch of minerals in there, and then set it real cold so it would freeze, and then I did the stirring with the Analemma wand. And when the ice came up, it's all freakin snowflakey and different. 

[02:04:06] Tony: No kidding. It's 

[02:04:07] ice And you would know. You have done it so many times. 

[02:04:12] Luke: For years. The ice never looked like that before. I was like, God damn, this actually works.

[02:04:17] Tony: Look around, see if anybody else is seeing what I'm seeing.

[02:04:21] Luke: She's like, yeah, there's ice. Okay. I'm like, no, but look at the crystal forms. But I love this stuff. I love this. I love what you guys are doing. As you've mentioned a few times, Nick, is you can never beat nature, right? Like nature, God creation. It's the ultimate designer of all things. And then humans get in and ruin things sometimes with the best of intentions, like making water potable and clean and safe. Great. Good idea. We got to do it.

[02:04:48] But in the process, humans also really screw things up. But it's cool when humans put that same ingenuity and creativity into, okay, let's now undo the things we did to screw it up and make it at least as close as we can to the natural thing.

[02:05:02] Tony: Right. And the more we continue to screw it up, the more expensive it's going to get to make it better. So let's stop screwing it up, make it better for better decisions globally as a collective and then better water.

[02:05:19] Luke: Do you guys see a world where in, um, municipal water facilities are able to do what you do at scale using UV and other means rather than putting a bunch of chemicals in the water?

[02:05:36] Nick: Ideally, yeah, but I think it, um, that's a big ask because right now the onus is on the educated consumer to do their bits of taking care of whatever's in their little world. Um, but mainly, the municipalities, they have to do all of those chemical manipulations just to protect the water through the infrastructure.

[02:05:57] That's where the real problem lies, is our degraded infrastructure of these pipes that have just been beaten to death for years and years and years. So if you got clean water at the source and you've got a home 10 miles down the run, you've got to put chlorine in there because by the time it gets to your home, who knows what picking up in that pipe.

[02:06:14] Tony: They're trying to--

[02:06:16] Nick: They're trying to protect themselves, again, from that homeowner A, B, and C, I've gotten sick because you guys didn't do your job on that. And when the problem wasn't from their end to begin with, it might've been through the infrastructure.

[02:06:28] Tony: And they're trying to protect themselves so much that us in California receive a text from a client in Austin about a boiler alert that the city has released. We heard about it. You know what mean? They're getting texts on their phone, boiler alert, panic, screenshot, send to Nick and Tony.

[02:06:47] Nick: What do we do here? 

[02:06:48] Tony: But that's how much they're trying to protect themselves.

[02:06:51] Nick: Right. 

[02:06:51] Luke: Right. Interesting. I never--

[02:06:52] Tony: Whether it's through information or chemically.

[02:06:55] Luke: Got it.

[02:06:55] Tony: Which is far.

[02:06:56] Luke: But I didn't think about that between the two points of the municipal treatment facility. And then by the time that water gets to the house, there could be miles of pipe wherein a sewer line has burst, been punctured, that it's now going into the water line that's coming to your house, even though they might have cleaned it at the source, so they have to put a bunch of chloramine and chlorine in it so that if that happens, it arrives to your tap, uh, safe and free of pathogens.

[02:07:27] Tony: And even throughout that process, there's chlorination points where they'll re chlorinate the water, and they'll also hook up, uh, CO2 tanks to balance the pH, to adjust the pH in the water. 

[02:07:40] Luke: Oh, so it doesn't degrade. 

[02:07:41] Tony: If you're ever cruising around a city, like I know I've seen them in Santa Barbara, um, there'll be large tanks, like chain to a telephone pole or something. So sometimes they'll inject CO2 as they're testing the pH because it's, uh, too high. So they'll either lower or raise the pH. And you can adjust the pH with CO2. 

[02:08:05] Luke: Interesting. 

[02:08:06] Tony: In fact, you can even buy a pH adjustment for your pool so you're not adding either muriatic acid or soda ash to adjust the pH. You can just do it with carbon dioxide.

[02:08:15] Luke: Wow, this shit's so deep. It seems like--

[02:08:18] Nick: They're protecting the PH of a bottle of water. Blow into it with a straw, you'll see it drop.

[02:08:23] Luke: Really?

[02:08:23] Nick: Hmm. CO2 just manipulating that.

[02:08:25] Luke: Interesting. So the ultimate solution seems to be we abolish all towns and cities and just go back to hunter-gatherer status. No more indoorplumbing. No more--  

[02:08:37] Luke: I guess we can't go backwards, but sometimes I wish we could.

[02:08:41] Nick: Wearing cloths and spears.

[02:08:43] Luke: Yeah. I mean, that's the cool thing. I was mentioning, my friend, Matt, just lives off grid in the boonies and is on what I believe is probably a pristine spring. You're golden. But there's only so many of those properties around comparative to how many human beings there are here. So we've got to take matters into our own hands.

[02:09:03] Tony: Another thing I wanted to bring up, though, too, that we didn't touch on when we were talking about the UV, uh, aspect of what we do, uh, so because of the water specialists that we work with, you know, in a space that we work in, uh, so regular, uh, UV bulbs are going to become obsolete. They're already starting to become obsolete because they're mercury-based, so you're not going to be able to import export those anytime soon.

[02:09:25] So we've aligned with, uh, Omid Tahani, the inventors of the LED UV technology. So it emits the correct frequency, um, and it's not mercury-based. We're achieving it on our small systems now. Uh, and we're upgrading the home systems here soon to that. Uh, we're trying to achieve the higher flow rate, uh, processing.

[02:09:51] So like your system is a 15 gallon per minute rated system. Uh, our next level up from that is double, which is to treat 30 gallons a minute. And then we have our, uh, two inch, inch and a half plum system for larger applications, which will treat up to 80 gallons a minute, 60 to 80 gallons a minute.

[02:10:10] Luke: Wow, that's cool.

[02:10:11] Tony: Love UV sterilization and treatment. 

[02:10:13] Luke: And the LED UV bulbs probably last forever too.

[02:10:16] Tony: Yeah, and on top of that, we're putting a flow switch, so it'll only turn on the LEV when senses flow. So it'll last five years. And it's a little, shift-- 

[02:10:25] Luke: You guys are nex tlevel, dude. 

[02:10:27] Tony: Instead of a big old bulb, and you got to take it to a-- whatever.

[02:10:32] Luke: Right, Yeah. I'm so glad I walked into Erewhon and bought one of your bottles of water years ago. 

[02:10:36] Tony: We are too.

[02:10:38] Luke: I like finding people that are just next level, and you guys are next level. I appreciate that.

[02:10:44] Tony: We try to be as educated as we possibly can.

[02:10:48] Nick: And we show passionate and curious. That's all it takes is. And if you have that intent, the information just finds you, the people find you, and we're just here to distill that for people that are on that same journey, trying to find the same information. I can't claim to be a water expert, but I am passionate, and I've learned a lot through my journey and expect to learn more.

[02:11:08] Tony: And we don't stay in a room and talk about what we're going to do and how things work. We're out in the field, touching things, meeting people, interacting with water, interacting with homes, interacting with water sources, interacting with waste distribution, interacting with collecting the waste. You know what I mean? So these are things that we're learning. I've even leveled up myself from what I thought I knew before. So it's awesome. And the people we get to meet.

[02:11:35] Nick: We're able to take that and bring it back to a consumer product, and we get awesome feedback-- just that genuine, real time feedback of people saying, this has changed my lifestyle for the better. Sweet. I'm going to show up another day. Just for that. 

[02:11:47] Luke: I love that too. When people come over to podcast, I give them a nice cold Ophora water, and they look at that machine like, what is that? I'm like, just wait.

[02:11:57] Nick: Yeah.

[02:11:59] Luke: I'm like, I have some bottled and canned drinks, but I highly recommend the water. And most of the time people want the water. You guys were takers on the canned drinks today, probably because you have a bunch of the water. But yeah. It's really nice to actually be able to treat people that don't even think about their water. And then you give them some really delicious, pure water. They go, God, what is this? It's a different experience.

[02:12:24] Tony: Yeah. We got into a conversation once outside of-- I think we were talking with someone within the work environment. And they only had 45 minutes to talk, and it was a Zoom call, and the Zoom call ended up going for an hour and a half, and somebody said something about, oh, my God. I was supposed to be somewhere in an hour and a half. And I was all, that's what I love, when time stands still that you're so interested in what we're discussing that you lose all track of time. So sorry, you're going to be late, but I'm not sorry you're going to be late. You just get slowed down a little bit. 

[02:12:59] Luke: Tell me about counting coral.

[02:13:01] Nick: That's a perfect segue.

[02:13:04] Luke: And what you guys were up to with that.

[02:13:05] Nick: Um, yeah. Thank you for asking. Tony's repping their shirt right now. Um, and that speaks exactly to how we present ourselves and just build these relationships on a standalone outside of water, but water is the through line for all these cool people that we meet. All of it's facilitated by our respect for water, but this one specifically, um, gentleman name of Herbie, he's a big home builder in Malibu. 

[02:13:29] We just cold walked onto a job site, as we do often, saying, what are you doing for water treatment? Give him some water. He resonated with it. I'm coming to find out, um, his passion project is a nonprofit that rebuilds, uh, decimated coral reefs in Fiji. 

[02:13:46] Luke: Really?

[02:13:47] Nick: Yeah. Um, so as 1% for the planet members as Ophora, um, we contributed our 2022 donation directly to his cause, which started up another, uh, third project of his, which is fantastic. 

[02:14:00] Luke: Wow. 

[02:14:01] Nick: So we get lined up immediately. The coral reef decimation problem is pretty bad. 

[02:14:05] Luke: So he got a good chuck of change from you guys then. 

[02:14:07] Nick: Yeah, he did.

[02:14:08] Luke: That's cool. 

[02:14:08] Nick: And we want to continue to do that. 

[02:14:09] Luke: Because when you hear 1%, you're like, oh, what's that? But if a company's bringing in some digits--

[02:14:13] Tony: When you're on the back end, it's a good amount. We did some other small donations other local things, but that was the big kicker for us, is it was like, dude, you're already doing this, and this aligns with what we do and, you're a great guy. And we're trying to get into the build space, and he's trying to build his nonprofit and speak to that. And we just aligned right away. It was just like, dude, whatever pathways brought us here, this was supposed to happen. So it's a no brainer. We love working with you.

[02:14:42] And it was awesome that it wasn't something that he had an idea. It was another person that had an idea of what they were going to do. I was like, dude, he had already done two installation in Fiji. In fact, my screensaver is a picture of a beautiful coral reef that he sent us in a text feed. It's amazing. So he's out there educating, rebuilding.

[02:15:01] Nick: The problem is pervasive and really bad, um, and it's happening quickly. So he'll take genetically strong coral in a decimated ecosystem that's the strong one, and then plant it on these big beautiful steel sculptures, and--

[02:15:13] Luke: Really? 

[02:15:13] Nick: It grows from there. Yeah.

[02:15:15] Tony: Relocate. 

[02:15:16] Luke: So we'll put that in the show notes at lukestorey.com/waterpod. You can learn more about counting coral. That sounds like a very cool venture. 

[02:15:25] Tony: Yeah. And they take volunteers as well. So if you want to sign up and go on a trip, I think there's certain aspects of that that are funded that are paid for to the traveler, but it's, go out there and be there for what? Three weeks? However long he's going to be there. So hit him up. You can go to Fiji and go plant coral reefs.

[02:15:44] Nick: Yeah, real people doing real things 

[02:15:46] Luke: That's 

[02:15:47] Tony: Bringing to the schools in the area and helping educate them because they don't even know that it's going on. 

[02:15:53] Luke: Right. 

[02:15:54] Tony: So, yeah, wide reefs for miles. So he's out there trying to save those.

[02:16:01] Luke: Epic. Last question I have for you. Do you guys have any financing happening at Ophora?

[02:16:06] Nick: Uh, nothing solidified at the moment, but we're in discussion of fixing that whole structure because I know we've got a high price point on our systems. Um, we're not shy about that. Um, but we also know that having a financing option is attractive. 

[02:16:21] Tony: We've already started conversations with getting that in action.

[02:16:26] Luke: That would be super helpful because, obviously, it's not many people just have disposable cash laying around for something like that. Even though I would argue like, if you get to spend $3,500 on whatever, new TVs and shit in your house, you could shopping on West Elm or whatever for that sofa, like, oh, maybe get a cheaper one at IKEA and put a water system in.

[02:16:53] But yeah, I think that would be super smart. I mean, I love when companies have finance. I finance everything, furniture and shit we buy, um, depending on the interest rate and stuff. But it just feels better to pay things off over time. It hurts less. Nothing hurts as much as paying cash. Probably the smartest way to buy things, but it is nice to be able to, okay, cool. I've got a year to pay something off. So I think that's going to be a good development. 

[02:17:20] Uh, in closing, I'll remind everyone, the show notes are at lukestorey.com/waterpod. And if you guys want to check out Ophora, you can do so at ophorawater.com/luke. And we'll put all those links in the show description on your podcast app. Last question I have for you, gentlemen. I said that was the last one, but I was just tricking you. There's one last question. And this is a three-part question. You can both answer for yourself. Who have been three teachers or teachings that have influenced your life and your work that you'd like to share with us?

[02:17:52] Tony: I got to give a shout-out to my parents, uh, number one. Um, taught me to be curious, um, respect nature. Again, like I said, I grew up on a farm in Minnesota. I couldn't come inside until it was either dark or I was bleeding. So props to that. Teachings, um, I'd say travel, absolutely. Just as a blanket statement. Um, if you ever find yourself stuck, go buy a plane ticket where you're the minority and don't speak the language. Um, come back home with a different set of glasses. Um, I've done that a lot. It's helped a lot.

[02:18:32] Nick: Well, probably I would have to say first in my life would be my grandfather. I'm adopted, so he was the most fair, gentle man ever in my life, so he was a huge influence on me. Taught me just how to be a better person without all the stuff that I've even gone through. Knew that I was going to be a troublemaker when I was a little man, but he took me under his wing and showed me a better way. 

[02:18:56] So definitely that first. Um, and my kids, the two kids that I have, uh, sent me on a completely different route 17 years ago. I was thick in it. And find out you're having a child, and you change your tune, and you got to check in and do what's right and make better decisions. Yeah. So that was a big one for me-- Both my son and daughter. And, uh, I'm just going to stick with family and just be like my wife, Christina. So not only have I been a musician our entire relationship, so we've been married for a long time and dated for--

[02:19:38] Luke: She gets a lot of credit that.

[02:19:39] Nick: Yeah. And me being a Gemini and all my other things in ways, uh, yeah, just the patience and understanding from all of those different perspectives that I need to have in my life because I'm not good by myself. Those are my three things and a lot of things stem off of that which have been beneficial to me through recovery aspects, and healing, and, uh, being true to myself, and being able to speak well with other human beings.

[02:20:10] Those are building blocks, man. It's just people that know you better than you know yourself, and there to not make you feel shame about that. And there to help you. So those are the biggest, I guess, influencers in my life. That's what allowed me to understand water, and appreciate water, and get outside of myself to find value in these things outside of my ego and all that.

[02:20:34] Luke: Right on. Cool.

[02:20:36] Tony: Got my third one. Um, so yeah, we talked to a member of the recovery community as well. So that's a big influence on me, um, just all the tenants and the pillars and the way of life that you learn through that program, and the family. Um, and honestly, I think that's spring boarded me into my spiritual growth as well. Um, learning prayer and meditation as a small aspect of that whole journey, um, has really opened my eyes up to deeper level spiritual stuff. Amongst everything, it's just being a good, solid human and what that takes.

[02:21:10] Luke: Absolutely. I agree, man. Yeah. I can't wait to chat with you more about all that. Yeah. I like how, uh, so gracefully retained your anonymity too. I hear a lot of celebrities not do that. I'm like, you guys, you're not supposed to say you're in the thing. It's why it's called that. 

[02:21:33] Nick: Not about me at the end of the day. It's about everybody.

[02:21:35] Luke: Yeah. Yeah. Right on, man. Good for you. I'm glad you're here. Very few of us make it out of that fucking mess. So anyone that does, I have much respect for. So yeah, I honor your journey. Thanks, guys, for joining me today. 

[02:21:49] Tony: Can I give one more shout out? 

[02:21:51] Luke: Yeah. What is it?

[02:21:52] Tony: Just got to give credit and respect to Ken and Chris, who are our owners and founders for allowing us, when they met, to come into their space and their path and allow us the space to grow and do what we do. 

[02:22:05] Luke: I'll second that. Yeah, very cool guy. I remember meeting him in Santa Barbara, and I remember him just being so excited and proud about the technology there at the HQ. Originally, I was going to come to Santa Barbara and record this there and get a bunch of footage and stuff, because the mad scientist laboratory experience, this is next level.

[02:22:28] But I remember Ken taking me through all the different massive, I guess, maybe the estate systems, or whatever, just mind boggling attention to detail. And he was so happy to share it with me as a stranger just walking into his business. Very gracious guy and someone seriously committed to doing things the best possible. 

[02:22:48] Nick: That's labor of love.

[02:22:48] Tony: Yeah. 

[02:22:49] Luke: 100%. 

[02:22:49] Nick: We wouldn't be here if he didn't have that passion.

[02:22:52] Tony: And I know he appreciates you as you having us in for this, and wanted to say, thanks for that as well.

[02:22:58] Luke: Absolutely. 

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