[00:00:00] John: I tested myself for Lyme disease. And then I went to a specialist who tested me for a number of viruses, and he's like, you've got some of the highest viral loads I've ever seen. And this guy was a viral specialist. He says, basically, you're a soup of infection. So I started using these things but I started formulating for myself, and then I started to offer it to my patients. And it was all born. MitoZen was all born from my own needs and things that really worked.

[00:00:32] Luke: Well, you're about to get your mind blown, my podcast homies. This is Episode 470. It's called Psychedelic Journey and Jet Lag Resilience, Mega Doses Methylene Blue, and Melatonin with Dr. John Lieurance. And just trust me when I say you're going to want the show notes for this one. We offer so many valuable resources, and even some great freebies such as Dr. John's plant medicine recovery eBook, and his melatonin eBook and melatonin yogurt recipe. Some really good stuff for you guys for free. 

You're going to find all the goods and all the links mentioned here today at lukestorey.com/rejuvenation. Again, that's lukestorey.com/rejuvenation. And you'll also find that linked in the copy on your podcast app for this episode. And Dr. John's been on the show many times before, so you're also going to find links to his prior appearances in those show notes. 

For those of you new to Dr. John, well, he's a chiropractic neurologist and naturopath who practices at Advanced Rejuvenation, a multidisciplinary clinic focused on alternative and regenerative medicine. He's also successfully treated himself for chronic Lyme disease, and he treats his patients using the most cutting-edge treatments such as CVAC, 10 Pass Ozone, silver IVs, IV lasers, and hyperbaric oxygen. So we recorded this epic deep dive at Dr. John's incredible clinic in Sarasota, Florida. And much of what you're going to hear is a real-time account of all the wild-ass stuff we got into during my recent visit.

And we also cover the following topics. How John overcame both childhood learning disabilities and his chronic Lyme; how systemic infections and endotoxins create inflammation and lead to disease; testing for MARCoNS sinus infections and how to treat them; prostate infections and their linked to prostate cancer. The importance of sinus hygiene and the magic powers of Glu Disstat, his nasal spray; cutting-edge ways to minimize the damage from plant medicine and psychedelic journey; critical practices of integration post psychedelic journey; we also talk about the benefits of macro and microdosing Amanita muscaria mushrooms. And spoiler alert, I've got a great episode dedicated to that topic coming at you real soon.

 We also cover high dose methylene blue IVs to tackle Epstein-Barr, Lyme, and even HIV, and why it's essential to source pharmaceutical grade methylene blue. Don't mess around with that stuff on Amazon, guys. We also talk about how to use photobiomodulation to maximize the effects of methylene blue using his Zen spray meditation mist safely and avoiding abuse and addiction; and we break out some amazing travel protocols to smash jet lag using NAD, glutathione and melatonin; and how butyrate supports gut health and the best way to administer it. We also talk about Alyson's stem cell treatment there; VSEL therapy and laser-guided injections; the power of the red laser IV; and finally, busting the high dose magnesium IV myth.

So, as I said, we cover a lot in this conversation and I can't wait to share it with you. It's pretty amazing. And as you might know from his prior appearances, I'm also a massive fan of John's MitoZen products. I use this stuff all the time. To get some for yourself, by the way, you can use the code LUKESTOREY at lukestorey.com/mitozen and score yourself 5% off. But there's also a very important update. By the time you hear this episode, the MitoZen website will have transitioned into a PMA or private membership association. 

MitoZen's making this transition to protect your medical freedom, their free speech, and their ability to legally offer potent delivery systems that provide more benefits than oral supplementation could ever hope for. I think the way it works is this, there's going to be a one-time $10 membership fee to enter the site and purchase products. And that is a lifetime membership. It's a formality as I understand it, and it's well worth it, trust me. Again, to learn more, visit lukestorey.com/mitozen, and that code for 5% off is LUKESTOREY. 

All right. That's it. Let's get down and dirty with the latest cutting-edge healing modalities with my favorite cosmic doctor, John Lieurance. And hey, if you dig this episode, please share it with some friends. John Lieurance, what a week it's been, dude.

[00:04:52] John: Oh, yeah. It's been amazing.

[00:04:54] Luke: Oh my God. It's a whirlwind. I couldn't believe today was Monday. Candace in the front office was like, hey, happy Monday. I'm like, what? I don't even know. I'm in a different dimension here.

[00:05:05] John: Yeah.

[00:05:05] Luke: For those listening, I've spent the past week-- this following week to go, um, doing all wild treatments here at Advanced Rejuvenation, and we did, uh, a fairly recent podcast. And we'll put that in the show notes. Um, let's make the show notes, uh, lukestorey.com/rejuvenation. Let me just take a note of that so that really happens. So those that want to see some of this stuff in action because we actually recorded and shot the last video in the treatment room where I had all kinds of stuff done. But needless to say, this week has been a whirlwind. 

So we're going to talk about some of the stuff that we've done. But something that we have not really done on your prior appearances is talk about how you got here and what inspired you to become a healer, which is really what I think you are. I mean, you're Dr. John Lieurance, but to me, the way that you operate and way that you infuse spirituality and consciousness into the medical work you do, um, to me, reads healer. I think that's the energy that I pick up from you. Like most healers, uh, you probably have own healing journey to share that I'd like to, uh, inform the audience about.

[00:06:19] John: Well, one thing I'd like to point out is the word physician or doctor means teacher. I don't think any doctors or physicians really heal anything. The body has an innate intelligence. There's universal intelligence that flows through our body, through every cell that carries a universal intelligence and life force. And that life force isn't fully expressed throughout the body the way that it might be best in order to keep the body in harmony. And so I feel like my job is to just allow that life force to more fully flow through the body without being interfered with.

The majesty of the body is just baffling to me. I mean, there's so much information that you can't even wrap your head around it. So to think that you're going to make all these chemical changes and all these different things, it's insane. So it's just providing the right opportunity in removing the interference to the full expression of health that, anybody that's in the healing arts, I mean, that's really what you should aim to do.

Man, I started out in life very challenged. Um, you might be watching TV and see some commercials coming on about Camp Lejeune. And the attorneys are really pounding this right now because anybody that lived in Camp Lejeune between, I think it's 1975 and '86 or something like that-- I maybe off on those dates a little bit, but it's the worst water contamination incident in US History. And basically what they were doing is they were washing these tanks, and Camp Lejeune, it's close to the beach and there's, um--

[00:08:11] Luke: Where is this? In Hawaii?

[00:08:12] John: No. Camp Lejeune is, uh, North Carolina, I think.

[00:08:15] Luke: Oh, okay.

[00:08:16] John: Yeah, it's, uh, somewhere in North Carolina. I should know this. I mean, I grew up in Hawaii, so my geography is sometimes off.

[00:08:24] Luke: Yeah, there's Hawaii, and then there's the rest of the world.

[00:08:28] John: But they were washing with all these chemicals and they would seep through the, um, sand into the water table. And so, um, all of water that was being consumed, I mean, the water that we were bathing in was contaminated with some of the worst chemicals known to man. My mother was in utero the entire time living on Camp Lejeune, so she was drinking that water. She was bathing in it.

And then when I was born, my first two years of life, I was also being subjected to a lot of these toxins. And so they actually have a place where all the babies that died were buried, this cemetery. And it's just incredible how many babies were still born. And so I survived that, which is really a big deal, I think, in and of itself. And, um, I've always felt like I had some challenges with energy and focus. And so when I got to-- in Hawaii, it got to the point where I was four years behind in school and I had dyslexia.

I had a lot of learning disabilities, hyperactivity, tension deficit disorder. I mean, I had all the diagnoses. And then I was put all typical drugs. In fact, one them was called Theodur, which was for asthma, because I had really bad asthma. It was really lots of allergies, probably from toxicity. And Theodur is a stimulant. If you take it, it's like speed. And so I had that, but then I put on Ritalin, which is also an amphetamine, because that's what they wanted me wanted me to take when I was a kid. So I was on Theodur. I was on Ritalin, and it's like, no. It's not a surprise that I was having some many challenges with hyperactivity and just having some trouble just interacting with the other kids. And it was just really difficult for me, so much to the point that I was put in special education classes. 

And that was probably one of the most challenging things I've ever had to deal with in my life was being put into the special education classes. And it didn't go straight into in the hardcore special education classes right away. I was put into a class that was middle, but then I got kicked out of that school. And then eventually, there was nowhere else for me to go. 

And I was in a very small classroom. It was the same teacher. We would all be in the same class all day, and it was totally separated. And so I remember at recess we were let out to go play, and we were totally not like everybody else. It was very, very difficult to feel like I had any type of, uh, sense of, gosh, worth really. It was a challenge to that sense that you're so separate and you don't feel like you belong. And then it was reinforced by the interaction that I have with all other my kids because I was part of that class. I was the kid that was picked up by the short bus in the morning.

[00:11:51] Luke: Literally?

[00:11:53] John: Literally.

[00:11:53] Luke: That's a joke. And, oh, you rode the little yellow bus. 

[00:11:57] John: I know.

[00:11:58] Luke: You were on it.

[00:11:59] John: I was literally on it. And so this was most of elementary school. And so after that my parents made a decision to take me into private school, even though they weren't ready for me to get out in the public school. They said, well, we'll take him and we'll put him in, where I went to a Catholic school for a while, and that was really challenging too. I mean, I think I got kicked out of the first school that I went to, and then I was allowed to actually go back into public school at eighth grade or something like that.

It actually just years for to just adapt. But we talk about when you have challenges in life, you have the ability to step up and work through that. And if you can see things in a light of how it can make you stronger and don't let it take you over, these things can be incredibly strengthening to an individual. So for me, I would say having this idea that-- we had Jim Kwik here, we did this beautiful, um, event in this center. So for those watching, we're in my new event center that we just built in this 15,000-square foot location. And Jim Kwik has a similar story that I did.

In fact, he was referred to me to help him with some health issues. And we were just on the phone and I was telling him about my history with learning disabilities and so forth. And he's like, wow, I've got the same thing. They called him the boy with a broken brain. So Jim stepped up, I think, in a similar that I did, where you're feeling like you're not smart, and it's like you want to prove to the world that, oh, I am smart.

So that became this almost over-emphasizing journey for me to show up and be the best version of myself that I can be to prove to the world that I'm worthy, and I'm lovable. The two core wounds that I think everybody has to deal with deal with is that you're not loved or you're not enough. You're not worth. And so those core wounds were very well, uh, exposed during this process. And I didn't really have a lot of friends either, Luke. I mean, it was really, um, challenging for me to hold relationships through that process. But it's not the story for me now.

I mean, it's like now I've got some of the most amazing friends, you included. I go out to Austin and we have a lot of mutual friends. And, um, I mean, it's a real testament, I think, that if people, um, put their mind to it and just keep doing the work, and the work is really leaning into feelings that come up and not running from them. Because my understanding is that suffering doesn't create suffering, but it's the avoidance of suffering. So we get these negative emotions and these negative thoughts, and they're just thought forms. And if we can just feel them fully and just realize that they're not who you are, you're not becoming attached to that as your identity.

So my identity was all tied up into this mentally retarded kid. I mean, that's really what I felt. And so, yeah, it's been a-- I wouldn't trade it for the world. It was so tough. So as far as the healing journey, that really was a lot. I look back and I didn't realize it then because I didn't know about Camp Lejeune, but--

[00:15:43] Luke: Hold that thought for one second. As you were bringing up the Camp Lejeune thing, and I didn't even know about that, but at the time of this recording in Ohio, there has just been an absolute cluster f. I'm trying to swear less at the show for kids that--

[00:16:00] John: The train.

[00:16:02] Luke: Yeah, I mean, I don't want to be dramatic, but I think we're dealing with the chemical Chernobyl situation here. And of course the media is doing everything they can to hide it, but it's like, God, you just think about the repercussions of humanity's stupidity and corruption. It's like there's going to be probably tens of thousands of kids that go through something similar that you went through because of someone's ineptitude or lack of integrity.

[00:16:35] John: And the large corporations realized how much financial devastation that could cost their company. We could shut them down. They're not going to want to readily turn over and admit it. So a lot of these people are going to be sick and start having cancer. And I mean, that's the potential. And these people really should be, um, I mean, there should be more education on how to properly detox chemicals, heavy metals, dealing with mold, biotoxins, which I think we're going to be talking about that.

[00:17:10] Luke: Yeah, we will. I just did a recent episode with our mutual friend, uh, Dan Pompa.  We talked about his approach to detox. So people that will have heard that, which is probably a lot of people listening to this, are going to be really keen on some of the stuff that you've come up with too. So yeah, I definitely want to get into that. But I derailed you, um, no pun intended, as you were going into the second phase of health challenges and things like that that you have overcome. I love this stuff too because we've all suffered in unique ways and it's a subjective thing.

When I hear what you went through as a kid with these illnesses and the short bus, I'm like, oh man, I just feel so much compassion for you. But if I think about my own life and the shit that I went through, different set of circumstances in many ways, but brutal, uh, nonetheless, and so many feelings of worthlessness, and not being lovable, and shame, and just all of the things that any trauma, um, end up perpetuating.

And I dealt with that by doing copious amounts of drugs and eventually, thankfully, um, escaped that. But like you, I don't think I would change anything, which is difficult to say because my journey involved being abused a lot by perpetrators and truly being victimized. And, um, it's tough to look back on that and go, oh, I wouldn't have it any different. But I think it's true because, well, I know it's true actually, and I've done a lot of work around this because more and more I'm starting to actually just enjoy the person that I am. Just like, fuck, I'm actually pretty cool.

[00:18:54] John: Yeah. Right. 

[00:18:55] Luke: I don't mean cool like Mr. Cool guy, but I'm a pretty good person who's making a positive impact in my own little way. 

[00:19:03] John: Oh, you're totally making such a big impact.

[00:19:05] Luke: So it's like maybe I would've been another awesome version of myself had I not gone through all the trauma and the addictions and all that. But the fact is that's what happened. And all of that is the unique brew of life experience that led me sitting here talking to people like you and probably helping a lot of people, uh, that are going to hear the information that you share. So I like that you also frame your experiences like, hey, it is what it is. And the pressure makes the diamond.

[00:19:33] John: Yeah. Right. Strong wind makes for strong timber.

[00:19:36] Luke: Yeah. There you go. So, anyway, back to the second epoch of your, um, journey there.

[00:19:43] John: Well, I got myself incredibly healthy. I started out, um, as a chiropractor and I was mostly focused on personal injury. And it was incredibly lucrative in Florida at that time. I mean, it was like, I'm in my late 20s, early 30s making just crazy amounts of money, way more than I thought I'd ever make, and built a big house. You've stayed there. It's being remodeled right now, but, um, it was just surreal. It's like you could make a movie about it. But I wasn't happy because I was, um, playing this game with attorneys. And the attorneys really didn't want the patients to get better. They wanted them to get surgery because that increases the value of their case. And there's just so many aspect it that just didn't align with me. 

So I went into naturopathic school and, um, eventually started doing all of this testing within my clinic where we were testing people, um, with their saliva and their urine. It was just this really, really cool, um, program that I was doing that was, um, based on some training that I took. Um, and it completely transformed my practice. And I was doing bodybuilding. I think I was at the time, um, almost 200 pounds, and then, uh, zero was body weight, kite surfing. I was just like-- I mean, anybody looking-- I got pictures of me. It was like a Greek body. So everything was going amazing and then all of a sudden, I just got sick, and I didn't know what was wrong with me. And it was this incredible joint pain. 

But then I was going to the rheumatologist and I'm like, something's wrong. It was mostly in my clavicle and my ribs. And they were like, oh yeah, well, you've got some ankylosing spondylitis, which is a family of rheumatoid. And I'm like, wow, okay. Um, and so they wanted me to take medicines and anti-inflammatories and things like that. And I just wasn't okay with that. So I just kept on going to different, um, specialists. In fact, I flew to Germany. I went all over. I was like, I got to find out wrong with me.

So finally, I tested myself for Lyme disease. And then I went to a specialist who, um, tested me for a number of viruses, and he's like, you've got some of the highest viral loads I've ever seen. And this guy was a viral specialist. He says, basically, you're a soup of infection. And what's happened is the Lyme disease has shut your immune system down, and you have no defense. And so this was going on with me, literally, for 10 years. Until I found out, I'm suffering for 10 years, to the point I went from 200 pounds and I'm weighing 145 pounds. I looked emaciated. I looked like I was 60 years old. Everybody thought I was just addicted to drugs.

They thought I wasn't-- oh, even the people I was working with, my staff. And it just got to the point where-- and when you're sick like that too, you have a lot of, um, you feel hostility. You're angry. You're agitated because you're just not comfortable. So relationships aren't really going very well. And so, um, yeah, that went on for a long time. And even after I found out what was wrong with me, it was a long crawl to get out of that hole. 

And what learned from that process was what I am heavily involve with now. And I started, um, designing a lot products that were things that I needed and through, um, different, uh, suppository routes of delivery, nasal sprays, and, um,  liposomals, and nebulizing. So I started using these things but I started formulating for myself. And then I started to offer it to my patients. And, um, it was all born. MitoZen was all born from my own needs and things that really worked. The first thing that really made a difference for me was glutathione suppositories.

And I would take it before bed, and I'd wake up, and would I would lot less inflammation. And what's really cool about glutathione is it's like it serves three main purposes. One is it's an anti-inflammatory. Um, number two is it helps to detox body, so it wraps around all these chemicals and all these heavy chemical and it chaperones them out of the body. And it's also really helpful for, um, allergies. And, um, lastly, it's part of your viral immunity, very powerfully. So those were just checking all boxes for me.

And that was one of the things that if I got an IV with it, it wasn't quite of an impact as the suppository because the suppository was slow releasing over five to seven hours. And so your ability to get that into your cells made all the difference. So in reality, um, suppository delivery might actually be, in a lot of, cases better than an IV, and it's more convenient. You don't have to get a needle stick. The NAD has been just incredible as a suppository compared to the IV. Have you done the IVs?

[00:25:33] Luke: I've done a few of them. I want to get into the NAD stuff too, because one of the things-- I don't know what the title of this episode will be, but I really want to talk about travel stuff. I mean, I've talked about it on the podcast, but the past three years, because of tyranny, uh, we haven't been able to travel a lot. 

And many of us refuse to travel for a certain time when we were required to put a diaper on our faces. Um, uh, but the NAD suppositories, uh, yeah, I have been a huge part of that. And I have had the IVs, and, uh, it's very uncomfortable. I think I took it pretty well. They were like, wow, we're going really fast. You doing okay?

[00:26:12] John: It's like chest pressure. You feel off.

[00:26:16] Luke: But I also just didn't feel-- I mean, maybe that day and the following day, I felt like, wow, I have more energy. You just feel mitochondria firing on all cylinders. But I find with, um, not only the suppositories, but also with the oral, uh, liposomal one that you have, I mean, it's like any day that I'm under slept or just fatigued, that's an absolute guarantee, uh, way to get my energy back, and with flying, but we'll talk about that. 

So you start to formulate your own stuff just out of need. I like these origin stories. I mean, Dave Asprey of had a similar thing with Bulletproof, with some of the stuff that he started to roll out was because there were just novel substances that he found, and researched, and were effective and no one was really making them. And so I like that when someone just goes mad scientist and figures out what helps them. And it's like, well, this is helping me, especially with the unique delivery systems. If this is helping me, it's going to help other people. 

And having one in the back here, because for those listening, we're at the Advanced Rejuvenation center in Sarasota, but this is also the home of the MitoZen, uh, headquarters. And so hopefully, I don't want to promise this, um, and not deliver, but our intention is to go film some behind-the-scenes stuff in the little Santa's workshop back there because I don't know if it connected in my mind that you guys make everything here, and there's a bunch of elves in there making it. We go back, one woman's covered in methylene blue.

[00:27:46] John: Yeah. Well, your comment was, how do you make the methylene blue without turning blue? And I said, well, they do it. And then we walked, and one of my girls is making it, and her face is all blue, and I was like, well, they don't.

[00:28:00] Luke: She's like covered in it. But yeah, I think today's the first time I was like, oh, all these little bullets that I get and unwrap and these oral, the methylene blue, I'm like, oh, you guys are making it right here. It's really interesting. So I hope to get a little behind-the-scenes stuff. I'm just a nerd with wanting to know how things work, and where they come from, and how they're made.

Anyway, so you had this Lyme situation going on, you start megadosing the glutathione and NAD, what happened as you started to--

[00:28:28] John: Well, NAD wasn't really on the radar, neither was methylene blue, unfortunately. If I had those tools, that would've been much different. So we work with a lot of people. We have coaching plans, and we're able to utilize some of the things that we have now. And I mean, we get people turning around way quicker than I did. Sometimes within the first month people are feeling like a whole new person. So I've become incredibly interested in photobiomodulation and different types of, um, photodynamics substances in conjunction with different light sources, and, uh--

[00:29:13] Luke: Yeah, we've been doing a lot of that here. 

[00:29:14] John: Yeah. Right. 

[00:29:16] Luke: And we'll get into some of that stuff. But yeah, that is really interesting to me because let there be light. I mean, everything in our known universe is frequency, and the visible and invisible, um, spectrum of light. I mean, it's like you were talking about the human body, just infinite. You could never stop being fascinated with it. That's how light is to me, from lasers to the red light to blue light. I mean, it's just the sun.

And the sun has this spectrum, and then you have the electromagnetic spectrum of invisible light. I mean, I know very little about it because I'm definitely no master at physics, but I know how I feel in the presence of certain lights. And when you start to play with silver and methylene blue and copper and different things that have that ability to resonate with frequencies of light, it gets really cool.

[00:30:10] John: Yeah. Well, what I find fascinating is that your mitochondria, the powerhouse of the cell is where the rubber meets the road with making energy. This is where oxygen and glucose is converted into ATP, and that's through the electron transport chain. So we're moving electrons. That's what the mitochondria does. Its job is to move electrons. And the process of moving electrons, it's an exothermic, uh, reaction, which means that it releases heat. 

And the mitochondria garners that heat release and makes the ATP. That's energy. And it can use photons or electrons. So the electron transport chain actually be the photon transport chain. So photons is non-matter and electrons is matter. So it's almost got some spiritual aspects of the difference between matter and non-matter, and what happens between those two forms. This is--

[00:31:12] Luke: The particle and the wave. Quantum healing, bro.

[00:31:15] John: Yeah.

[00:31:16] Luke: Speaking of quantum healing, I thought something that was really cool that you guys do, of course, is, um, I think it was one day I was getting one of the IVs and, uh, the nurse practitioner was putting the IV in the Leela bloc before administering it. I was like, oh, that's super cool. I like that you guys are integrating all of that, these obscure technologies. 

And while I've been here, I forgot to do it with the quantum upgrade, but, uh, I did assign my FLFE account to the property while I'm here, which I always do when I travel. And I would've doubled up and put the Quantum Upgrade. I went on my computer and I was just out of it, and I couldn't figure out how to do it. But yeah, I think maximizing all energetics you're working on healing something is really fun. And even when we did um, when the VSELs, and you took my blood, and we can get into what that was, but this is going back to the spiritual element of how you work with clients is I had the vials of my blood or the--

[00:32:22] John: The VSELs.

[00:32:22] Luke: The VSELs, and you had me put it on my heart and just envision golden healing light, and really pray to that part of my body as it was going to be re administered. I love that. And then one day you put a-- I walk in the treatment room and you hang a freaking pyramid from the ceiling, and it's like, lay under that. We're doing the endonasal balloons. And I mean, I mean, it's next level. And I remember walking in the pyramid thinking, I wonder what all John's staff think, the shit that you get up to here. Are they rolling their eyes when they walk in the other room or are they down with it? Because they're all on board. 

[00:32:56] John: They're down with it. Yeah. I mean, it takes a special human to be working here. They're not anybody off the streets. These people are-- most of which they're attracted to the practice. They show up and they're people that are very, um, spiritually-based, energy-based. They've done energy healing or they're into it. So, uh, I've been really blessed that way.

[00:33:26] Luke: Yeah. Your team's great. They've all been really helpful. Yeah. And I mean, I've been, first couple days, invalid. And then Alyson got her stem cell injections in her knees, and her reaction was much stronger than any of us anticipated. She was incapacitated, and thank God we're staying here in the apartment. You have two client apartments here, which is great. Because at first we were going to stay somewhere else and that didn't work out. And I was like, oh man, we're going to stay in the apartment at the clinic? I want be on the beach or something. 

But as fate would have it, of course, you look in hindsight and go, oh my God, we would've been screwed if we were staying somewhere else. It was really nice to be able to just wheel her in a wheelchair in here. And now, of course, it's been a few days and she's doing the CVAC machine, and getting laser treatment, and doing all kinds of stuff, and she's just moving right along. 

[00:34:18] John: Yeah. And you're dialed in on that apartment. You've got the red light panels. You got the Sauna Space lights. Now you've got a-- 

[00:34:26] Luke: A bio charger.

[00:34:27] John: A bio charger. And then you've got your cold plunge just outside the door. 

[00:34:31] Luke: Yeah. See, I think you should patent, um, biohacking, uh, Airbnbs or hotels, where you're going and you don't have to change anything. Because I packed all my red light bulbs, those Bon Charge light bulbs. Someone the other day-- was it you that was telling me you met someone and they're like, oh, Luke Storey? Yeah. He talks about how he travels with his red light bulbs. I don't believe that. Was that you? I was like, uh, you want to look in my suitcase? I don't go anywhere without this. But I pulled in here and, uh, unpacked my--

[00:35:00] John: It's already done for you.

[00:35:01] Luke: You already had them. Yeah. I was like, ah, man. Anyway. 

Um, but let's jump back to, uh, we left a cliffhanger there. So when did you start seeing improvements in the Lyme and all this joint pain and stuff you were having? You talked about the glutathione really helped. What was the threshold where you felt like, oh, I'm out of the woods. I beat this thing. I'm healthy now.

[00:35:23] John: Well, I felt somewhat out of the woods for several years and then I did an internship with Frank Shallenberger. I went out to Reno, and I wanted about his method of testing mitochondria. He has this pretty, um, elaborate test that he does to actually test because it's very difficult to test it. There's not really any lab work that you can do to really get, um, an understanding of how strong or how resilient your mitochondria.

So when I went out there, um, I spent a week with him and, uh, and he took me in as a patient because they had an opening. I said, hey, would you mind? And I was having a lot of neurological problems still, a lot of memory. And, um, quite frankly, I was still not feeling well. So he put on, um, 200 milligrams of melatonin. And he even suggested I take it during the day and in the night. And my response was like, man, am I going to be able to stay awake during the day if I take it? And he says, well, 20% of the population, and I found this to be true, can tolerate melatonin during the day. 

As long as there's lights in the eye, it's the darkness that then activates the pineal melatonin. But there's this whole, um, idea of extra pineal melatonin, and what that melatonin's doing for every cell in your body. So every mitochondria produces the melatonin, and it's there to protect the cell, um, from overheating, basically, so too much oxidation. 

And what happens is the threshold that-- it's all about inflammation. So the mitochondria does not like inflammation. And so when the cytokine, the inflammation gets to a certain level, the mitochondria shut down, and the energy had to be taken out of the mitochondria into the area of the cell called the cytosol, which is about 10% as much energy as you would make otherwise.

And this is exactly what happens with cancer cells. It's called the Warburg Effect because Otto Warburg, um, was able to, um, figure this out in the 1940s. He won a Nobel Prize that Hitler didn't let him accept actually. So what I found was that for me, I still had this level of inflammation because I hadn't really, really solved the mold problem for myself. I had worked on the Lyme, um, worked on the viruses, but I was still-- now I find out that, um, my house was moldy. Yeah.

[00:37:55] Luke: Oh man. God, dude. Brutal.

[00:37:59] John: Yeah. And that's in Florida. It's just an ongoing problem.

[00:38:04] Luke: Yeah. Same in Texas. There's a lot of mold there too. I've heard, and I don't know if this is true, uh, or not, but that Texas and Florida are the two most mold prone states.

[00:38:15] John: Hmm. Yeah.

[00:38:16] Luke: Which makes sense because of the humidity in both. But I'm like, what about Louisiana? There's other humid places.

[00:38:22] John: Oh, they're moldy. Yeah. I think everybody's got to deal with that. And even if you don't have water damage into your house, the humidity needs to stay at a certain level, otherwise it grows. And so, um--

[00:38:39] Luke: Shallenberger.

[00:38:41] John: Yeah, when I went on melatonin, um, a lot of things started to get better for me. It was just dramatic. And that's when I started to, um, be inspired to write a book. And I wrote a book called Melatonin Miracle Molecule, which is almost like a bible. It's like a textbook. Worked on about three years. 

[00:39:01] Luke: And for those listening, we did an episode a couple of years ago, uh, all about melatonin. And so if you're like, oh, I want to learn more, it was a two-plus-hour chat about that. And, uh, so there's more there.

[00:39:13] John: The rabbit hole melatonin just is so amazing. Gut health, brain, immune system, um, infections. I mean, personally, I thought that melatonin should have been the answer for the pandemic, um, because they found in Canada, they did a study, and it reduces the transmission of that virus by 54%. And it reduces mortality dramatically because it's preventing that cytokine storm from shutting the energy down. 

So this whole concept that we about, where a certain level inflammation shuts down life force, it shuts down the mitochondrial function. So your immune cells have a certain capacity to fight. And so if they're fighting against something and you have too many cytokines, too much inflammation, then the immune cells shut down and then you lose the war. And this is when people find themselves in the hospital with critical, um, severe to critical, uh, infection with any virus.

So putting melatonin, this is what they gave to President Trump. I mean, it was all-- actually, you could find it pretty readily in the beginning of the pandemic. And there was a lot of hospital that put it on their website showing that this was part of their treatment plan.

[00:40:38] Luke: A high dose melatonin?

[00:40:40] John: Yeah. They were going 40, 60, sometimes a 100 milligrams. And they were even having their staff take it as a preventative. 

[00:40:49] Luke: So for people listening, and like I said, we did an episode of melatonin, but when you go to the health food store and get some melatonin pills, it's like three or four milligrams. And that might help sleep onset a little bit, but never experienced a full night's sleep from taking four milligrams of melatonin.

[00:41:06] John: Yeah. It's homeopathic.

[00:41:08] Luke: But why are people so brainwashed about melatonin and so afraid of high doses? Because I've been doing your high dose stuff for a couple of years off and on. I don't do it every night, but if I need sleep or like here when I needed to recover from my procedure, I mean, I was hammering the melatonin. And as long as I take it early enough in the night.

For me, a good time is when the sun goes down, then I take it. If I wait until 11:00 and I'm going to bed, and I'm like, oh, I'll take a bunch, 400 milligrams of melatonin, I'm definitely going to be groggy the next morning and not want to get out of bed. But if I take it early, it seems to set the circadian rhythm, which goes into the travel topic. But why are people so weird about that? 

[00:41:48] John: Well, I think what happens is that there's flawed research that comes out, and then when subsequent research comes out that proves it wrong, it's already ingrained in the culture of the medical community. Testosterone being the cause of prostate cancer is a good example. I mean, they've come out and completely debunked that. But I mean, I could tell you, this is just the focus of almost every urologist still today. They don't see the research that's come out afterwards. 

So with melatonin, that was early that was flawed that was suggesting that much lower doses are better than higher doses. Um, and so a lot lot of that just got ingrained in the culture. And then there's idea and this concept of hormones shutting down your endogenous production, where progesterone, uh, testosterone, cortisol, all these things, if you take them, you have a negative feedback loop. So the body says, oh, we've got plenty of that. Let's shut down the production, or let's shut down the receptor sites so that we're not going to overly activate the body with that particular hormone. 

Well, we don't have that negative feedback loop with melatonin. It's really interesting. It's one of the few, um, hormones that have no negative feedback, which means that no reason to not take higher doses with some concern that if I take it, then my body's going to start becoming addicted to it. I'm going to shut down own my production. And then what's going to happen after that? Or there might be this thought that there's a toxicity to melatonin, which they've done studies where they gave up to a 140,000 milligrams to an adult, and they stopped the study because there was-- the word toxicity--

[00:43:40] Luke: A 140,000?

[00:43:41] John: Yeah.

[00:43:42] Luke: And we're talking about 200 milligrams is-- what do you consider high dose? 200 to 400?

[00:43:49] John: Yeah.

[00:43:50] Luke: Okay.

[00:43:51] John: Yeah. And you I've got patients that I even have up to a gram of melatonin, and, um, and it doesn't me at all. We should probably preface this conversation with, this is not medical advice. 

[00:44:08] Luke: All my podcast episodes should be prefaced with that. At one point I was going to record a disclaimer. And you got to also say, uh, these views of the guests don't reflect The Life Stylist podcast. And there might be a monetary whatever gain by the guest or me. And it's like, well, I think everyone that listens to podcast knows that we get paid to do what we do. Hopefully, if you're been doing it long enough, takes a while, trust me. But eventually, you do. But also check with your physician.

[00:44:40] John: Yeah. Well, the problem is that most physicians are clueless. Methylene blue, they're terrified. They think that you're going to die if you take methylene blue.

[00:44:53] Luke: What is that? Fish bowl cleaner?

[00:44:55] John: Yeah. But for sure with melatonin. So the book is, I think, something that, um, can really help a lot of people navigate it. There's a lot of really good data, and there's various chapters that talk about different diseases and all the research that was done. Cancer, gut, cardiovascular. Um, I don't know if you saw this, but Dave Asprey put out this, um, video recently and he was like, oh, I just got back from the hospital. Went to the ER and melatonin gave me tachycardia. And like, it's in the research, check it out. It doesn't happen to everybody, but it happened with me.

And I'm scratching my head like heart arrhythmia and melatonin. I've never heard anything like that. And I was thinking, did I miss something? I went and I reached out to Russell Reiter, who is the foremost authority on melatonin. And I even sent him the video. And Russell's like, wow, that's really interesting. He wants to get on the phone and talk to Dave. And I think we talked it a little bit. 

[00:46:00] Luke: You mentioned that. Yeah. It's funny because I just interviewed Dave like a week ago or something, but we didn't talk about melatonin.

[00:46:05] John: Yeah. And he's like, well, there's been, I don't know how many hundreds of studies showing that melatonin is really good for arrhythmias and that he doesn't know any studies showing that it would cause an arrhythmia, so it would actually help it. It's reckless, um, information that people put out there. then people think that-- I mean, Dave's got this reputation of bringing quality biohacking information out there. So it was really sad me to see something that reckless. And so, um, Dave, if you're listen, to this podcast, uh, Russell wants get on the phone with you and talk to you about this.

[00:46:46] Luke: Next time I talk to Dave, I'll mention it to him, hey, I don't know if it was the melatonin that did that.

[00:46:51] John: Yeah. 

[00:46:52] Luke: Well, that's the thing with-- it's the studies. Show me the studies. And I mean, I remember years ago taking fish oil because it's like every health specialist and health guru in the world is saying how great fish oil is. And there's all these studies and studies and studies. Then come to find out a lot of those studies have been funded by companies that have a monetary incentive to get rid of this waste product from the fishing industry, which is-- no offense to anyone who likes fish oil, to each their own.

But based on what I know and how my body feels, uh, the PUFA isn't just fish oil, no matter how high the quality. To me, it's not something I would ever voluntarily put in my body. There's an equal number of impressive studies that say polyunsaturated fatty acids are really shitty for you and that fish oil is the worst possible thing you could take. So it's like, you can find studies that support any dogmatic perspective. 

[00:47:48] John: Well, when the study's being by somebody that's got bias, it's been well documented that it's 60 to 80% false information in there. And that's what our entire pharmaceutical industry-- they do their own research. And so they are funding the research, they're in control of the research. They bring that to the FDA, the FDA evaluates it, and they push people through, or they push these drugs through, um, and--

[00:48:18] Luke: The fox garden, the henhouse.

[00:48:20] John: Yeah. Something's wrong with that. The other thing that just blows my mind is that a government official at the FDA or anywhere in the government can own a patent on a drug or something, like Fauci, for instance. He has patents on all these HIV and these viral tests. And the patents that he has are conflicting with the decisions he's making as a government official. And so these people are making millions and millions of dollars off their patents when they're making public decisions on whether these things are going to be used by the government or just in general.

[00:49:08] Luke: Yeah. It's a very corrupt system, which is why I like doing what I do and sharing interesting people like you with the world. Because, it's like you said in the beginning, the body knows what to do. It's a matter of having the wisdom and experts around you that are truly incentivized to help your body do what it wants to and needs to do, and to educate oneself a bit about those things that are antithetical to your body's vitality.

And to try to remove those from your environment, whether it's the internal external environment, as best you can while still living a normal life. I mean, you can't avoid all toxins and EMF and blue light. Trust me, I've tried it. It's a full-time job, and makes you neurotic also, which is good for your health. 

So it's like, a little education. Avoid things when you can. I mean, I think there's certain things, seed oils, glyphosate, corn syrup, aspartame. There's some serious poisons that most people on the planet, or especially in America eat on a daily basis, um, that can be avoided without exorbitant expense or inconvenience. It's just a matter of awareness. You go to the store, you read a label like, oh, canola oil, pass. I'll get the thing with coconut oil. 

I mean, there's micro decisions that that you can make where you habituate yourself into not assaulting the body with poison. And then, like we'll talk about, there's ways to get the poison out that's unavoidable. If you live a really clean life, I mean, you could be a state to the east of Ohio, and if the trade winds go that way right now, God bless, but you're probably breathing in a bunch of this shit that just blew up on the train. So it's like, no matter where you live on the planet, there's some, um, agitation coming your way.

And so it's like, how can we not be neurotic and live in fear, but also understand things like glutathione, melatonin, NAD, all these things we're talking about, things that you can give the body to support its vitality, and then in a sane way, hopefully avoid some of the things that are the most problematic.

[00:51:19] John: Well, I think the real big lesson here is that the toxins aren't going away. They're going to increase over time. And so we have to have--

[00:51:30] Luke: What if Greta Thunberg gets rid of-- I'm just kidding. No, this drives me crazy, dude because you have this climate change shit that is so obviously fake. Because when something like the Ohio situation happens, there're nowhere to be found. No word from any of them. Not to say there aren't well-meaning people that want to the environment, but I mean, the people that have incentives of monetary gain and coercion and control of the populace. 

So I like to think that people like me and you-- I mean, you got a recycling bin out there. You're talking about how you want to make the packaging for MitoZen more green and recyclable and stuff. I mean, there's people like us that care about the planet that want to do good things, and I'm sure there's people that have made a career out of that, but there's also a lot of shysters out there using the guise of saving the environment, but what's really being done? 

So I'm airing on the side of being hopeful that there will be less toxins in the environment, but that's probably naive of me. I mean, when you just look up in the sky on any given day, they're spraying something up there, and it's probably not vitamin B.

[00:52:41] John: Well, while we're on the topic of the food chain, Luke, so we're the ones accumulating the toxins. And so having systems to detox, and I think, um, everybody should have some detox that they do on a regular basis, I think, otherwise you're just accumulating toxins. And some people have better detox pathways. There's certain genetics.

[00:53:09] Luke: I know. Yeah. Mine, it's like I found out recently, bummer.

[00:53:13] John: Yeah.

[00:53:14] Luke: I got some DNA test with, uh, what's his name? Khan Kash? We call him Khan Kashif of, I think, the DNA companies. He did a consult with me. He is like, yeah, your detox pathways are weak sauce. I was like, oh, come on. Sucks when you're aware of the toxins in the environment and try to avoid them and your body is just not great at that. But there's people like you that make cool products that I can take that assist that process.

[00:53:41] John: Well, it's the fat-soluble toxins that really get us in trouble. And where they like to settle in is in your cell membranes. And I'm sure Dan, um, spoke about that in your podcast.

[00:53:55] Luke: Yeah. He did.

[00:53:56] John: And so that's where we start to get this inflammatory response because the cell signaling is really powerful at that cell membrane. And, um, heavy metals fall into that area, and our cell membranes turn over every two years. So it's not something, and that's where a lot of the bad oils, the bad fats and the vegetable oils, they replace that phospholipid, um, membrane. And they create a situation where the membrane isn't as flexible. So your red blood cells can't move into, um, uh, capillaries. And so then you start to have a problem with delivering oxygen to the body. 

Um, so detoxing, um, uh, the cell membranes is not something that can be done in a short period of time. So a lot of practitioners will have IV protocols or protocols where they'll say, well, I'll come in and we'll do like a series of 12 IVs, chelation, and you'll be fine. Ell, not really how it works. You really have to do more of a multiple month program, especially if you've got lots of high toxins, if you've been exposed to a lot of mold. So when you get exposed to mold, those, um, mycotoxins settle in the cell membranes because they're fat-soluble.

If you've had chronic viral infections for a long time, there's biotoxins from those that then settle in, and then the chemicals. And so this becomes so burden full on the system that then you have this inflammatory reaction that then shuts down your mitochondria, which then shut down your immune system, and then you have chronic infection. So it's not really common for people to be toxic and not have infections. There's usually both in conjunction.

[00:55:50] Luke: That's interesting. That makes a lot of sense. It's the systemic nature of the body. We think about, I think, the body in this compartmentalized way, this mechanistic way where you have the immune system over here and then you have, uh, detox pathways over here. But the way you're describing, it's this synergistic system that's all working together. And when one piece of that puzzle falls out of line, then there's a cascade of all of these other issues. So you might just get exposed to a bunch of mercury because you had metal fillings in your head and you think, oh, I'll just get rid of that and we're good.

[00:56:24] John: Mm-hmm.

[00:56:25] Luke: You're not addressing the inflammation and the suppression of the immune system that allows the proliferation of these systemic infections. And it's just like, oh my God. As beautiful as the complexity of the body is, it makes it, um, difficult to care for in the modern world with all of the shit that we have going against us. Uh, I want to back up to, um, Shallenberger. Is it Shallenberger?

[00:56:49] John: Frank Shallenberger. Yeah.

[00:56:50] Luke: Shallenberger. Yeah. He's the big ozone guy. I've tried to get him on the podcast because I want to do a deep dive on ozone, and he's such an innovator in that space, but haven't been able to reach him, um, yet. But when you went and he turned you onto the higher dose melatonin, did you start working with ozone for the Lyme and the mold and stuff that you had going on too?

[00:57:09] John: Well, ozone had something that really helped me. Um, and we got into doing, um, IV Ozone way early. This was something that it was part of our practice way early on, even before I got Lyme disease. And I did find that to be really helpful. Um, and 10 Pass, we started using the 10 Pass system. Now we do called RejuvenOX, which is--

[00:57:38] Luke: That's what I've been doing. What is that? I didn't even ask. I'm just like, yeah, put it in. 

[00:57:43] John: Well, it's a process where-- so ozone is three oxygen molecules that are fused together and they're fairly fragile. So once they interact with your blood or your body tissues, it has this reaction which is very oxidative but that triggers a stress response. It's almost like your cells and--

[00:58:08] Luke: It's like hormetic stress to your cells, basically.

[00:58:10] John: Yeah. It's a hormetic response. So oxygen perfuses more readily into an alkaline environment. It doesn't like to move into acid environment as well. So we like to load up our patient's IV with a pretty hefty dose of magnesium before. And I think you've been really enjoying that because you get a benzo feeling from it. 

[00:58:37] Luke: I love it. It would be dangerous if I had that setup at home. I'd probably be doing it every day. What are we doing? 2,000?

[00:58:44] John: 2,000. Yeah. 

[00:58:45] Luke: Of magnesium chloride?

[00:58:47] John: Yeah.

[00:58:47] Luke: I sent that to a friend of mine who's a big magnesium fan and he was like, what the hell are you guys doing? You can't do that. It feels great. I don't know. Where's the research? 

[00:58:57] John: Yeah. Well, that this is another thing, everybody's terrified. So it can drop your blood pressure and so it's important to monitor the blood pressure. And if somebody has low blood pressure, then it might not be the best idea. But yeah, I've been, um, when I've been traveling, getting IVs, I've requested, and most people are terrified to give any more than a couple hundred milligrams of magnesium. 

But I was-- I think I might have mentioned this to you. Many, many years ago, I had, um, a gentleman who was researching, um, a process that he was, um, in the process of patenting, where it was a high dose of magnesium IV and then going right into a hyperbaric chamber. And what he was finding was it was turning on neurogenesis like nothing that he's seen before. And his kid had a really bad TBI, was completely dysfunctional. And so he did this process, and it was just a soft chamber as well. So it wasn't like the hard chamber even. And so they were really excited about it. 

And he brought his kid in because he heard about the work I was doing with the endonasal balloons. And it just made sense to him like, wow, if I could like open up that cranial rhythm and that ability for oxygen to move through the cerebral spinal fluid, blah, blah, blah, and then do my process. I forget what was calling it, but, um, and so he brought his kid in. We did the balloons, and it helped him quite a bit.

But that opened my eyes up to, wow, you can do a lot more magnesium and it's really not that as long as it's done in the right set and setting. So we do this high dose, it alkalizes the blood, and it also vasodilates your microcirculation. Not only are we going to have more ozone that's going to be able to get in and activate in the blood, but you're also going to have the byproduct of the oxidation of the ozone in the blood create these little lipids that become oxidized. And then those signal molecules.

And those signaling molecules then travel throughout the body. And they're incredibly, uh, beneficial because they signal the body to have opposite reaction to too much oxidation. So you have this buffering of your antioxidant systems come back. There's a gene called, um, PGC-1alpha, I don't know if you've ever heard of this before, but it's the primary gene that is activated to stimulate something called mitochondrial biogenesis. This is when we make new mitochondria. 

And so PGC-1alpha is activated with, um, heavy exertion of exercise, fasting. Um, I mean, there's certain hormetic, uh, triggers that really trigger this. And ozone's one powerful trigger. Ozone's actually also a trigger for autophagy. So we'll have a lot come in when they do some of these IVs and they'll be in a fasting state. And so you can really help to clear a lot of the, um, senescent cells, which is one of the main reasons that we fast is we want to clean up these zombie cells that create a lot of inflammation. 

Um, and then you're going to get this powerful activation for renewing your mitochondria. So the mitochondria become old and they're stagnant. So getting that signaling to say, hey, let's go and refresh mitochondria. And through mitophagy, which is like autophagy, um, we're going to cycle old, weak, dysfunctional mitochondria into fresh new ones. And so, um, I think that utilizing ozone in conjunction with fasting is a brilliant idea.

And people can do that rectally. Obviously, we do it here at the clinic, but I think that anybody listening to this that's into fasting, we have a whole fasting pro, um, kit called Fast Track Fast. Because I'm also a big fan of Senolytics. So it's a substance that activates a stronger clearing of the senescent cells. And so, um, quercetin being from blueberries and fiset in from strawberries are the two primary ones that we have in a product called Lucitol, which we have in a suppository, but we also have it in a, uh, liposomal. So taking that while you're fasting can really help.

[01:03:33] Luke: I want to ask you something. There's so many side threads here. For some reason I intuited, and maybe you mentioned this to me at some point and I just don't remember that, and I thought it was my brilliant idea, but I've used Lucitol many times, uh, during and after plant medicine, uh, journeys. And it's really helped my resilience to that. I mean, it can be pretty hard on the body. Am I imagining that? Did you tell me that or did I just--

[01:04:03] John: Well, I wrote a book, um, Neuroprotection, um, with Plant Medicine. 

[01:04:08] Luke: Right.

[01:04:08] John: And so in that that book, we talk about a lot of different substitutes of neuroprotective-- yeah. Well, so, uh, I discovered that, um, few years ago and, um, the-- so there's an immune cell brain called a microglial. And a microglial cell is like a chihuahua with a bazooka. And it's a tiny cell, but once they get active, like a little dog, if you go in, you burst into a house or something, it's like. They keep barking. The microglial don't want to quiet down. In fact, that's one of the primary ways that when people get a brain injury, like a football player gets hit in the head, or anybody gets a TBI, or if you have some toxin or infection that gets into the brain, there's an activation of microglial, and that's their way of, uh, defending.

But then they don't shut down. So quieting down glial activation has been a huge area of interest in the medical world, to find drugs that do it. But there's really nothing better than powerful polyphenols to do that like quercetin, um, the, um, as soon as you can, to start integrating it because otherwise you start to forget.

[01:05:33] Luke: Yeah, totally. And it's just like, depending on what medicine you're working with, there might be fasting involved, or if you're working with ayahuasca, it's not like you can drink a bunch of electrolytes. I mean, you pretty much-- in a traditional ceremony, at least. I mean, I've had ceremonies where I was able to you know, take some magnesium and electrolytes and stuff, which was really helpful.

But if it's a medicine that's hard on your stomach, and part of the protocol by the facilitators is fasting, dude, you can get excruciating headaches, you get super dehydrated. If you're purging, if you have, um, diarrhea, you get all dehydrated, I mean, you feel like shit by the next morning. And to me, it's worth it because I've had so much emotional healing and so many insights with these things. But it has been really helpful, for me, over the past couple years to learn different things that I can put into that, um, experience so that it's not so hard on the body.

[01:06:30] John: Well, I think driving mitochondrial, um, because the brain is the most sensitive to, um, to mitochondria. So when your energy, your life force starts to dwindle a little bit, then the brain, it can't work as efficiently. And so when you're looking to get as much out of a plant medicine experience, or if you're just doing deep meditation or whatever it is, so things like NAD, the NAD Max.

[01:07:01] Luke: I've used that, the NAD, uh, in journeys quite a bit too.

[01:07:05] John: And I realize this is going to be fairly controversial because, um, uh, I have a tendency to be fairly controversy as well. 

[01:07:13] Luke: I mean, what fun is a podcast if it's not controversial? Come on.

[01:07:17] John: But using, um, methylene blue in conjunction, at the same time.

[01:07:23] Luke: But what about the SSRI effect of, um, methylene blue but with--

[01:07:28] John: That's the controversy.

[01:07:29] Luke: But with something like peyote. I think that in one of my early peyote journeys, I was using the, um, Troscriptions troches just to be awake and alert and whatever. I mean, it's pretty arduous ceremony the way that this particular group held it. I mean, it's very regimented and there's a lot of discipline involved. Even you're not going to sleep if you feel sick or something when in ayahuasca ceremony. And dude, I think taking methylene blue made me immune to the peyote, because everyone around me is like, oh, I see my grandfather in the fire, and they're just tripping balls. And I'm sitting there like, when does this shit kick in? Give me some more.

[01:08:07] John: That's interesting. 

[01:08:09] Luke: Yeah. I really did not feel any-- I mean, I had a lot of-- the next morning, and I got a lot of benefit out of it. I mean, my relationship with Alyson is largely, uh, in existence because of those ceremonies together. And so it wasn't like I didn't get benefits, but I didn't really seem to feel the medicine in the way that other people did. And I had a sneaking suspicion that I might have given myself an immunity to the medicine using methylene blue.

[01:08:36] John: Well, there's always risk. 

[01:08:37] Luke: With mescaline in particular.

[01:08:39] John: Yeah. Well, if you get into MDA or MDMA, um, journeys, these are very serotonergic. They're really working on serotonin. And the whole idea with methylene blue is that it acts as an SSRI. So there's this concern of a serotonin storm, which can be deadly. And I actually personally have a friend that did a MDMA journey and went to the hospital, and literally was coded. And, um, and he took a lot.

So I think some individuals want to be very careful with something like, um, methylene blue in conjunction with super high doses. Um, but the whole thing with, um, serotonin storm and, and methylene blue came about by, uh, a procedure called thymectomy. So it was people that had a cancer of their thymus gland. And so they gave them very high doses. I mean, thousands of milligrams, IV. And the thymus gland is very metabolically active. So methylene blue loves to go into mitochondria. So nerves or any other tissues that are very, um, metabolically active are going to absorb and they're going to turn out and look really blue.

So they give them this IV and then they start to open up the thymus through the neck. And they could dissect it. And so they found that there was five people that were on SSRIs and they all passed. So they had serotonin storm, they lost them. So there was this big warning, oh my gosh, serotonin storm. And so, um, that went on for a while until the Mayo Clinic came and did some very deep research into it. And then they came out with a disclaimer saying, hey, there's no concern with serotonin storm with methylene blue and SSRIs unless you're getting this one procedure.

[01:10:43] Luke: Oh, interesting.

[01:10:44] John: And so then the whole country of Canada, um, removed that warning, but the FDA hasn't. And you got to wonder why. This is the thing.

[01:10:55] Luke: They don't want people having any fun.

[01:10:57] John: Well, this is the deal though, is that you have a whole population of people that are taking, um, antidepressants. Methylene blue, there was a study that they did with, it was 1,500 people with manic depression, and they were doing a study with methylene blue in conjunction with, um, with lithium.

And I think they were trying to patent it because you can't patent methylene blue, but they were like, uh, what if we combine it? some people think that the study would've even been better without the lithium, but honestly, I think lithiums are pretty good. I prescribe it. In fact, it's actually in my, um, neuroprotection guide as well.

[01:11:42] Luke: Lithium orotate?

[01:11:43] John: Uh-huh.

[01:11:44] Luke: So we're not talking about the pharmaceutical.

[01:11:45] John: Not giant doses you'd take if you were on lithium for depression. But, um, yeah, the results were incredible. And so you have this potential because methylene blue can be very, very mood uplifting. I mean, you take it, it's one of the few things that I found that really moves the needle, I think for a lot of people to feel better. Um, it increases mitochondrial function by 30%. That's huge. 

[01:12:14] Luke: Wow.

[01:12:15] John: And especially if you add light to it. We do the intravenous light with our Luma Blue IV protocol. 

[01:12:22] Luke: Yeah. Which is what I did today. And what's interesting about that too, I mean, I don't know, I feel like everything we talk about today is going to be controversial, but there are the methylene blue purists out there that are much more reserved about its application.

Um, and we're doing 300 milligrams in an IV with a red light on the IV bag. And then once it's all in my body, then we're putting a, um, a laser, basically an IV laser. So the laser's going into the vein and shining 660 nanometer red light. Um, but to most rational people, 300 milligrams of methylene blue is way too much. I mean, I see people online freaking out about that.

[01:13:12] John: Well, the window is between a half a milligram to four milligrams per kilogram of body weight. So how much do you weigh?

[01:13:19] Luke: Uh, unfortunately about 195 right now.

[01:13:21] John: Which is, uh, 80 kilograms.

[01:13:23] Luke: I got on raw milk for a few months and I was like, why am I gaining so much weight? And someone's like--

[01:13:28] John: Four times.

[01:13:28] Luke: Maybe don't drink so much raw milk.

[01:13:30] John: Four times, um, 80 is, uh, it's over 300 milligrams.

[01:13:36] Luke: Well, I mean, I feel great. No side effects or whatever. 

[01:13:40] John: But the idea there is that, um, lower doses of methylene blue can be really good for mitochondria. But when you want to get into the, um, some of the antiviral, there's a whole, um, there's other things that happen with methylene blue that can be really helpful in healing for people with the higher doses. And most of the people that we see here that have lot of chronic infection, or they have deep toxic residue.

And so you're trying to activate some of those detox pathways and, up-regulate the immune system and kill off a variety of different microbes in the body. So using the higher doses, I found really helpful. I mean, we've got cases that come in with, um, with herpes. We've got cases with HIV. We have multiple cases with Epstein-Barr, a lot of Epstein-Barr, Cytomegalovirus, HHV-6. These are all really common. And these have those three viruses, Epstein-Barr, Cytomegalovirus, and HHV-6, tend to cause a lot tendency about, brain and the ears.

And that's why we test. And as you know, we do a lot of work with inner ear, with the Soneva, and we're doing stem cell injections and series of laser treatments. And, uh, so, um, so yeah. And I think that the, uh, the use of methylene blue with improving, um, sensory, eyesight, hearing, because these are all very metabolically sensitive, uh, pathways.

[01:15:24] Luke: Interesting thing about the, um, back to the plant medicine recovery protocols that just occurred to me a few minutes ago was why it has been so useful using the suppositories in those experiences like the Lucitol and the NAD, or I don't tell anyone I'm doing that, but you can't eat stuff. Your stomach is usually really sensitive in these experiences. And as I said, and many people know, generally, you're fasting, at least that day, and you're not drinking or eating anything during. 

You'd probably get really nauseous. And it just occurred and I was like, oh, the digestive system is not having to deal with that. But the mitochondria and all of these systems in the body that are getting taxed by just the energetic load is, that's how I think about it sometimes with certain experiences. I mean, your brain is just so, um, uh, just invigorated. If you're doing 5-MeO-DMT or ayahuasca or psilocybin, I mean, your brain, I don't know what's happening with your brain waves, but it feels like your brain is--

[01:16:30] John: Well, it getting extremely excited. And so when that brain gets--

[01:16:34] Luke: There's the word I'm looking for.

[01:16:34] John: Overexcited. There's this activation to the glial cells, which we don't-- this is going to rough it up. So glial cells, they calm down, you're quenching that glial activation. And so you're actually even preventing a lot of those glial cells to get so excited. And, um, and that's what prevents, I think, a lot of the, uh, the inflammation of the brain that can occur.

[01:17:02] Luke: Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. So we're definitely going to put that book in the show notes for our psychonauts out there that want to assist their recovery because you're right, man. The integration is everything. And it is much more difficult when you're just smoked and you haven't slept much. 

[01:17:19] John: Mm-hmm. 

[01:17:20] Luke: And you're just trying to manage the physical body and the symptoms of just all that energy running through you and being sleep deprived. And if you're not all there, to be able to put the pieces together and actually have a plan, like take all the insights that you had, and actually put them to use in your life and practical application, there's a lot to be missed there just because you're like, oh, I'm trying to just manage getting through this morning. 

And sometimes in a group setting too, the sharing circle is freaking six hours. And it's like, you want to be respectful to everyone there, and there's a lot to learn from the other people's shares. I mean, I've had, I think in those peyote experiences, I don't think I-- the most powerful part of that was the next morning in literally a six-hour sharing circle with 50 there. And it's like the insights people are having are triggering things within me. And if I would've had a little more wherewithal and been able to really take that in, I would've benefited even more.

So it's an important part. And many people listening are never going to even venture into those realms but I'm all about getting the most out of those experiences, and also causing the least amount of damage and inflammation to your body in the process.

[01:18:29] John: Well, that's concern too is if people are regularly doing plant medicine, then they want to pay attention to this even more because don't want to be, um, in a situation where you're going to develop Parkinson's disease or a degenerative neurologic disease because you're just making those microglial and it's just destroying your nerves.

[01:18:51] Luke: Yeah. I don't know. For me, I have just a natural, um, governor on the frequency. It's funny, I was talking to, um, Bryant, your body worker today, and we were just talking about some different experiences we've had and he was saying, well, have you, um, have you worked with Iboga? And I just thought, well, no. It's around and there's been opportunities, and I just have not felt called. And then I thought about it and I was like, yeah.

I mean, there's opportunities to work with these medicines at least in Austin. You could be doing it every weekend. But I don't feel like it. There's no reason to. There has to be, for me, a really strong call where I just know I have to be there. I am meant to be there. And I've followed that so far for the past few years, of intentionally exploring these realms not-- 

[01:19:41] John: Well, I just introduced you to a new psychedelic today.

[01:19:45] Luke: Oh, yeah. I meant to bring that with me. Yeah.

[01:19:48] John: Amanita muscaria.

[01:19:51] Luke: Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, I had-- 

[01:19:52] John: So that's the Santa Claus. I think that Christmas was all based on that because the reindeer would eat it and, uh, it's red and with, um--

[01:20:03] Luke: It's like the emoji, the mushroom emoji, the classic red with the white spots on it. Well, what's interesting, after you gave me that, which was not how I would advise anyone listening go about these things, but I took it and then I went and read on, it's like highly poisonous. Do not eat. But obviously we're doing an extract and it's really a microdose of it. But yeah, it's really--

[01:20:23] John: Yeah. There's a toxic component that needs to be, um, decarboxylated, just like when you decarboxylate cannabis, um, which activates the THC. Um, so, um, if it's not properly, uh, decarboxylated usually with some heat, then it could be lethal. It could be very toxic. You get very sick. Um, Amanita is interesting. It's, um, it works on the GABA system, your calming system. And I was, um, I was introduced to it not too long ago. And I read on it. I'd done a lot of research and found that the body of research on Amanita for a variety of healing, uh, is quite profound. 

It enhances sleep profoundly. There's a lot of research showing that it helps with a lot of skin conditions, psoriasis and eczema. Um, it's incredibly helpful for the gut. Um, the immune system. Um, depression. There's been anxiety disorders. Um, you can take it for sleep. You can take it during the day. It's, um, it's a very manageable, um, obviously, you could take a trip dose, but we're talking about microdosing.

[01:21:43] Luke: Yeah. I wouldn't be recording a podcast if it was a macro dose.

[01:21:46] John: Yeah.

[01:21:47] Luke: Last time we recorded I was high as shit accidentally. Um, but--

[01:21:52] John: On CBG?

[01:21:53] Luke: Yeah. And well, we had just done a procedure. I had taken ketamine and nitrous oxide, and then I was like, wow, I need to get back in my body, so I too much of your CBG. What's it called? Neurodial product?

[01:22:06] John: Yeah.

[01:22:06] Luke: And yeah, I mean, I had a great time, but at the end of that interview, and we'll put that in the show notes for people that want to hear me act like a total freak.

[01:22:14] John: You were fine.

[01:22:15] Luke: No, I mean, it was fun, but at the end there was like that ego part of me that was like, ah, this is embarrassing. I don't know if I want to put this out. I was pretty out there. And even my dad listened to it and he's like, yeah, you sounded silly or whatever he said. I mean, you got a kick out of it. But that was definitely the most altered I've ever been in a recording of a podcast.

But yeah, I mean, I think there's these novel substances from nature now that are starting to proliferate and get out. I mean, thankfully, uh, for podcasts like this and other people doing this work and people like you that are open-minded and continue to research and experiment with things, and don't just get stuck in your siloed, dogmatic viewpoint of, this is what I do. This is my expertise. This is what works. I'm not going to venture out of that. 

Because like you said, the human body is, leaving aside just the mind, the brain, but even just the body is so complex. And then nature has billions of molecules out there floating around just waiting for us to figure out what the hell to do with them. And there's been humans that have figured this out probably tens of thousands of years before we were even here. 

[01:23:25] John: A lot of mushrooms are just incredibly healing. There's so many amazing mushrooms. And Amanita, as of the recording of this show is completely legal.

[01:23:36] Luke: Yeah. And you know what, uh, are you going to have a product of that at any point?

[01:23:43] John: We're working on something. Yeah. We want to make that it's super, super clean and--

[01:23:49] Luke: Super, super legal?

[01:23:50] John: Super legal. Yeah.

[01:23:51] Luke: And for those listening too, I forgot this, but I think, um, if you go to lukestorey.com/mitozen, because we have been, and we'll continue to talk about some of the stuff that you guys have, uh, there's a discount there of some kind. And I'll say it in the intro and the outro, but I want people to be able to try your stuff and get a hookup. But if at some point this particular Santa Claus mushroom microdose extract is there, that would be really interesting for people to try too. 

Um, and trying to track how I feel since I took that, I do feel very relaxed today, and I had all that methylene blue. So I feel really happy and energized, I don't know, I wish everyone listening could just come here and do what I did, and then listen to the podcast. It's like the subjective experience.

[01:24:40] John: It has the ability to-- it's like you can have all kinds of craziness happening all around you and you just stay totally centered. You don't get caught up in drama as much. And there's a lot. Sometimes, for me, it's a lot here because I have a lot of hats that I carry, and we do so many different things. And I'm going from one room where I might be assisting in a bone marrow aspiration, and then another we're doing an injection into an ear, and then I might be doing an endonasal, and then I might be doing nutritional workup or an IV, and it gets crazy. So having something like that on board sometimes really is helpful.

[01:25:20] Luke: I was wondering what your secret was, because there's a lot going on here. And you have the MitoZen manufacturing and shipping and all that stuff here in the other room outside the clinic. But I watch you in there and I'm like, dude, that's a long day, man. Especially when you're dealing with people that are sometimes very compromised and having a hard time. I mean, I haven't seen anyone come in here that's grumpy or super-- sometimes, as you said, when you're ill, you cannot be that nice.

[01:25:48] John: How was that one guy came in last week? He had Bell's Palsy. He couldn't even mo-- I mean, he looked like--

[01:25:55] Luke: Yeah. We were chatting today. He's 82. And he came in today, he was so stoked. He was talking to the nurse. He's like, look, you guys, I can smile. I can lift my eyebrows. I didn't really get a good look at him the other day when he was having the palsy thing. I guess he has shingles and that's one of the results of that. But yeah, he was stoked when he came in today. He was also in there in the methylene blue IV crew with me.

[01:26:18] John: The gold standard for Bell's Palsy is, um, prednisone and hyperbaric oxygen. So we added in, um, the methylene blue. We added Ozone IV, and we did, um, uh, photobiomodulation where we're actually lasering his facial nerve. And instead of a hyperbaric, we've got the CVAC, which really drives a lot of oxygen in there. And, um, I had, um, Bell's palsy myself in the middle of the Lyme situation. And it was really scary. I mean, you can't move half your face and you don't know if that's how you're going to be living the rest of your life.

And, um, I mean, it's really, really frightening. And so I went on prednisone and I did a lot of hyperbaric. I went into the hard chamber. I did everything, I thought. But boy, I wish I had methylene blue back then too, because it took me six weeks before I started to have some movement.

[01:27:18] Luke: He was just in here a few days ago.

[01:27:20] John: This is a week and he's--

[01:27:23] Luke: That's good for people that, uh, have buyers remorse from doing the mRNA experiment. A lot of people, one of the symptoms they've had is the Bells Palsy from that. I mean, it's like instantaneous for many people. It's been on social media. You can tell which celebrities did it because half their face is frozen. And unfortunately, people are making fun of them, which is not very compassionate. But, um--

[01:27:46] John: Well, people can utilize methylene blue without going to a clinic like this. I mean, we've got the--

[01:27:52] Luke: Oh yeah. You did. I'm so glad you mentioned that because, um, it's really frustrating when I have people on the show talking about methylene blue and then they don't actually have a product available. It happened recently with a really great product, but whatever. I understand production's difficult and whatever but, um, you we've had the guys, uh, Dr. Ted on a couple times from Troscriptions and they have the really good little troches. I can't use those anymore because of the new dental work I'm having done. I can't put methylene blue on fake teeth because it'll never come off and it'll cost me $20,000 to go have new ones put on or something. Uh, but I was stoked when you guys came out with this because not everyone can go get an IV.

[01:28:37] John: Mm-hmm. 

[01:28:38] Luke: The troches, I really love, but they're very low dose. They're really good for a nootropic thing but if you're trying to get a systemic mitochondrial, antimicrobial thing and you want a lot of it in your bloodstream and you want to integrate it with red light therapy and things like that, I personally find more effective if I have a higher dose. Um, but when you first came out with-- because you have the, um, the suppositories with the methylene blue, which are 60 milligrams is one, and the other one's what? 300?

[01:29:06] John: Mm-hmm. 

[01:29:07] Luke: I can't say about the 60 because I just jumped right to the 300 because I'm a more is more kind of guy. But I found after a while of using those, and this is just me, I'm not trying to shit on your products, I found it a little irritating to my bladder or my prostate or something. But we also found out I had a prostate infection, soit could have been partly that. So I was like, ah, I like the higher dose but that was just a little bit irritating to that part of the body. 

So now you have the Lumetol Blue little cubes that you take orally. And this is what your, uh, tech was pouring today. The woman that was covered in methylene blue. I was like, do you guys make these fucking things? These are like, for those watching on either of the videos, these are little cubes, and when you pop it out, it has a cross on it so you can cut it into four little pieces.

[01:29:53] John: Yeah. And so each, um, each, uh, a quarter of that's about 40 milligrams. So you take two of them. Usually I'll dose, uh, I'll recommend my patients to take a quarter to a half. But again, you have to figure out, uh, just through trial what works better for you. Because some people, smaller doses, they feel great. I'm like you. I sometimes even take, um, a full square. I'll take half of the square in the morning and a half before bed. But I don't that every day. 

I think that you can pulse these and you can, um, and you want to take a few days off every so often because it can build up in your system and it gets, um, packed into your mitochondria and then if it gets too much, then you start to have, um, the opposite effect where it's diminishing the energy that the mitochondria can have. And I've run into that, personally, where I taking it for a little bit too long of a time and I just felt like it wasn't really having its effect. So I took a few days off and then I started taking it again. It's like, wow, okay. Everything's turning back on. So I think every couple of weeks you might want to take a couple days often then if you have a period stress you're traveling or if you get an infection or you have, um, a certain need, um, that you want to, um, have more resilience, then it's okay to take more for a few days.

[01:31:26] Luke: So these bars, that's the word I was looking for, these little bars, um, also, and this is interesting because whenever I talk to you about the MitoZen products, you just talk about the main active ingredient, but all of them have these other trippy things in up too. And I always mean to ask you, is why do you put this other stuff in there?

So with this one, for example, most methylene blue products, I mean, a, you got to really be careful, by the way, for those that don't know with methylene blue, because if it's not pharmaceutical grade and really clean, it can be loaded with heavy metals, yeast, and mold and all kinds of weird shit. So I know you, and I know you're using--

[01:32:02] John: Well, we not only buy the pharmaceutical, but we even do our own testing. We send each batch out. We test it for heavy metals just to make sure.

[01:32:12] Luke: Oh, cool. Okay. Well, that's good to know. I just wanted people to know, don't go on Amazon and buy a bottle of methylene blue. Bad idea. Uh, because it's not regulated in that way. But you have other stuff in here like, um, my eyes aren't that great this close up, but you have like the, uh, EGCG.

[01:32:31] John: Green tea. So there's other, um, polyphenols that we put in there. So it's like a mix of photobiomodulation.

[01:32:37] Luke: The lutein, quercetin, curcumin, riboflavin. All these other things. And do those add to the, uh, photo photobiomodulation effect too?

[01:32:48] John: For sure. 

[01:32:48] Luke: They interact with light?

[01:32:50] John: Yeah.

[01:32:51] Luke: Wow. That's cool. So if I have this Lumetol Blue in my bloodstream and I'm doing my Jew of red light therapy or going in the Sauna Space sauna, and I'm getting penetrative red light in the body, that's going to enhance the effect of the methylene blue?

[01:33:07] John: Yeah. Right. So, um, it absorbs red light and it reflects the blue.

[01:33:15] Luke: Oh, interesting.

[01:33:16] John: That's why it's so so blue. It's because it's absorbing all red. And so there's four proteins in the mitochondria, and they're all named by a complex. Complex, 1, 2, 3, and 4. There's a fifth one, but the four are the primary. And that fourth is called the cytochrome c pathway. That's the complex. And cyto, cell, and chrome, light. And so this is where the light can really enhance.

And the methylene blue has a very strong up-regulation of the first three complexes. 110%. And the fourth complex, it's about 70%. So when you add the red light, it ramps that up. So it really allows blue to fully express itself. But it also, if you're looking for an antimicrobial effect, the red light in conjunction with the, uh, the methylene blue, uh, is very, very powerful.

And, um, the other thing that we didn't talk about, because we were talking about the IV protocol, um, the Luma Blue protocol, we do, um, a pretty good amount of glial silver after the magnesium. So just like with the ozone inject, um, IV where we do, um, the magnesium ahead of time, we do the same thing before the methylene blue, because we want that vasodilation, we want that, um, nutrient getting deeper into the body, into the tissues.

And so after that, we run, um, silver, because silver enhances the photobiomodulation aspect. It somehow mixes with the methylene blue and it absorbs more light, and so it's more activating. But, colloidal silver in itself is also really helpful. It's anti-inflammatory. It's uh, it's got a lot of antimicrobial properties in and of itself. So people at home could get a colloidal silver liquid and they could drink it or take it sublingual.

[01:35:17] Luke: We just did a show on it, in fact. Yeah. I went out to, uh, Utah to the Silver Biotics headquarters. I love going to the headquarters like here. You see me light up when I get backstage and like, wow, how's soup made? But yeah, dude, they have this massive facility near Salt Lake City and they have these, it looks like the inside of a winery, these huge stainless steel vats and they're just cranking out gallons and gallons of colloidal silver.

It's really interesting. Yeah, it's fun to see that stuff. So you could take Lumetol Blue orally and then also take colloidal silver orally at the same time and enhance the effect. What about getting out in the sun, getting good midday solar, noon sun, with methylene blue in your body?

[01:36:05] John: Well, that's going to going to be the best. The sun is going to admit about 51, 52% near infrared. And that's the deepest penetrating, um, frequency of light. And, um, and it literally gets down into the bones. So when you're stan-- like Joovv, and we have some red light panels too. They're LEDs, basically. And these LEDs, um, they maybe put out 12% near infrared. It's just not very much. So it's good for the skin. Um, and there's going to be some blood through the skin that's going to get activated.

It's going to absorb some of the red light. So there is benefit to those panels, but nothing like the, uh, and I know you had Brian on your show from Sauna Space. I'm a big fan of the Sauna Space. We were talking about that earlier. Once you get one of these Sauna Space saunas, you never go back.

[01:37:01] Luke: Yeah. I mean, I, uh, I'm just about to get, uh, a sunlight and sauna, an infrared sauna, and, uh, not to be too entitled, but this is just the shit I spend my money on. Some people buy Maseratis, I buy every type of sauna. And then I want to get a barrel sauna for the yard when the homies come over.

The Sauna Space sauna, I find I use the most, but it's a one-person thing, so can't sit there with your partner or friend or something. That's like I'm getting the three-person sunlight, and so I can sit there with Alyson or have someone over, because the Sauna Space, Fairday sauna is a really good self-healing meditation. You get the red light therapy and the sweat, and it's hot as shit. I have, yeah, let me see, uh, eight lights in mine.

[01:37:51] John: Okay. You got the big setup too.

[01:37:53] Luke: Well, I had a four-light thing that I would just use in my office and just sit next to. And then I got the sauna so then I ended up having an extra four-light thing, and Brian was in Austin and he came in.

[01:38:03] John: He set you up.

[01:38:05] Luke: I mean, it just melts your face off.

[01:38:06] John: Well, he set me up same and he said, you and Joe Mercola are the only two that have this set up. And it sounds like you join--

[01:38:14] Luke: Now I'm the third.

[01:38:15] John: In the club. 

[01:38:15] Luke: Yeah. But as much as I love that sauna, I want people to know it's very healing, but it's a one-person thing, and you got to--

[01:38:24] John: You can get two people in there. There can be two--

[01:38:27] Luke: I guess if you had two little, uh, stools in there you could. I just, I'm 6'2, I have to crouch down to get in there, so therefore--

[01:38:35] John: But you also don't need to be in there very long. I mean, you go in 15 minutes, you're--

[01:38:39] Luke: Yeah. I usually do 20 minutes. I do a little rotation on my stool and hit all sides of my body. But yeah, I like it because, well, with the eight lights, you really don't even need to preheat it. You get in there. I still turn on for maybe 10 or 15 minutes, and I get in, I'm sweating in probably two minutes. I'm just pouring sweat.

[01:38:56] John: Oh, for sure. 

[01:38:57] Luke: So I like that. But I just like the penetration of those bulbs he uses. You can really feel the red light effect too.

[01:39:06] John: Yeah. They put out 40, uh, 42%, I think, um, near infrared. And Brian, um, he carries our Luma Blue as well when you go store. So when he was out at the biohacking, um, deal in California with Dave Asprey's bio, handing out the methylene blue. And, um, so he's a fan of utilizing photobiomodulation with that. And I think that he and I have been able to really have a very powerful partnership with his technology and some of the things that we're doing with MitoZen, and, uh, yeah, I think he's got the best thing going. So I'd recommend anybody to go check out Sauna Space. 

[01:39:50] Luke: Yeah, I agree. I use it, uh, probably four days a week on average. I mean, I just get in there and then go jump in the ice bath. You're going to have a good day. It's guaranteed. I don't care what is going on in my life. If I get those two things in in the morning, I'm set. Um, we talked a little bit. about infections. I don't think we talked about the word endotoxins, but in going back to what we've been working on here with my ears in this, uh, tinnitus situation. One thing we discovered before was that I had this MARCoNS infection. And you said this is really common. And I think, um, and I did a decent, uh, round of a protocol you recommended.

I don't think I adhered to it as well as I should have or could have perhaps, because I retested and I still have the damn thing. But perhaps, um, for those listening, you could talk about the MARCoNS specifically as it relates to the endotoxins and what it can do when it goes systemic and starts causing inflammation and stuff. And specifically the inflammation in the ear. Because I was doing some research this morning on, um, uh, on tinnitus. I was looking at the CVAC and I just thought-- because I was trying to figure out if it was going to hurt my ears because I had to get rid of my hyperbaric chamber because it irritated my, uh, my tinnitus.

And I put that in, I put CVAC, uh, bad for tinnitus question mark into Dr. Google, and it came back with all this COVID stuff. And it thought that I was typing like CVAX or something, um, and interestingly enough, there was a bunch of shit about melatonin in there too, about the Convid thing, whatever that is. Um, but where was I going with that? Um, oh, uh, is that I saw how common it is and that, uh, people are getting tinnitus from the mRNA thing. And even on mainstream uncensored, I mean, totally censored Google, they're like, yeah, this is a problem. 

And so I'm starting to see like, yeah, tinnitus. I don't know if it's all the 5G towers or what the hell is going on, but it's like I meet people all the time that are starting to have this issue, not the least of which being myself in a really profound way, unfortunately. We're working on it. But you indicated to me that this MARCoNS infection, this, uh, this bacteria resistant infection irritates the inner ear in those, um, nerve cells in there, I think is what you said. And that that can be one of the causes. So maybe just give people a little education on that, and uh, explain how they can get tested for it. What's your protocol for treating it? Because I really need the protocol again so I can do it for real this time and try and clear it.

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[01:42:28] John: Well, this idea of, we talked about biotoxin illness earlier. We're talking about mold or chronic infections, and they secrete these, um, fat-soluble toxins, and they're called endotoxins. And, uh, they're lipopolysaccharides basically. They're fatty, um, fat-soluble toxins, and they're incredible inflammatory. And so, um, this happens with people that don't have healthy gums, and they're not taking care of their oral cavity well. And there's lots of research showing that leads to a lot of cardiovascular disease. Basically, it triggers a lot of inflammation in the body.

[01:43:11] Luke: Oh, is this like when, uh, my dentist, uh, up in Marble Falls, Dr. Natalie, he did a test on me for spirochete or something, under the gums? Thankfully, I didn't have it, but he was explaining that and he said, it can go systemic and you have it for years, and it causes all these other problems.

[01:43:27] John: Right. So there's this idea that I came up with is take care of your doorways. I call it the Ganesh protocol. So Ganesh is the Hindu god of, um, of doorways. Really. They say remover of obstacles. According to the Hindus, he sits at the doorway to the divine, and he is going to let you into the party or not. So the party is bliss. So he feeds on bliss. And if you get yourself to a state of bliss, then Ganesh would recognize that and say, yes, you can come into the party. And there's chanting, it's like ganapathi. I don't know if you've heard the-- 

[01:44:16] Luke: Ganapathi.

[01:44:17] John: Yeah. So you're going to come to the party. 

[01:44:19] Luke: He's the keeper of the layer of Nirvana.

[01:44:22] John: Uh-huh. Yeah. So, um, so I just thought that was just a beautiful story. And so, um, the Ganesh, uh, we have a Ganesh kit and, um, basically there's a, um, nasal spray called Glu Disstat, which was one of the first products that I, um, developed long, long time ago. And it's emulsified, um, essential oils.

And so MARCoNS, it's a colony of antibiotic resistant bacteria. They're really, really difficult to get rid of. And they initially got a lot of recognition within the biotoxin illness, uh, subset of people with mold. And, um, and so the idea that these bacteria produce a lot of biofilm, which is the sticky protein, and that creates a fly paper to anything in the air. 

So if you're breathing and you're-- if you're in a moldy house or if you're having allergens, if the trees are creating a lot of, um, allergens, it's going to stick to that mucusy or that biofilm, and then that's going to act as a carrier to pull it into your bloodstream. So those endotoxins will then enter your bloodstream. 

So by taking care of your nasal passage, you are, um, greatly diminishing that biofilm. It's not sticky, so things don't get carried into your bloodstream. But when you have this infection, uh, with MARCoNS, you think about this outgassing of these endotoxins. And if ask any cocaine user, it's like, what's the quickest route to your brain, is through your nose. So you have high potential of activating a lot of, um, inflammation to the brain. and then there's a connection with the nasal passage through the eustachian tubes. And so there's a direct route that can get to the ears.

And so you have this potential of having not only neuroinflammation, which oftentimes can trigger tinnitus, but also this, um, so a lot of people brain fog. We started testing MARCoNS, um, a number of years ago, and I am shocked how many people come back positive. I would say a good 70% of the cases. 

[01:46:50] Luke: If someone like me wanted to test for it, I mean, I think I just emailed Candace at your front office and paid a couple hundred bucks. I don't think my insurance covered it. And you do a little PCR swab, which made me really nervous because I've never done those PCR things. I don't want nanobots crawling in my fucking brain, but I rinsed it all out with saline afterward to make sure there was no nanobots, 

[01:47:13] John: Well, this is just a cotton swab there's nothing on it.

[01:47:18] Luke: That's going to put little, uh, chips in your blood or something. I'm super paranoid. 

[01:47:24] John: Maybe we could offer a special to the listeners is they want to get tested.

[01:47:27] Luke: Is it something that people have to come in and be a patient of yours? That's what I'm asking. Or can they just call you guys and say, hey, I want the MARCoNS test? Ship it over.

[01:47:35] John: Why don't we set up a special link for people, um, to be able to order the MARCoNS and we'll do some special pricing for people.

[01:47:44] Luke: Okay. Cool. I'm going to put that in my notes. Uh, because I got to hold you to this stuff. Not that you won't honor it, but we will both forget and just be stoners. And just taking our CBG, and then like, oh yeah, what did we say? Because I've, mentioned things in podcasts and then I get emails from people. They're like, dude, you said the thing and it's not there. So I really want to hold too to my word and yours.

[01:48:07] John: Well, you don't have to have sinus complaints to, um, necessarily have MARCoNS

[01:48:12] Luke: Well, that's what's interesting, dude, because I used to have chronic sinus infections forever. Especially when I was a vegetarian for some reason. I don't know, my immune system was bad or whatever. So I doing the Neti pot and clean up my diet and stuff and then I don't have perceivable sinus infections anymore. And using ozone has helped a lot, in the ears and even sometimes up the nose. Um, so that's what pissed me off about getting a result on that. Because I'm like, what? I thought I cured myself of sinus infections because I didn't have any symptoms. There's no discharge or clogged nose or anything like that.

[01:48:44] John: Well, I think it's an ongoing process too for most people. It's not like-- so we have a 30-day sinus protocol which by the way, we'd be happy to put that in your show notes if you wanted to share our particular protocol. But it's 30 days and it depends on if I find people have a lot of upper respiratory, if it's in their lungs or it's really deeply in the sinuses. So you have the nasal passage, but then you have the sinuses, which there's little tubes that go up into the frontal and the maxillary sinuses. So um, misting those areas with, um, we call it a diffuser. That's, uh, nebulizing. So basically it takes, um, the liquid and puts into a fine mist.

So, um, most cases they do the nasal spray five times a day. And then I like to have them put, um, iodine, and you can put a little bit of colloidal silver. And you can even take some of the Glu Disstat nasal spray and pour that into your Neti pot. And so you want to do that twice a day in the morning and at the afternoon, do the sprays. And then if it's deep, um, which I think is what we're going to do with you, is we're going to add in the nebulizing, um, to really get that deep in there.

And so a lot of times they have lung issues as well, and that can be really helpful when you, um, when you have something in a mist, that way you can get an antimicrobial deep into the lungs. It can really be a lot more helpful. So when you take antibiotics, it goes into your bloodstream, but these bacteria rest on the surface of your membranes, And so in your lungs there's pockets and it's on the surface of the lung tissue or in the nasal passage. And the sinuses, it's like stuck in that biofilm. And there's really nothing better than essential oils. This has been highly looked at and studied with how essential oils can really break up biofilm. And then, oregano, sage, clove, um, bay leaf, um, we have NAC in there. We have, um, colloidal silver and glutathione. And so it's quite a, mix for--

[01:51:02] Luke: And, you also had, um, I ordered from you guys MARCoNS A spray, and MARCoNS B. And I noticed in one of them, I forget which one, it had EDTA and I was assuming that was to help break up the biofilms 

[01:51:15] John: EDTA is fantastic to break up biofilms. Yeah. So that's another process that we use as well. And, um, they're really two different protocols. Those can be fed into the standard protocol and I think, um, the MARCoNS A and B is basically you have a probiotic that you use one day and then the next day you're going to use the EDTA with the colloidal silver, uh, Klinghardt, basically, uh, was working with that similar protocol.

So we developed some products surrounding that Klinghardt protocol. And we use that as well. I think they're both powerful. Um, I tend to lean towards the Glu Disstat, just because it's one product with my personal cases. And that seems to be clearing, although it didn't clear yours, which is unusual. But we have hundreds and hundreds of pre and post tests where it clears with this 30-day protocol.

[01:52:16] Luke: That's encouraging because I feel like I followed it well and even added some of my own stuff. I got an industrial size nebulizer because I find the little handheld ones, I always just wear them out too quick. And some days I was putting pure copper hydrosol in there because that's really antimicrobial and somedays silver and methylene blue. I was even putting in there, turning my nose blue. I mean, I was trying all kinds of stuff even above and beyond. But truthfully, I don't think I was doing it five times a day.

[01:52:46] John: Well, the methylene blue in the nose is pretty harsh. That was painful.

[01:52:51] Luke: It also made the, uh, it made the, uh, nebulizer too foamy. Yeah. It just doesn't seem to nebulize well, but I'm like, I'll try anything to get rid of this thing. I can't stand taking any test and getting a positive. I just don't want any positive. Like when we did the prostate testing too, which is something we could talk about, and we retested and I--

[01:53:15] John: Totally cleared it.

[01:53:17] Luke: Did the ozone injections here, and then the TRT with you. And we did a number of things.

 So the MARCoNS thing, that's encouraging that you've run so many people through your protocol and they've then tested, uh, and been cleared of it. As I said, I love to see positive, do a thing, then negative. That just feels really good and, um, we were able to accomplish that with the prostate. Can you talk a bit about, this won't apply to our female listeners, but can you talk about these, um, chronic prostate infections that are quite more common than people realize too?

[01:53:50] John: Well, the prostate is like a, um, a separate contained area. And so the immune system has a hard time getting to it. It's like the sponge that's just isolated and um, it's close to the genital, urinary tract area. So it can become infected with a variety of different, um, different microbes. And so what we do is a semen test. And so we have people collect a semen sample and then we send it out to the lab. And we found just about a 100% of the tests that we do have some level of infection.

[01:54:27] Luke: Really? Oh wow I thought I was just a dirty bastard.

[01:54:30] John: Yeah, well you are.

[01:54:33] Luke: That's what I thought. I was like, I don't know if I want to know how this got there, but it did. 

[01:54:38] John: Yeah. So we get these, and then the infections just don't go away. They just sit there and they have this ability to just grow and proliferate into this isolated area. And, um, and then what that does is it leads to this, um, benign prosthetic hypertrophy which is normal. I mean, it's the norm for men once they get to a certain age that their prostate swells and becomes inflamed. And then prostate cancer is extremely prevalent. I mean, this is something that, I mean, I can't tell you how many people I've treated or had come in that have had prostate cancer or, um, the surgeries are quite, um, quite a bummer because a lot of times people never urinate properly afterwards. They can't have sex or maintain an erection. But this is the standard of care. 

So, um, so to treat this at its core, which is that it's an infection, makes a lot of sense. And so we do direct ozone injection. This was something that I learned from Frank Schallenberger. And, um, we're even, um, doing some ultrasound guided where we're looking at the different microbes, and we're matching the, uh, antibiotic and injecting a little bit of the antibiotic to round the capsule of the prostate. And then we're having people use, um, different suppositories, particularly the methylene. I like the methylene blue. We have a, um, we have a red light probe that we call the MitoWand

[01:56:23] Luke: Are you serious? I'm glad you didn't ask me to use that. I cleared it. 

[01:56:28] John: Yeah. So we can methylene blue. You can even take it orally. And then it's a wand. It's really good for, um, vaginal wall, um, atrophy as well as, um, different infections of the vagina, this particular wand. It's on our website. It's a MitoWand, and it gives both blue and red light. And so, yeah. So we have some pretty amazing protocols for prostate. And we've seen some, like with you, you had frequent urination. I mean, you had some very specific, uh, symptoms that are no longer there, so everything really fits.

[01:57:03] Luke: Yeah. I felt like I was an old man. It seemed to just hit out of nowhere too. I mean, over the course of a month, I was like, uh, why can't I hold a pee in. What is happening here? This is very concerning.

[01:57:17] John: Yeah. So anybody, that might be interested in something like this, um, we can send the kit. They can get their semen tests, um, just like the MARCoNS. We can send the kit out, you collect the sample, send it to the lab, and if it's something that, um, that shows up and it sounds like it's, um, uh, something that would be necessary in that state, usually people fly in for one or two weeks. Um, they get, uh, a series of these injections. And then we have the rest of the protocol is things that they do at home, and very high success rate with that.

[01:57:52] Luke: Yeah. I was stoked. Um, I, got to say the, um, the ozone injection through the perineum was an interesting experience. Not one that I would recommend unless you really want to get rid of that infection. As I recall, I think I was hitting the, uh, the nitrous a bit to just get-- it's more of a mental thing. I mean, frankly it wasn't that painful, but it's just such a sensitive part of the body and one where you're not used to a really long hypodermic needle going into. It was a-- every time come here, I'm just like, okay, what are we going to get into this time?

[01:58:25] John: Most people really tolerate that really well. And I think some people just don't like needles so much, and it's like it's a psychological thing.

[01:58:35] Luke: Yeah. And then we went in from the top too, uh, over the, pelvic bone to get in there, uh, at the same time. But whatever. It's all said and done. Water into the bridge. It worked. Like I said, there's nothing better than getting a test back and be like, ha, ha, we got it. Uh, but we're going 

on, uh, we got a couple of of hours in here, and I wanted to talk about travel.

As I said earlier, many people over the past three years did much less travel, and now, thankfully, things are starting to open up a little bit. And, um, this is something I've talked about a lot over the years on the podcast because for whatever reason, the way that I'm made up, uh, air travel specifically, and really even road trips, I mean, just a long time in a car, I just get smoked and I've tried so many different things.

Grounding to the metal thing on the plane. I mean, every supplement in the world you could possibly take to help with oxidative stress. Wearing all my EMF shit. I mean, I go on there looking like serious tinfoil hat guy. And I've tried everything to get off the plane and feel like I could go eat and just be normal, which is when I travel with Alyson, we land after a long flight, she's like, cool, let's go hang out. I'm like, what? I got to go to bed. I am smoked. I mean, just irritable, brain fog. It's hard to get a Uber, the whole thing, renting a car. I just get smoked.

[01:59:56] John: Yeah.

[01:59:57] Luke: The only thing, I mean, all the little things I've done help, I'll be honest. I mean, every little input has helped, but nothing, and I'm not just saying this because you're here, nothing has helped more than the MitoZen stuff. Um, the Lucitol, the NAD, 100%. For sure. Like I said, anytime I'm fatigued for any reason, the NAD suppositories, uh, are a game changer. But also the CBG, the cannabis extract one, the Neurodial, and the glutathione. Now people are probably wondering, how do you--

[02:00:28] John: How many can you fit? Have you seen?

[02:00:31] Luke: Well, I had to create-- this is probably tmi for many people, sorry if you have a queasy stomach after this. But the interesting thing about the, uh, the rectal delivery is it's really important to make sure one is fully evacuated before you put them in. I made the mistake, uh, a very expensive mistake on a few occasions of before leaving for the airport thinking that I had done my business and put a couple in.

And those aren't always at the same time, by the way, to be fair. Sometimes it's when I land or whatever. But I made the mistake of putting them in, then get to the airport and you're about to board and it's like, I got to go to the bathroom and you just wasted 20 bucks or whatever. So yeah, now I take a-- I know I'm crazy, but I like to feel good when I travel, so I'll take a little cold pack, a little ice pack in one of those silver Mylar, the bags you guys ship in. And I put that in my stuff and I go through TSA. They always stop me. What the hell is all this shit? I tell them it's medication, leave me alone. They let me through, and then once I feel like I'm really for sure empty and ready to go on the plane, then I go in the bathroom and, do all my things, which is, as I said--

[02:01:36] John: That's way to go. 

[02:01:37] Luke: Sorry for the information.

[02:01:38] John: Or you could do it while you're waiting. You get to the departure gate and then you set your stuff down, usually what I do, and then I'll go to the bathroom.

[02:01:48] Luke: Yeah, that's what I do because I always put my-- 

[02:01:49] John: And then you board the plane 

[02:01:50] Luke: I put my compression shirt and all shit on, so it's-- but anyway, uh, the grotesque element aside, if I do a couple of those, I would say the NAD and the glutathione, if I had a big two, I feel way, way better when I land, and just more energy. I just feel less tweaked. So why, is that?

[02:02:13] John: Well, I, had um, I travel a lot because my family still lives in Hawaii and, um, I was literally going three or four times a year to Hawaii.

[02:02:24] Luke: Florida to Hawaii, that's no walk in the park.

[02:02:27] John: Yeah. It's, brutal. And the time change. And so, um, I had just-- I mean, I'm a biohacker from-- I mean, I look at the biohacking community and the biohacking movement, but we were doing this way longer. The chiropractors and naturopaths were the original biohackers for so long

[02:02:50] Luke: Well, it didn't used to have a name. That's the thing. Now it has a name.

[02:02:53] John: It makes it sexy. And it's not a tree hugger granola. It's like, okay, you're a biohacker.

[02:02:59] Luke: You were just a health nut, back in the day. I think that's what they used to call me. But I was the guy that would be up all night doing drugs and then go get my green juice in the morning. My friends are like, why do you bother? I'm like, I'm hedging my bets.

[02:03:11] John: Yeah. So I started to, um, I started to work with things and I would-- like the Glu Disstat nasal spray I think is really a good tool to have when you're traveling. 

[02:03:24] Luke: Ooh, yeah. For all the creepy crawlies flying around in the air on the plane.

[02:03:29] John: Yeah. And then, um, the other thing that I know you and I were talking about that I don't know that you're utilizing, but the, um, the Boca Zen.

[02:03:39] Luke: Ah, yeah.

[02:03:40] John: Have you tried the new formula?

[02:03:42] Luke: No, I think I got a prototype of that because it had a handwritten label.

[02:03:46] John: Okay. So we upgraded it. It's got moringa, fennel, um, ginger oil, red thyme, and, um, and it's got cinnamon in it. It's got oregano, clove, and it's got an oil-based Stevia. And man, it's become one of our best selling products. It's incredible. Um, but so what I--

[02:04:11] Luke: And this is a oral essential oil mix for those. You swish it around. 

[02:04:16] John: We're going to go do it right after this because you're to be like-- 

[02:04:19] Luke: Okay. Cool.

[02:04:19] John: But the original formula--

[02:04:21] Luke: I wish you had some of that. I have a bunch of your stuff right here. I'm like, I would do that right now.

[02:04:24] John: Yeah, totally. Um, but it used to heavy clove and oregano, and so it was just really, really spicy. But this one, it's spicy, but it's just got this really complex flavor. It's really just-- it came together really nicely. So what I do is I have the Glu Disstat nasal spray, and I have the Boca Zen in my car, but I also travel with it. We're talking about traveling. Every day I have one of those, um, toothpicks, has little bristles. Those special little toothpicks. And so I take a dropperful in my mouth. I take my tongue, I rub it all around my gums, and then I push it between my teeth. And, um, and that's how I really keep my gums super healthy. And then I take a couple of sprays of the Glu Disstat in my nose. I do that every day. So then we're talking about Ganesh protocol.

[02:05:19] Luke: Yeah. The doorways. Yeah.

[02:05:20] John: The doorways. So then the last doorway is the colon. And so here got the ProBio Max, um, which is butyrate and, uh, and probiotics, the suppository. But we've got this yogurt, we call Probiozen yogurt. This is another recipe I think we're going to have to add to the show notes.

[02:05:41] Luke: I'm going to write it down. Don't promise it if you're not going to deliver. Okay. I'm going to put the yogurt recipe. Well, let's get back to that because I want to do the travel thing. I want to--

[02:05:51] John: Yeah. Let's finish up--

[02:05:52] Luke: And then we'll get-- because I want to talk about the ProBio Max and the, uh, butyrate stuff because that's really cool too. So for me,, it's the NAD and the glutathione. And then you're talking about adding the Boca Zen, to get your mouth-- the, um, the Glu Disstat spray. But there's another piece of the travel that's really critical when we're talking about time zones. Because some of the-- Cookie, she really is into you again. You know what that knock was? Uh, Alyson texted me, she was trying to get in to feed Cookie because it's an hour past her dinnertime, but she'll be all right. The show must go on cookie. Hang tight, honey. I'll give you some raw hamburger, grass-fed, grass-finished in just a few minutes.

Um, but another piece, okay, so part of is just the oxidative stress. All the EMFs, just the mental stress of travel, all the fucking loud speakers and crowds, and you're just in muggle vial of traveling. It's just muggles. There's so many zombies around, and TSA and it's just

[02:06:52] John: It's stressful.

[02:06:53] Luke: Yeah.

[02:06:54] John: Making it to your flight, checking in bags, all this hustle and bustle.

[02:06:59] Luke: Trying to avoid the uh, the 5G spinner, uh, the millimeter wave scanner. Always like, which line can I get in so I don't have to go through that. 

[02:07:08] John: Yeah. And just on the plane, the EMFs.

[02:07:10] Luke: Yeah.

[02:07:12] John: And then you have the air quality, is not great. 

[02:07:15] Luke: But the thing I wanted to add in here, because that's just travel fatigue. To me, there's another distinction which is jet lag, when you're changing time zones. What I've noticed with that is not only like, oh, you're sleepy at weird times and awake at weird times, but also it wrecks my gut when I travel and I intuit that my biome is like, where are we in space and time? And they get very confused. So for that, your high dose melatonin, bro. 

There's an oral one too for people that don't like putting things in their-- I can't whistle anymore with my new teeth. There we go. Uh, but this, I actually use the oral version, SandMan, much more than the suppositories. And this is easier to travel with. But dude, I swear to God, if you are changing zones and you want to trick your body into being in the new time zone, there is nothing that does it like this. Because if you and you want it to be the bedtime, even though it's not bedtime, especially if you're going around the world, you pound a capful of this, you're done. 

[02:08:21] John: Ben Greenfield's a huge fan as well. And, um, every time he's ready to take a trip, I get a text, hey, man--

[02:08:30] Luke: Yeah. SandMan.

[02:08:31] John: This week, can you send me some-- 

[02:08:33] Luke: If he's on vip, I got to put an order in, man. I got to step my game up.

[02:08:38] John: Oh man. Yeah. So he calls it the melatonin sledgehammer, and so he-- I was telling him about the travel aspect of-- so yeah. The high dose melatonin is really brilliant when you're traveling because if you think about the problems associated with travel-- and this is where I started to sit down and think, okay, how can I solve some of the primary challenges with travel? One is we don't want to get sick. It's primary where we're going to get sick. Mouth, nasal. You got the essential oils for the mouth. You have the, um, essential oils and, uh, the other, colloidal silver and the glutathione for the nasal passage.

And then, um, when you're traveling, the stresses from the actual plane flight can be over excitatory, just like with the plant medicine, the whole story that we talked about there. So a way to buffer that stress neurogically so we're not depleting ourselves. And then when we get to our destination, we have a strange bed, different time zone. If you can just get a deep sleep that first night, you wake up-- you go to Italy or wherever you're going to go. I go to Hawaii. I wake up-- if I can go to bed and I can get a deep sleep, I wake up and I'm totally reset first day.

[02:10:06] Luke: Yeah. That's been my experience too, which that in and of itself is a massive game changer. I mean, I haven't traveled internationally in a while, especially in the past three years, but as I said, I don't really have to change time zones to get wrecked by flying. It's just like I could fly-- I used to fly up and down California and I would still get wrecked. I was testing to see, well, is it time zones? Because if I flew from LA to New York, I would get wrecked, or if I flew back and forth. But then I tested, I'm like, oh, if I fly to Washington or Northern California. And just getting on and off a plane seems to wreck me. But if you had a time zone in there too, I'm toast. I mean, it used to be two or three days it would take me to recover

[02:10:49] John: Should we have a Zen moment?

[02:10:51] Luke: Yeah. I need a paper towel if we're going to do that. When you're take-- you got-- okay. Give me half of that. Okay, so I'm going to get real right here. John makes this stuff called, um, what's it called? The Zen spray?

[02:11:06] John: Yeah.

[02:11:07] Luke: Yeah. And this is, uh, essential oils and also an extract of, uh--

[02:11:12] John: Hape.

[02:11:13] Luke: Of Hape. So it's got nicotine, essentially. Well it's got tobacco, but it's in a liquid form, so it doesn't-- sniffing Hape has its own challenges. Um, now, I love this stuff, but the last time I tried to quit nicotine, I didn't try, I did. And I made it a couple of days without my little Lucy pouches. Because I just like God, I just don't want to be-- I feel like I'm addicted to something. I don't like that. And this is a whole story I covered on past episodes so people can listen to my New Year's show with Alyson. And I came clean about all my issues with nicotine.

But anyway, I quit the nicotine gum and then I came home and I had a Zen spray in the, um, drawer, which I didn't use all the time. A couple of days a week I take a couple sprays, and it's really strong, especially the VIP one. I mean, it knocks you on your ass. So it's not something I thought I would become habituated to, but I have such an addictive personality that I started using that shit. And then I'm like calling your office ordering 10 bottles at a time. And that was not healthy, I don't I think, for even a normal person. So I just want to give the disclaimer, if you have an addictive personality or nicotine has been a challenging relationship for you, be mindful with this stuff. I just have to say that. 

[02:12:27] John: I totally agree.

[02:12:28] Luke: Because it's-- 

[02:12:29] John: And the utility is incredible with, um, it activates vagus nerve. So there's this really calming effect. It burns when you first spray it. There's a strong burn.

[02:12:44] Luke: I like that burn.

[02:12:45] John: Well, that's part of a how it works is that burn. And the thing happens with the, uh, with the Boca Zen. There's a burn. And that burn activates the, um, because the trigeminal nerve, which is in your brainstem, it's the biggest, um, uh, pool of neurons in the brainstem. And so it spills over into the vagus. And so there's something called the dive reflex as well, where if you go into ice water and you get ice on the bridge of your nose, it activates your vagus nerve, which just shuts down and calms you, slows your heart rate. So it would keep you safe from dying if you got into cold water where you're not going to too much oxygen. 

[02:13:28] Luke: I do that every morning. That's how I finish the ice bath. I'm like, oh, I don't want to do it. Take a big breath and hold my face in there in the ice. Yeah. It's strangely calming. You think it would make you have a panic attack, but it actually really is sedative.

[02:13:44] John: Yeah. So the Hape works like that. And for me, I couldn't really tolerate regular Hape. It was just way too painful and my nose was just inflamed. Um, and so, um, I just to play around with, uh, using it in a nasal spray, and that's how Zen was born. And, um, it's used a lot in ceremony really. It's not meant for somebody to do--

[02:14:12] Luke: Like I was, totally abusing it.

[02:14:14] John: Yeah. It's not meant to do-- 

[02:14:15] Luke: All day, every day I'm sitting at the computer doing email. It's just like.

[02:14:19] John: Yeah. But if you've got writer's block and you're in front of the computer all day and you just want to change your state a little bit, I think it could be really powerful there if you're-- a lot of people use it as an entry into meditation or breath work. It's really good with breath work. If you do wim hof type of breathing or hollow tropic breathing, you get into that breath and then you do a spray, and then you do your breath hold, um, boy, it can really activate some deep, deep, um, parasympathetic, calming vagal. 

[02:14:56] Luke: Yeah, I agree. Very, very useful for that. I wanted to add the disclaimer because if there's anyone like me that can overdo things, just be mindful. But it does have a really incredible effect, I think, if you have the discipline to use it as intended, which is the way you're describing. So let's do it.

[02:15:14] John: Let's do it. Here we go.

[02:15:15] Luke: Today I had a little blast before it recorded. That was the first time I've used it in, I don't know, three months or something, because I was just like, I have to stop. I'm not having a healthy relationship with this. 

[02:15:25] John: Well, you don't want to inhale it. 

[02:15:28] Luke: No, definitely not.

[02:15:29] John: You spray it and sniff in. So you are going to do a spray, um, and then after, I don't know, 15, 20 seconds, I like to blow my nose. And then the effect kicks in, and it lasts for about 30 minutes or so.

[02:15:49] Luke: Yeah. It's nice. I like doing it before a podcast. Like you said, it's a reset. Your brain gets stuck in this, uh, habitual state of whatever you're doing that day. You mentioned writer's block. So before a podcast, I'm usually run around getting everything set up, getting my notes, and I'm a little bit anxious. And so I've liked it in those situations. Just go, okay, hold up, let me get centered. And I put it on my chest and just, it's like, oh, okay, we're in a new day.

[02:16:19] John: Mm-hmm. 

[02:16:20] Luke: We just restarted the clock. You know? It's really fun in that way. 

[02:16:23] John: Yeah. 

[02:16:24] Luke: Yeah. Go for it. You first. Famous last words. I wish we had a Zoom in right now with the shot. Here. Let me have one

[02:16:38] John: Oh, okay.

[02:16:38] Luke: Pass it on. I was not downing on it. I'm just saying I got to-- it says on the bottle, meditation mist. And I think that's an important part of the conversation. And I like to take a deep breath before I do it too, so I don't inhale it.

[02:16:52] John: Mm-hmm.

[02:16:58] Luke: It's funny, dude. Woohoohoo. Child. Oh, boy. Woo. It's a new day. You want to hear something funny.

[02:17:07] John: Yeah.

[02:17:09] Luke: So when I was hitting this stuff way harder than I should have been, I was torturing myself to not do my Lucy nicotine gum. I was like, no, I can do this. Classic addict rationalization. I was like, wow, this is medicine. This is shamanic. But a friend of mine, David, uh, in LA, who listens to my podcast all the time, he's probably the only friend of mine that listens to every episode. He would text me. He's like, dude, I can hear you on your mic doing. So I'd have to tell the guests like, hey, if you-- I usually tell people if it's our first time recording and say, hey, if I look at my notes, and I'm writing stuff down, don't think I'm not listening. Just keep talking because the camera won't show me over there doing my thing.

And so I would tell them, hey, if you see me do this weird thing, just don't trip. It's my medicine. But sometimes I would forget and I'd be sitting there with a podcast guest and I'm like, and then I'm blowing my nose and having a whole thing. So my friend David's like, yeah, man, I don't think they mute your mic when the other person's talking. By the way, editors, you might want to do that in case I fart in the middle of a profound statement by the guest or something. But yeah, he's like, every time you do it, you can totally hear it on the mic. Then you hear, you're like. So anyway, thanks David for illuminating that thought.

[02:18:27] John: Yeah. I want to, um, I want to just say I was out on the north shore of Hawaii, um, over Christmas. 

[02:18:36] Luke: Lucky you. 

[02:18:37] John: Yeah, I got to stay with Garrett McNamara at his--

[02:18:42] Luke: Former guest on the show. World class big-wave surfer. 

[02:18:45] John: Yeah. A 100-foot wave. And, um, and I was out there. And I have some friends that I grew up with. I grew up in Kailua, which isn't too far from the North shore. I had some friends that live out there as well and reconnected with some people I haven't in a while. And they're like, oh man, I heard you on Luke Storey. And like everybody out there on the North, so shout out to the North shore. If listening to this, we love you. And it's just amazing the impact that you're having, that it's getting all the way out to Hawaii. And there's a lot of amazing people out there that are following you.

[02:19:23] Luke: Oh, that's so cool. I love Hawaii. I miss it. I haven't been in years. Well it's funny with that and thank you for sharing that with me too. But sometimes, uh, I have a secret sauce I can't really even explain with how I choose who to record with. I'm not on some power trip, but it's like, this is my, uh, one of my superpowers is just having an intuitive feeling about who I want to sit down with. Because I get requests, I mean, literally every day, email after email from really brilliant, incredible people that want to be on the podcast, for which I'm really honored and grateful and respectful. There's the after-- 

[02:20:04] John: Because you don't want to get the drip.

[02:20:06] Luke: Yeah, no, you don't want that. Um, so friends of mine would be like, hey, I want to introduce you to this person. You should be on the show. And I think it was Khalil that wanted me to have, um, uh, McNamara on. I don't know anything about surfing. I'm not into sports. It's cool. Surfers seem like nice guys. I don't know. But he's like, no, no, Garrett McNamara, he's a legend. He is got a really great story and da da da.

And it was one of those cases where I was like, huh, even though I'm not personally interested in surfing, I am interested in the mindset of someone who can be towed out to a 100-foot wave and find pleasure in that, and find some sort of spiritual connection with Mother Earth. That interfaces with nature in such a dangerous way. It's such a rare experience for a human being to have. And so I didn't put a lot of thought. It was more of an intuitive hit. 

But I also, admittedly thought, well, surfers really know this guy and they seem to be tapped into a different flow state realm. And they have their own subculture. And maybe if I have him on, we'll have a great conversation and I might reach some surfers. That's so funny. You share that with me, you're like, yeah, it worked. It landed. You have a little subsect of people in Hawaii in the--

[02:21:26] John: I don't think it was from that podcast.

[02:21:29] Luke: Oh, really? Okay. 

[02:21:30] John: I think people have just been following you for a while. Yeah. 

[02:21:32] Luke: Oh, Well, whatever--

[02:21:34] John: They love your content.

[02:21:35] Luke: Well, I'm not for everyone.

[02:21:38] John: They thought I'd really made it because I was on Luke Storey. It's like, man, this little surfer kid from Kailua is now on Luke Storey, Ben Greenfield, and blah, blah, blah. To them, it's a big deal.

[02:21:52] Luke: That's very cool. 

[02:21:53] John: Yeah, I'm very honored to be--

[02:21:55] Luke: Well, it's funny, dude, because hopefully one can, um, have some degree of notoriety and remain humble, which it's not hard for me to stay humble because 99.99999% of the population has no clue who Luke Storey is. But in my own little ecosystem that I'm a part of and have created, people are aware of what I do. But when it's you doing it, you literally have no idea that you're having any impact whatsoever until you hear a story like that.

Alyson and I were at Whole Foods, she's in her freaking wheelchair. This is yesterday. We finally made it out of the house. And she's been bedridden, recovering from her stem cell procedure on her knees. And I literally turn her around, because I've never hauled anyone around in a wheelchair. I don't know how to do it. I figured out in that moment you have to back into into doorways. So I backed up and I'm pulling her in, and someone was coming in behind us and Alyson's like, Hey, sorry guys. This is our first time. Thanks for your patience. We're trying to get in the door here. And then the girl stops and looks at at me, looks at Alyson, and she's like, oh my God, you guys, thank you so much for your work. It's helped me so much. I'm not crying, it still the Zen spray it I cry on most podcast episodes, but not this one today so far.

And it was like that. And I'm like, Sarasota, Florida, Whole Foods, how does this woman know who the hell we are? And it's those situations you realize, wow, if someone like that girl could listen and be like, MARCoNS infection, I never heard of that. Igt. Calls your office, gets the test, does the thing, clears it. And later in life suffer doesn't suffer all the consequences that come downstream from that. Or they hear Joe Dispenza, and he's talking about the quantum and meditation, whatever it is, it's so fun to get feedback like that and you get reminded that all the hard work that goes into doing this thing, which it's fun and I enjoy it, but, dude, it's a lot of work and a whole team of people. It cost a bunch of money to get it all out there in the world and all that.

[02:24:05] John: Well, you're so real and transparent, and I think the way that you do your interviews and how you share your truth is really special. It's not something that I think all the podcasters have that skill and, um, yeah, you're really a very special human. One my favorite.

[02:24:29] Luke: Thanks, brother. I appreciate that. Part of that vulnerability, because I get that feedback a lot from people, and it's a very high compliment to me, just authenticity, vulnerability, I think one of the reasons I'm like that is because I never learned how to have boundaries. Because when I was a kid my boundaries were invaded constantly, sometimes very, um, dramatically. And so I've learned how to have-- just social etiquette is something I'd just never really learned. And so sometimes I'm very forthright and, um, vulnerable because I just don't know how to not be that way. So I had to learn. Actually for some people, if you're just too boundaryless in the way that you share, it makes some people uncomfortable, because they're just not used to that level of-- 

[02:25:20] John: Well, people are told not to cry. Not to show your emotions. I mean, my dad was a Marine, so it was very much like that. And he holds everything in.

[02:25:30] Luke: Yeah. My dad, the same way. He was a cowboy. If you cry, I mean, I don't want to offend anyone, but you are a pussy if you cry. That was literally what he would say to me. Now, my dad goes to dispense some things and has done ketamine therapy. We're real tight. He's worked on himself a lot. I hope he doesn't mind me saying he did ketamine therapy, but I doubt his peer group listens to my podcast. People can change and evolve of course. But yeah, when I was a kid, you got to be a man, be tough. Thankfully, I was mostly raised by my mom where emotions were encouraged. And it was like having an open heart, and being loving and compassionate, and sharing your feelings.

And the feminine side of me was very much nurtured, by my mom. Um, and then my dad, uh, earlier in life had a very warped understanding of masculine energy. But even within that, I really gained a lot of the positive attributes of masculine energy, of just being able to handle shit when you need to handle shit. How to keep your composure and stay cool, and be strong, and all of those beautiful parts of being a man or a woman that has access to the masculine. Yeah. Had no idea this conversation was going to meander into this part.

[02:26:44] John: We've gone into a lot of different areas of-- 

[02:26:47] Luke: Throughout this conversation, I've been like, how am I going to do the, not the show notes, but my intro for the show. I try to let people know what they can expect. Like, yeah we talk about yada yada, yada. And I rattle off some bullet points. I'm like, I have no idea what the title's going to be for this one, or what the bullet points will be. I'm just going to be like--

[02:27:03] John: Well, we mastermind this a little bit and we've only covered half of the things we wanted to talk about. 

[02:27:08] Luke: Okay, Oh God, there's so much here, dude. All right. We did get through a lot of it, but one thing that we were starting to meander into a few moments ago had to do with the gut biome. And one of your, I think, underrepresented MitoZen products is the ProbioMax, the suppository that's loaded with, uh, butyrate. And a few people probably know about butyrate. It's, uh, it's prevalent in butter, which is what gives butter that uh, dirty sock smell, for lack of a sexy way to say it. Uh, and you know more than I the benefits of butyrate, but what I have to say, and this is also part of the travel hack too, when I remember to bring them, as I said, when I travel, my gut gets destroyed.

It's just like, whatever. But also, if I eat gluten and different foods that don't agree with me, my digestion's just very sensitive. It's my Achilles heel. And I do those ProbioMax ones anytime my gut gets weird for whatever reason, and it's instantaneously better and normalizes within a couple days. But you don't, excuse me. Oh God, this is getting very real. That Zen's creeping up on me. Uh, but you talk about your NAD and melatonin. You have your flagship, where you've put your flag in the ground, the products. But that one, to me, dude, is one that's on the sidelines 

[02:28:29] John: Underrepresented.

[02:28:30] Luke: Yeah. On your site. And it's for people that have gut inflammation and stuff. Man, this is a really important product. 

[02:28:36] John: Well, butyrate is a really interesting compound. It's, primarily made by beneficial bacteria in your gut, and it's secreted, and then it goes systemic and it helps with the, um, gut-brain access. And so the gut and the brain should have a connection. And, um, the butyrate has been shown to be incredibly protective to the gut lining. So it prevents a lot of this leaky gut, and it helps with the tight junctions in the gut. It's been shown to improve insulin sensitivity quite dramatically. Um, it's been shown to be really, really helpful for the cardiovascular system, reducing stroke. Um, and the butyrate inhibits colorectal cancer. So they've actually taken, um, cancer cells in Petri dishes and they've added butyrate, and it totally inhibits the growth of the cancer. 

So yeah. It's really, um, it's underknown. There's not a lot of people that really know about it, but there's this old school naturopathic technique where you do a butyrate enema. And so that's where I got the idea is I noticed that there was this and so I started utilizing this, um, this enema with the butyrate trying to, just practice on myself and test it out. And I was like, wow, this really, um, makes a lot of sense. And so that's where the bullet was met. 

[02:30:08] Luke: Another thing about the ProbioMax that's interesting is it also has probiotics in it. And what's trippy about that to me, and most people listening I think will know that taking oral probiotics is problematic because they get wrecked by your stomach acid.

[02:30:25] John: You want it in the large intestines. You don't really need it in your small intenstines. 

[02:30:29] Luke: So we take Just Thrive's, one of our sponsors, and they make spore-based probiotics, so it doesn't hatch until it gets where it's supposed to go. Um, and it's a certain strain, but I like to have diversity, so you want to get as many in there, but when you're putting these in the reverse order and not swallowing it, I would assume that you're probably going to get the swarming effect, not only the butyrate but the probiotics in there that are helping to colonize, uh, where you want them to go in the first place without having to go through the whole treacherous journey of your acidic digestive tract. 

[02:31:01] John: Well, another interesting point, and this was brought up by you earlier, is when you're traveling and you have that interruption in your circadian rhythm and then you're noticing some gut issues, because the microbiome is very sensitive to the circadian rhythm. In fact, 400 times more melatonin is secreted by the lining of your gut than what's in your pineal, and that melatonin activates microbiome swarming. And this is basically where the microbiome goes through its growth phase every 24 hours. So one things that I've been, um, working on, uh, this is leading to a new product, um, is a fermented melatonin yogurt.

[02:31:48] Luke: Yeah. Which I've been eating the past three nights.

[02:31:52] John: Probiotonin.

[02:31:54] Luke: Okay. Do you think this is something you're going to have up and running and be able to ship to people?

[02:31:59] John: Well, by the time this podcast comes out, probably not, but at some point-- I mean, this is a whole process where we've got to get fermentation tanks and, um, but I can tell you, we can put out a recipe for people that can make it. Um, we have the yogurt recipe, which is probios and yogurt, which we'll definitely put out. And, um, what I'll do for your listeners is I'll go ahead and add to that recipe on how you can make it with the melatonin. But we've been beta testing it. And I gave you some. It's been some of the best sleep I've had, and I feel like it really helps.

Um, just the overall feeling of wellbeing when I wake up. There's this blissed out feeling that I feel after I take it, at night when you've had a hard day, and you've exercised, and you're sleepy, and you're ready to crawl in bed. Particularly I had this when I was a kid. You just feel really blissed out, and you just crawl into bed. I was feeling that with the combination with this fermented melatonin. And so the idea of having the melatonin along with the probiotics together really made a lot of sense to me. So I think that it's something that may help a lot of people, and it's super unique. I don't know anybody that's even thought about something like this 

[02:33:27] Luke: I've never heard of it. It also tastes very unique. The plain yogurt you guys made, I'm like, I would be buying that all the time. You can just-- it's effervescent, I think is the word I'm looking for. You can tell there's a lot of enzymatic activity in it. It's real tangy, more so than any yogurt you would buy at a store. I mean, you're just like, wow. I wonder what the bacteria count is on this stuff

[02:33:53] John: Yeah. I wonder. It's high.

[02:33:55] Luke: But with the melatonin, that's interesting, fermenting the melatonin because I wonder if the enzymes created in the fermentation process are increasing the bioavailability of the melatonin. Because I'll take, um, eat some fermented foods or something to just help my digestion. It's like the best digestive enzymes you can take that has been fermented.

[02:34:16] John: Well, what happens is the bacteria micro digest it. So they're going to basically digest and the melatonin becomes much higher absorption. Um, typically, melatonin is, um, 2% of it is absorbed orally. This is in the research. So not much gets through. It's very fragile.

[02:34:35] Luke: When you make yours liposomal, does that go up?

[02:34:39] John: Much higher.

[02:34:39] Luke: Like in your SandMan, the oral one, I mean, it's liposomal, so it's encased in a fat molecule, essentially. 

[02:34:45] John: So there's going to be a lot more absorption that way. But most of-- that's why I say a four milligram pill of melatonin, and then you're getting 2%, 21/2 absorption on that. It's such a tiny amount. Homeopathy is real. Homeopathy works, but really we're talking about very homeopathic doses. So when start talking about all benefits throughout the body that melatonin can provide, um, that's where you start to have an argument for higher doses and higher absorption and different routes of delivery.

[02:35:19] Luke: Cool. Uh, before we get out of here, what about the, uh, the VSEL treatment? That's something that's pretty new and unique that we did here as well. Uh, I met a guy, Dr. Todd, uh, what's his last?

[02:35:36] John: Ovokaitys.

[02:35:36] Luke: Yeah. I met him at my friend Daniel Raphael's house. And Daniel has this, I guess a salon would be a good way to put it. So he'll have someone like you or Dr. Todd come in and do a talk and then, uh, in some cases administer treatments and stuff. And I met Dr. Todd and he was showing me the laser that he developed and how it works. And it was really fascinating. I mean, my pay grade, intellectually, to understand it completely. 

But I was just like, this dude is onto something. And what I-- the dogs are getting really hungry and bored. Okay. We get the message guys. We're almost done. Or girls. I'm sorry. Uh, but anyway, he was explaining, yeah, and he did a, basically similar to PRP where he took some blood and spun it, and then-- hi Lonnie, you little sweetie. You guys, he has the cutest dog. I hope you can see it for those watching the video such as sweetheart. 

Uh, but the way he explained it to me is you have these VSELs, uh, these unexpressed cells that have really potent healing potential. And then with his special laser gadget, you essentially can create a homing effect where those VSELs go to a certain part in the body, whether it's your brain or, an injury or something like that. So that was my only understanding. And then I think I asked you about it over text. You were like, yeah, dude, we do that here. I was like, what? It's quite expensive, at least to go to San Diego and do it with him. I think it's like 20 grand or something. It's a lot. 

[02:37:00] John: Yeah. He charges 12.

[02:37:02] Luke: Oh, is that what it is? Oh, okay. I mean, still a lot.

[02:37:05] John: Yeah. VSEL stands for very small embryonic-like stem cells. And these are stem cells that are circulating in your blood. And it's a new discovery, um, where they're trapped. So what's really interesting, I know you've had Joe Dispenza on your podcast, and Joe, um, has done some really great research with regards to what's happening with spontaneous healing with people that are meditating or praying.

And there's this idea, what they found is all these tiny particles were released. So they're exosomes basically. They're three nanometers, three to five nanometers. And so the idea was, okay, so are these exosomes being released by stem cells, which is creating this healing with people? And that was their initial idea. And I've been working and talking and in relationship with a lot of these researchers because it's so interesting to me. Um, and, so when I started to really dig into, um, the VSELs uh, it made sense that maybe they're not exosomes, they're actually VSELs. And so Todd Ovokaitys also agreed with me that that's probably what's happening. And I put Todd together with Joe Dispenza's group, and I think they're going to start doing some research with that. 

But they're held together by these proteins. And the proteins lock the VSELs so that we don't have access to them. So something has to release that protein. And so the, um, the laser that we're using, uh, it's really a quantum laser. It's a zero point laser. So there's just some very detailed ways that we set it whereas, um, it cancels out all the waves. So it's basically a zero point laser. And that has an ability to relax these proteins to liberate all of these, um, VSELs, but it also activates a proliferation. So there's more that grow, I think two or three times, um, growth.

So we draw blood and it's, not quite PRP but it's something close to PRP. It's activated through this process of lasering, and then it can be injected as an IV. And then then the laser can home them into specific parts. We have a whole brain protocol. This is what we did on Ben Greenfield when he was here recently. Um, we did this with you. We did this-- 

[02:39:36] Luke: Yeah. I was like, what did we even do? I'm just like, do the things, and I didn't really ask because I just was excited to do it.

[02:39:43] John: And we did your hip, right?

[02:39:45] Luke: Yes.

[02:39:45] John: And your lower back. And so they can be directly injected, um, or they can be homed in. You could have a stroke patient, and we could look at an MRI and see exactly where the lesion is, and then home them directly in. When we were doing our, um, Soneva inner ear procedure, um, which is something we weren't even doing this back when you did your initial treatment, but we home the VSELs specifically into the parts of the brain that are responsible for hearing, and the different parts of the brainstem, and, um, and the ear itself. So we do a direct injection. But yeah, we've seen some really good benefit with the VSELs. We're really enjoying that process.

[02:40:32] Luke: So the brainstem, at one point, the practitioner here had me open my mouth and was like hitting the back of my throat with the laser.

[02:40:39] John: Yeah.

[02:40:39] Luke: Was that going to the brainstem? 

[02:40:42] John: Yeah. Through the nose, you're going to get, um, frontal lobe. You're going to get up into, um, more of the brain tissue. Through the mouth, you've got the pons and the mesencephalon, which are part of the brainstem. And so your whole auditory track decussates down right into that top part of the brainstem and it comes right down. So, um, those pools of neurons are just really right there behind the throat or in the mouth. Yeah.

[02:41:10] Luke: Well, John, for a kid that was on the short bus, you're a smart mothereffer. Don't ever doubt it.

[02:41:17] John: Yeah. Thanks, brother.

[02:41:18] Luke: Yeah. But more than anything, more importantly than smarts is heart, man. Thank you for your heart, and thank you for your willingness to just keep innovating and learning and helping people, man. That's what it's all about. Anyone that's happy, by now, has figured out that the key to happiness is helping other people. But when you're still suffering and you're still entrapped in the egoic consciousness, the last thing you want to do is help other people because you're in fight or flight survival, your limbic system's on fire, and fuck everyone else. I got to get through this, and I'm going to do whatever I got to do to survive. But--

[02:41:51] John: Well, we've both been there.

[02:41:53] Luke: Totally. But it's incredible if you could go to your younger self, I mean, in my case, and say, hey, all the selfishness, the self-centeredness, the self-serving way that you live your life, um, is actually what's causing you to be miserable. It's just really a backward way to live. And once you figure that, not to say that I'm not still selfish in some ways, and I'm sure you are too, but my overarching perspective on life, uh, I think is, um, very similar to yours. And that, man, the key to happiness is helping to alleviate suffering in the world, and helping people to be empowered to heal.

So, thank you for your heart, and thank you for all the help you've given me. You've been so instrumental in helping me identify some of these root problems. And through all your products and, treatments and stuff like that. We're making real headway. So I'm so glad to call you a friend and, thank you for just being so consistently there for me and helping me out.

[02:42:51] John: It's been a pleasure, Luke, and it's, um, a pleasure to be on this journey with you and to be sharing these ideas with your people, your followers.

[02:43:02] Luke: Yeah. It's fun. Well, I think we did it, dude. I'm even not going to look at my notes because if there's anything on there, it's going to take us into the seven-hour mark or something.

[02:43:10] John: Yeah, no way.

[02:43:11] Luke: Yeah, I think we covered-- 

[02:43:12] John: We're complete.

[02:43:12] Luke: We're complete, sir. Thank you for joining me on The Life Stylist Podcast. All right. Well, I hope that ride was as wild for you as it was for me. I got to say, it's always a blast to share ideas with John. This guy just never stops learning and innovating his practice. So each time we sit down for a pod, it's incredibly expansive for me, and I trust that it was for you as well. And remember, if you want to explore John's incredible MitoZen products discussed here in this episode, go to lukestorey.com/mitozen, and use that code LUKESTOREY for 5% off. 

And if you miss this important announcement in the intro, then check it out. By the time you hear this episode, the MitoZen website will have transitioned into a PMA or private member association. And this is to protect your medical freedom, access to these innovative delivery systems, and also, of course, their free speech and their ability to explain them in an authentic and honest way. The system and the powers that be don't like certain delivery systems unless it's for a pharmaceutical medication.

So when you get to the site, lukestorey.com/mitozen, you'll likely find a one-time $10 lifetime membership fee that allows you to enter the site and purchase the products. I wanted to make sure that I let you guys know that so that it wasn't a complicated or confusing process. And this is something that has been necessary for them in order to do the things they do, which are pretty damn innovative and badass. If you listen to this show, you know I'm a huge fan of the MitoZen stuff and I literally use it all the time, especially in the ways we talked about during this episode.

All right. All that being said, let's talk about next week's show. It's called Heart Coherence: Finding a Higher Power Within and Living Your Truth, featuring Bruce Cryer from the HeartMath Institute. And I got to say, man, this was a powerful one for me, very emotionally and even spiritually healing. Bruce Cryer is a legend in the personal development field and just such a genuine and warm person. So I highly recommend that you check out next week's show.

And if you'd like me to email you all future episode assets like the audio, video, written transcripts, show notes, and links, here's what you want to do. Go to lukestorey.com/newsletter and enter your name and best email. It's that easy. Again, that's lukestorey.com/newsletter. All right, I'll be back next week to open your heart with Bruce Cryer. See you then.

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