[00:00:00]Luke Storey:  I'm Luke Storey. For the past 22 years, I've been relentlessly committed to my deepest passion, designing the ultimate lifestyle based on the most powerful principles of spirituality, health, psychology. The Life Stylist podcast is a show dedicated to sharing my discoveries and the experts behind them with you. Kat, welcome to not only the Life Stylist podcast, but also Ceremony Circle. This is the first time Alyson and I have co-hosted the show that will be featured on both our platform. So, it's a first and we're excited to talk to you.

[00:00:38]Kat Graham:  I'm so grateful to talk to you both. You both have been really kind of leading such a movement in wellness, and it's really inspiring to see two people that have the same ideals to make this world better, and it's really exciting. Couple goals.

[00:00:56]Alyson Charles:  Oh, wow. We received that, because let me tell you, it took us a long time to arrive at any sort of couple goals, anything. It was a long journey for both of us, so thank you for acknowledging that.

[00:01:10]Kat Graham:  Yeah, it's amazing.

[00:01:11]Luke Storey:  Yeah. it is amazing when you're aligned with someone, as I'm sure you are in your partnership, in terms of your values, I think that's such an important anchor to a relationship, where not that you have to agree on everything and you might have nuances in your perspective on the world. But for us, our spiritual life is by far the most important part of our lives. And so, having that as a grounding thread to keep us kind of in line with our individual lives and be able to come together and share that, too.

[00:01:45]Kat Graham:  Yeah, that's really the foundation, right? For me, in terms of like any relationship, if you don't have a spiritual foundation, you don't have a foundation.

[00:01:54]Luke Storey:  Boom. There's our tweetable.

[00:01:56]Alyson Charles:  Yeah.

[00:01:57]Luke Storey:  Alright. I want to start off with you, Kat. As a former refugee of Hollywood and the entertainment industry, I was a fashion stylist for a long time, and then moved into the health and wellness space, but one of the things that I found challenging living and working in Hollywood was, and I'm sure it's changed a bit now, because more people are into spirituality, and breathwork, and yoga, and clean living, and all of that, but I was, at times, feeling like I was sort of living a double life, because I was feeding into this Hollywood machine, which has this inherent gift of sharing people's talent with the world, right?

[00:02:36] So, dancing, singing, acting, playing, music, all of this stuff that you do. So, there's kind of this vanity aspect of Hollywood. So, I'm wondering how you find balance in being so prolific. So many movies, TV shows, tours, albums, all the things you've done, how do you infuse your authenticity and humility in the Hollywood machine? I know it's a huge question to start with. 

[00:03:06]Kat Graham:  Humble as I'm sitting in front of all these pictures of myself, yes, I'm so humble, it's so funny, because balance is such an interesting concept. I've also been told I'm a bit of an extremist, so I don't even know that an extremist can be balanced. That being said, when we talk about foundation, we don't just talk about the foundation with our significant others. It's like a foundation with yourself, too. And I do pride myself on being a spiritual person and I do have a really solid foundation with God.

[00:03:51] And I make sure that I'm moving in purpose, like yes, the fashion is fun, and the movies are fun and everything, but it's always to build my platform to help people. That's what it's for. My platform, whether it's my Instagram or it's my films, everything is to help give a voice to the voices of the characters I play. So, I'm always moving in my purpose. If the instrument is my face or the instrument is a character that I'm playing, then so be it. If the instrument is a modern Nirvana conference, so be it.

[00:04:30] That's, I guess, my balance and the way to kind of not be living a double life, because I make sure that everything, and every interview that I do, and everything that I do always goes back to, how do I help the people that actually needed in this moment in time? And how do I help elevate their voices, and the people that might be suffering right now, or needing answers, or needing healing? So, I try and do that. I'm not perfect, I'm human. And I do have an ego. So, nobody's perfect, right? But we all strive to kind of make choices that help bring us closer to our purpose, I would say.

[00:05:11]Alyson Charles:  And it sounds like you have a really good conscious awareness, and that's 99% of it. You're watching. You're like, okay, am I starting to slide a little bit more over here? Should I step up my game a little bit on this side, and watching it? And when you said a second ago about you're human, too, when I was watching some videos yesterday, there was one I just so appreciated your honesty and your vulnerability.

[00:05:43] And it was when you, and Frank, and Bryant, the three of you that are the founders of Modernnirvana, you guys were doing some deep cleansing practices. And one of the cleansing practices for you was clearing some photos that you had of you and your dad. And you were sharing the reasoning behind that and there was one quote that you said that just stood out to me. And you said that one of the initial sparks that got you into the industry was that you were wanting to be famous, and hopes that if the world would love you, that your dad would come around to loving you in the way that you wanted to.

[00:06:23] And I was like, wow, that was a biggie to take in. And so, I wondered, at what point then did that start to shift for you? You might have started from that place, and then I'm guessing along the way, you had to have had some pretty big realizations like, okay, now, my purpose for being in this industry is changing. So, I was curious, when did you start to feel those shifts? And when did you start to map out that, like truer fulfillment place from which you're working from?

[00:06:59]Kat Graham:  A lot of us aren't necessarily aware of what drives us, so we think it's this one thing. And I really had always said, oh, I'm just going to be a famous actress, and that's going to be my life, and that's just who I am, and I didn't really ask myself why. And yeah, I had worked my whole life seeking my dad's validation, and my mom's on some level, too, because she wasn't always, and still struggles to be present.

[00:07:27] And then, I think throughout like when I was a teenager in my like mid to late teens, I started to meditate heavy. I was reading a lot of Deepak Chopra, and Wayne Dyer, and Caroline Myss, and like all of these kind of like heavyweights. And Paramahansa Yogananda, I was getting really, really deep into just studying God and studying these great teachers. And I realized there was something more that I was a part of and that I recognized that I was actually never going to get the validation from my dad and my mom.

[00:08:07] And on some level, even though I do have a lot of Instagram followers, which I'm excited to actually share this video, so I'm so glad we're recording it, because I'll share it with them after, I'm not even going to get the validation from the public. Like anyone who's watching this, I love you guys, but I don't need you. And if everyone loves me, great. If everyone hates me, great. It doesn't matter.

[00:08:32] And I realize that seeking outside validation was a trap and I wasn't going to get caught in it. So, I let go of the need of outside validation and started working towards this purpose to be more needing the validation of myself and of God. Okay. I'm doing the right thing. I have that confirmation energy. I'm moving forward. This is my purpose. I'm moving in that space versus seeking validation from my parents when I'll just never get it from.

[00:09:04]Alyson Charles:  That makes total sense, and I've just got one little quick thread to tie in with that, because a lot of my audience are fellow healers, and people here that are really tapped into the spiritual path and committed to their evolution in that way. And I hear a lot of times from them, there's still that fear. For some, it's that which wound that a lot of us were like witches, and healers, and past lives, and we were killed and burned.

[00:09:32]Kat Graham:  Probably.

[00:09:33]Alyson Charles:  Yes. And so, that thread gets carried through to this life ,and you tend to have a lot of trepidation for putting yourself out there and expressing your spiritual truths. And so, I'm curious if based upon what you just shared with us about what keeps you centered, is that also what just keeps you calm when trolls, or projected pain body, or extreme adoration, whatever it is on both sides of the spectrum? How do you, because I think a lot of these healers will really love your insight into how you stay in your power and in your knowingness when those outside comments are made at times?

[00:10:22]Kat Graham:  One, we're all human, so that's really important to remember, but we're also all source energy, too, and that's also important to remember. There's a great wise teacher by the name of RuPaul. And RuPaul once said, what other people think of you is none of your business, and pretty much, I live by that. It's none of my business how you feel about how I approach spirituality, or how I approach my career, or how I approach my hair or my fashion. 

[00:10:54] What you think of me has got nothing to do with me. That is your problem, you deal with it. And it's a bit sassy and maybe not something that people want to hear. Maybe people want to hear that, maybe try and fit in, and maybe you just haven't found the right group. Sometimes, it's just going to be you alone and that has to be okay. Sometimes, the walk, you don't have a great spouse, but maybe you'll find one, one day or maybe you won't, but if you are walking in your truth, most of the time, you will probably be walking alone unless you have a great twin flame or soulmate, whatever it is that will travel with you and meet you somewhere along the lines.

[00:11:32] But you've got to be prepared to go at it alone. And if you're too scared, then I can't say that you'll have earned it, whatever that thing that you believe that you're capable of reaching. I don't think that if you can't get past the fear of putting yourself out there, and saying, this is who I am, and this is what I believe in, and this is how I can help people, and you're holding that, then on some level, you're selfish with your talents and you're not sharing them with the world, or what you've learned and you're keeping them to yourself.

[00:12:09] And then, make room. Make room for other people who might have less knowledge than you, but are willing to be ostracized for it, or I mean, I've dealt with every single bit of whether it's how I move spiritually or I was raised Jewish, so I've dealt with a lot of anti-Semitism and dealt with obvious racism. I mean, it's just been nonstop. And you just stop caring. It's like you're going to get the most incredible people in the world get attacked for who they are. So, what makes you any different? Like it's just going to come. You have to know that it's going to come, but it shouldn't matter. If you are living and living in your purpose, then what does somebody that doesn't know you or know your purpose, what does it matter? It doesn't. It really doesn't.

[00:13:03]Luke Storey:  I think that's a really great perspective, and it reminds me of something I heard recently in regard to just putting yourself on a public platform and making yourself vulnerable to critiques, like some of them, valid, some of them, not. And I forget who said it, but the gist of it was this, it's like if some random person that's not really making those courageous moves that you're describing in their life in the world is making a commentary on my performance or my content, whatever it is that you're presenting this world, it's like that person who hasn't had the courage to really put themselves out there sort of negates their, I don't want to say their right, but negates any relevance to what they have to say, right?

[00:13:49] So, on that note, say, a peer that you really respect or a colleague like Deepak Chopra comes to you, and says, hey, Kat, I'm seeing a little shadow piece here that you might not have noticed, or anyone that you respect, maybe someone even in the field of acting, I mean, do you think it carries more weight when there's someone that says, hey, I want to check you on this, that that is actually also in the game versus just kind of a bystander that's sort of uncourageously throwing in their two cents?

[00:14:19]Kat Graham:  It's so interesting. The most important thing that we got to really remember is that like it's going to some really weird, we're the same being. We're the same. I'm a part of you and you're a part of me. We are infinitely connected. So, this person that might be putting out negativity, it's like standing in the mirror and cussing yourself out, like what are you doing? So, just on a base level, before getting into any of that, like we are part of the same consciousness. 

[00:14:52] We are a part of each other. So, the reasoning behind you're different than me and I don't like you, because you do things differently, that sounds so stupid. So, that's the baseline for how I kind of want to approach this conversation. But also, there's that quote, those that mind don't matter and those that matter don't mind. I know some of the most incredibly powerful people and they don't care what I do. I could show up in motorcycle leathers and Deepak wouldn't say a thing, he'd be like, oh, that's cool look. 

[00:15:29] You know what I mean? Like the most successful, and powerful, and credible people that I've met, you show up how you show up and they're just happy that you're there. There's just this sense of pure gratitude, non-judgment, just easygoing. I remember when I met Barack Obama on, it was a total accident. I went to my friend's house, he said, hey, we're going to this concert, meet me at my mom's, and there was Barack Obama sitting at a dinner table, and he got up, there were only six people in the room, and I remember I had like a cast on my hand, and I was wearing some like dirty shirt, and my hair was in an African head wrap, I didn't bother brushing my hair, and it just didn't even faze him.

[00:16:11] Like he's wearing a suit and I just looked like some like grungy kid. And I've met some great people, they won't—the only person that I actually listen to is probably Frank Elaridi. And he will just tell me something to make things better, or say, have you tried this? And if it works, great. And if it doesn't, great. But we don't make it our job to critique other people, because what might work for me might not work for them, and what might work for Luke Storey might not work for Frank Elaridi.

[00:16:46] So, it's like we have to be so specific about understanding and knowing what we do, so that it's our job to know what will work and what won't work. That's not other people's job to shift our awareness necessarily. It's invited if I look for it, but I'm not looking at the—I don't read my comments. I try and connect with my audience so that they know that I see them and that I love them, and that's it. I haven't read what people—I don't care. I actually, genuinely don't care.

[00:17:21]Alyson Charles:  Yeah. No, this is so good. It's such good medicine, so I'm really grateful that you're just being super transparent and just-

[00:17:29]Kat Graham:  It sounds crazy that people will be like, what do you mean she doesn't care? I really don't care what people—I've had so much—but you get through all that bullying, and you come out the other side, you can go one of two ways, where you can get totally bullied, and then you can decide to kind of shift your approach and/or mute yourself down. You have that option.

[00:17:52]Alyson Charles:  Or just give up.

[00:17:53]Kat Graham:  Or give up like a lot of people do, they go quiet, or you can go—there's no middle, right? You got to go way left, and dim yourself, and shut the lights completely off, and close the door, or you have to go even harder, and you have to be the loudest version of yourself, and the no fucks given, and just go for it. And I went that way, because that's power. That's honesty and that's transparency. And I don't think that I'm the most zen person all the time. And I'm not like hippy dippy. And I have friends that are pretty wild.

[00:18:35] And one of my favorite friends who's incredibly spiritual and amazing, and she's a medium, and her name is Alex March. and she's covered in tattoos, and she cusses, and she just like drinks beer, and she's just like so dope, and I've always followed spiritual women that have gone through it and to get to the other side. I never trust people that haven't really gone through it to say, oh, just good vibes only. Like maybe you've got to get through the bad vibes to get to the good vibes only. Maybe it's all a part of your being and you just have to embrace it. So, it's a journey, for sure.

[00:19:16]Alyson Charles:  I totally agree with you. And the one little nugget that I'll toss in is I've really, for years, ever since coming out as a shaman, it's such a strong word and a strong title to be instructed to use so publicly, and it's definitely brought a lot.

[00:19:36]Kat Graham:  Yeah, I'm sure. It's not on a job application, right? 

[00:19:42]Alyson Charles:  Yes, a lot of questions, a lot of preconceived notions. And yeah, for many years, I've walked through the fires of the bullies of the pain body projection, and I've really recently gotten to that place that you're talking about of getting to the other side, of having gone through the bullying. And I've now really landed in a place of true reverence and balance of. I started to observe myself.

[00:20:09] I don't let the positive comments go to my head, really, at all. I'm just like I'm glad that that resonates with you, and that's where it is, but I'll notice, I'll be moved by kindness. And my heart might be really deeply moved by a really heartfelt comment. And I thought, okay, Alyson, if you're allowing your heart to be moved by that kindhearted comment, no wonder your heart used to be so hurt by the negative comment. And so, I've really been doing a lot of powerful alchemizing and have landed so much more in my power around everything that you've just shared.

[00:20:47] So, I'm glad that you brought your really strong perspective into this conversation. And the next thing I'm curious about, the role that you played for so many years that a lot of people know you from is from the Vampire Diaries. And so, I'm so intrigued to learn from you. And I think when you played, you were in that show, that was about the time that I quit watching TV, but from what I understand, I feel like your role, didn't she have some witchy attributes as well?

[00:21:17]Kat Graham:  She was a witch. I played a witch. So, we never did any like real spells or anything. It was all kind of mishigas, like made-up language and stuff, but it was really fun. I met a lot of witches in daily life that would just be like, hi, I'm a witch, I am like, okay, that's great. So, it was really fun, though. I mean, I think that more than anything, because the witch and power, really, as a young woman, I spent my 20s doing that character, it's all about finding your power.

[00:21:55] So, whether you're Wiccan, or you're Christian, or you're Jewish, or you're Muslim, or you haven't found your way to connect with source yet, it's about finding your power. That's what that character is about. And I think that a lot of women, really, especially young girls, and even young girls now are still like, I'm getting DM's all the time, saying, I love the show. And I'm like, how old are you? 13. And I'm like, I shot the show like 11 years ago.

[00:22:22] Like this is wild. It's about finding their power, and I think a lot of us are still finding our voices, and it's so much harder as a young woman now to find your voice, where for me, when I was a teenager, there was no social media. I mean, we had like Myspace, but we didn't have like—we're not on our phones. Like I was excited when I got like a three-way pager. I had my mom's phone until I was 14, she took it back. I didn't have that stuff.

[00:22:57] So, it's so much harder for girls to say, okay, I don't need to necessarily wear a ton of makeup, or wear a super skinny, tight dress, or like have my butt out, you know what I mean? Because there's a culture that's happening, especially out of LA, that's influencing the world, that girls feel like they need to be a certain aesthetic, and they're trying desperately to find themselves in the midst of just noise.

[00:23:28] So, I'm grateful that I didn't have that. But even now, it's more important than ever for young girls to find their power, not just give it away. You don't realize that with Instagram and with social media, you're not just posting a picture, you're not just posting a video, you're giving an energy. So, if the energy is the, Caroline Myss has a word for it, the saboteur or the prostitute archetype, where it's like, I'm for sale, look at me, who wants me, I'm for sale, which is especially difficult for me to see as a woman seeing other women do that, because women are goddesses.

[00:24:13] So, it's like it's not just a picture, what are you saying? What energy are you giving? What are you offering? And what are you taking away from yourself? So, there are deep conversations about it, really, but I think if people are more conscious of, what am I saying with this photo? Am I inviting an energy that I don't actually want or is this something I want and why do I want?

[00:24:38]Luke Storey:  Well, this goes back to that piece you were touching on earlier, of that external validation. And I think that's what's so interesting to me about interviewing someone like you who has such a big public profile, right?

[00:24:51]Kat Graham:  Right. When you think the one thing I care about is that, and now, I care about the least. 

[00:24:58]Luke Storey:  And it really runs through the thread of the whole conversation, right? It's like, how does one not be subject to taking on someone else's perspective of who and what you are? Right? So, when someone makes a critique that's hurtful, or bullying, canceling, all this kind of stuff, it really provides you with more information about their level of consciousness than it does about you, right?

[00:25:21] But still, within that, in order to weather the storm, in addition to that intentionality that you spoke of, so yeah, I can go look cute in a music video, and dance around, and do my thing, but the intention of that is a deeper purpose than just pure entertainment or feeding one's own ego and sense of self-importance. So, underneath that, though, there have to have been, I'm assuming, some tools that you've used or continue to use to really embody that self-worth, where you're free to express yourself and share your God-given gifts with people, but it's not coming from the motivation of, I need that external validation, right?

[00:26:02] So, what are some things that you've done to really go inward, and this might speak to meditation and things like that, to go inward and really identify, okay, this is who and what I am, and to build value, and self-worth, and self-love into that, to become less susceptible to, as Alyson said, either the critic or the person boosting you, right? It's like to maintain that sense of inner balance, and be able to create, and do your art, and express yourself without falling victim to that, and kind of losing sight of the true healthy motive.

[00:26:39]Kat Graham:  Yeah. Meditation is really important. It's pretty much like the cornerstone of my foundation. And if I don't meditate, I start forgetting not just who I am, but what I am. It's also like the reason that I feel like I have a big audience is not because I care about growing them so much, but it's that I constantly remind them, especially I do these weekly chats with my fans about, I pick eight people with my—well, my captain picks them and we sit for like an hour, sometimes, two hours, and we just talk. 

[00:27:16] And I'm constantly reminding them that we're the same. Like don't think that because I'm a celebrity or whatever, they think I am, that I'm different than you. We're equal and you're just as powerful as me, if not more powerful, with more tools than I have when I was your age. And it's about reminding people that we're the same. And I think that's why my audience is growing so much, is they feel that they're actually a part of my journey and a part of that. 

[00:27:43] And another tool, and this is probably not going to be the most positive thing that people expect or necessarily want to hear, you're never going to get the kind of validation that you seek. It doesn't matter if it's an award that you're going after, or the Pulitzer Prize, or the cover of a magazine, or the number one best-selling book, there is nothing in this world that can actually validate you.

[00:28:20] You think it will, and then you're on to the next thing, and then you're on to the next thing. And you'll be searching for your entire life for validation. No spouse is going to give it to you. No amount of money, no kind of ridiculous car that you drive, or the amount of possessions you have. There will not be one thing in this world that will deeply validate you other than you. And I think if we can understand that not only will nothing externally or should nothing externally validate you, but that you are the critic, you are the praise, you are the thing that is against you and for you. 

[00:29:09] It's all you reflecting itself back. We are the universe having a conversation with itself. And the more we understand that or read this book called Vasistha's Yoga, it's 700 pages, but keep it close to or travel with it. And it's a constant reminder that we're in a waking dream. And the less seriously you take the praise, or the aggression, or that you're a fraud, it's so ridiculous, because we're so connected.

[00:29:43] You're all of that. You can't get mad at yourself, and oftentimes, people can only behave based on their level of awareness. So, it's really not anyone's fault for getting angry or happy. They are making their decisions based on the experiences they've had up to that exact moment. So, you can't judge somebody for loving you or hating you, because that's all that they know until they kind of break the matrix, and say, oh, I don't even need to have an opinion about this at all, I'm just going to observe it, right? 

[00:30:23] I'm going to, okay, this is what's happening, got it. I don't need an opinion whether it's good or bad. In fact, I don't even know that there is a good or bad anymore. You get to this kind of state where it's not that you have to just say, oh, I can't look at it or it's good, okay, oh, I'm going to keep reading. You don't want to get to that place, you just have to understand that the value of it is not what you necessarily think it is. You know what I'm saying? 

[00:30:51]Luke Storey:  Yeah.

[00:30:51]Alyson Charles:  Yes.

[00:30:51]Luke Storey:  There's such a beautiful nugget in there and this principle has absolutely transformed my life when it comes to judging other people and condemning other people. Again, going back to that unity consciousness that you spoke about before, when we slip out of that and we forget, and we all forget, every day.

[00:31:14]Kat Graham:  Every day.

[00:31:15]Luke Storey:  Many, many times, there's an us and there's a them, it's how creation designed us, to survive. And when we get caught in that, it's such a crucial, fundamental principle to understand that anyone who we deem to be behaving poorly, as you so indicated, is doing exactly what we would do if we were them. And this is a real stretch mentally, right? So, I mean, I don't want to name names, because it'll be too triggering, but just think of the most abhorrent people in history, right?

[00:31:49] And like, God, how could they have ever done what they did to people that have persecuted and harmed other people in mass? Right? And it's like, well, if you had been born that person, and had every experience that they had in their life and the karma that they inherited when they were born, you would have done the exact same thing. And of course, it doesn't speak to condone bad behavior, but it's just part of that compassion piece that I think is so important. So, you can have an understanding that putting yourself in anyone's shoes, there's kind of an instant empathy and understanding of maybe why they do what they do.

[00:32:30]Kat Graham:  Yeah. Having a spiritual foundation, which is why what you both are doing is so important, can make—so say there are two people, right? I'll use me and maybe someone else who had like somewhat of an abusive childhood, right? So, one person decides to meditate, and say, there's got to be some other way for me to get the love that I'm searching for. And then, there's the other person who's also a victim of abuse, but goes left and decides to abuse other people, because they're on a replay, they're on a repeat, right?

[00:33:12] So, it's like, if you don't have a foundation, though, right, then you run the risk of maybe doing what the pattern behavior would be. But you can break the pattern once you hook into the foundation of consciousness, then you can say, okay, I can take this, and I can actually talk about it and not be emotionally triggered by it. And I can help people. And you know what, maybe I'll even put it into some characters that I do and really inspire people, or I can end up doing drugs, or getting into abusive relationships, or hurting people, because I don't know how to deal with it.

[00:33:56] So, I think that that's a really important moment, when people are like, God, how do I break this pattern? Like I can't break this pattern, and I'm constantly on a repeat in my mind, and I'm saying the same thing over, and over, and over again. You never not see your history, right? You'll never not remember how you might have gotten treated in a relationship or anything that your parents might have done to you or incidents that happened in your lives. They'll never go away. But back to that bravery, if you're brave enough to take ownership of who you are and mix that in with who you understand in your truth as a spiritual person, then you can transmute the energy.

[00:34:52]Alyson Charles:  Yes, I do know what you're saying. I was doing some hardcore alchemizing and transmuting over the last few days, and like it's exactly what you're just saying. And I just want to piggyback for those listening, it, oftentimes, takes years of practice, years of being aware of that one nodule, that one pattern that you're just—I was literally saying this to him on a walk yesterday, I've been so aware of this one portal, this one little notch inside of me, where when that notch is touched, the orb that opens up inside of me is infinite and it's filled with rage. And I have only learned in the last three days how to work with that orb, and I have been working the alchemy for years.

[00:35:41]Kat Graham:  Yes. It's exactly how you're verbalizing it. It's this, oh, it's very—you know exactly what it is, that it's that one thing, that if somebody says that one thing or somebody does that one thing, and then it creates that, whether it's rage and the rage is from the rejection, or the abandonment, or whatever it is, it's just trigger. And you'll never feel like you have self-control as long as that orb is moving.

[00:36:17] So, yes, you don't run away from it. You don't hide from it. You don't drink it away. Because guess what? You're going to sober up and it's going to be right back there. You deal with it. So, that's why I think Modernnirvana has been so helpful, because one thing that I wish I had been taught when I was searching as a teenager and even in my 20s was somebody to say, find the orb, find the thing.

[00:36:46] I had my coach, really, Ivana Chubbuck, my acting coach, who is the one that taught me to transmute all the difficult, unresolved things, and put them into this character that I think people have just completely embraced. She taught me how to shift it, but I wish that people didn't run from that. I wish that that was something that was discussed more in spirituality, because sometimes, you can't just sage it away. You have to really get in there and deal with it. And I don't care if it's like past life regression, I don't care if it's hypnosis, whatever you have to do, find it. Find it, and don't let go of it until you resolve it, and transmute it, and forgive it, and forgive yourself for it, right?

[00:37:34]Alyson Charles:  I wish I had my rattle out right now, I would definitely be rattling to it.

[00:37:40]Kat Graham:  Oh, yeah. Rattle it. I can hear it.

[00:37:41]Alyson Charles:  Okay. Good.

[00:37:42]Kat Graham:  Well, I think this is the value in really celebrating shadow work, right? And some of us do it more publicly than others, some of it is just an internal journey, but that's where the real gold is. It's the darkest places of your past. It's those deep hurts and wounds that, like you said, they just can't be evaded forever. Eventually, they're going to come out in a self-destructive behavior pattern or they're going to come out as what we were talking about earlier, in a projection onto other people, right? I mean, you can see this in social media culture and all the things we've been talking about with the bullying, and canceling, and abuse, and all this stuff. I mean, it's just a hurt person hurting, right?

[00:38:27]Alyson Charles:  And they're struggling, because that orb can be so all-consuming and it's so ungodly uncomfortable to sit in what that orb is producing, the quickest way then is to just project and spew it out onto another so that you're not holding it anymore. So, sorry to cut you off, but that's the important key, and the awareness to remember when you are feeling that all-consuming feeling, yes, it's so uncomfortable, but trust yourself, learn how to trust yourself to sit in that discomfort, and to talk to it, and to understand it more. And that, thread by thread, layer by layer, produces that transmutation and alchemy that we've been talking about.

[00:39:10]Kat Graham:  Absolutely. 

[00:39:11]Luke Storey:  Amen.

[00:39:11]Kat Graham:  Also, like clear around the environment that you live in. If you're living at home with people that are not helping you heal that orb, if you're in a relationship that is constantly creating, making that orb even bigger, like you can take responsibility for yourself, but you also have to take responsibility for the environment that you're putting yourself in, the relationships that you're putting yourself in. You have to give yourself a fighting chance to heal. And a lot of us, sometimes, don't look at, is my job preventing me from healing from this thing?

[00:39:59] Am I contributing to my own imprisonment with this one thing? And we all know, anyone listening, what that one thing is, because we've all had that one thing, right? So, you have to really also hold yourself accountable for where you're actually putting yourself, because you might not be putting yourself in a situation that inspires and promotes healing. You can read all the books in the world and meditate all the live long day, but if you step in a house that's on fire, you're going to get burned. So, just keep it all the way real with yourself also, and say, am I doing the best I could be doing for myself or do I need a change? Right?

[00:40:41]Luke Storey:  There's a great analogy about crabs in a bucket, right? You put a bunch of crabs in a bucket, and one brave crab starts to reach up his claw to get over the edge and get out of the bucket, and inevitably, the other crabs will drag them back down. And I love that analogy, because it represents kind of different levels of consciousness and awareness, right?

[00:41:02] And as one starts to emerge out of those lower realms of emotion and just the state of being, to your point, if that environment around you is still at a lower oscillation, there's going to be resistance, and crabs are going to try to keep you where you are, because misery loves company, right? So, my question for you is in your career or personal life, have there been roles, jobs, friendships, relationships that you identified as not supporting your evolution and your ability to reach out over that bucket that you've had to painfully surrender or move out of?

[00:41:41]Kat Graham:  That's a great question. It's really difficult for me, because any time that something negative would happen, it made me either like a better artist or a stronger person. And I've always been a loner, so I didn't necessarily have a ton of crabs around me to begin with. I homeschooled for high school. It was just like really me and my mom, she was gone most of the day. I was like at home doing home school.

[00:42:14] Like I was just always by my—even when I was on Vampire Diaries, it was like total loner. I had friendships, but I loved kind of just working on my music or writing my little scripts. And so, I've been fortunate that that's a personality trait, but that's not necessarily a common thing. And any time that I felt that I was getting pulled down, like even in moments when I was like doing like Lizzie McGuire or like Hannah Montana, and my teachers would be like, I'm not sending you your homework, you're not in class, you're just going to miss it.

[00:42:51] I'm like, I guess I'll miss it. Like I was one of those kids, so I didn't necessarily feel that. But crabs in a bucket is a very brilliant analogy and a lot of people are feeling like that or they're at a job where that is keeping them down. This time that I actually did feel that, okay, I'm actually being intentionally kept from a higher purpose, I walked away from that job. So, it happened very quickly. 

[00:43:23] And it's always surprising, because sometimes, you don't realize, because I'm a very trusting person, a very open person, but we forget that, sometimes, people have their own things that they are projecting on to you, and that could even manifest as jealousy, or being threatened by you, or things like that. I mean, at the end of the day, I'm still a Black woman, and I'm pretty young, and a lot of people in Hollywood have been very threatened by my popularity or what was happening. And I don't come from famous parents. I'm not like a six-foot tall model, you know what I mean? I'm a scrappy kid from Hollywood.

[00:44:03] So, there were kind of these moments where people would get really surprised by my success, and that would affect them negatively, unfortunately, and I had to kind of cut those people out. Not out of anger, I just have to protect my energy field. I mean, as a shaman, that it's just like a lot of what you do is to protect people from unfortunate, low vibrational energies, and there's something very much to that. You have to protect, a lot of people need a lot of protection, and they don't realize how open that they've left themselves, because a lot of people are trusting.

[00:44:41]Alyson Charles:  Yeah. Well, thank you for being a representative, because as you were sharing what you were just sharing, I just kept hearing the phrase, phoenix rising, phoenix rising. And I think that you are truly a really strong embodiment of that, it's exactly what you were sharing. If anything negative or lower realm was entering into your experience, you somehow innately knew how to do that alchemizing, and to let it rise you, let it lift you, let it take you.

[00:45:12]Kat Graham:  Yeah. And there's a lot of exercises. I don't know if you guys are going to be at the conference, which is really fun. We can maybe do something with everyone where we teach them how to cut energetic ties. That was something that I've had to do. I've had to cut energetic ties, and you go through each of your chakra points, and you cut. And I think that the physicality is just as important as the spiritual.

[00:45:41] Sometimes, you actually have to go through the motions, whether it's through—like I've done a lot of Kundalini breathwork and I've done a lot of karmic cleansing to get to a place where I can feel like, okay, like whatever I get is meant for me, whatever I don't get is clearly not meant for me, because I know that I am in harmony with the universe. I know I am. So, that's really important.

[00:46:04]Alyson Charles:  Yeah, I'm down for doing that. As you know, Luke and I will be sharing about conscious relationships, but I'm down for some good cord-cutting action along the way.

[00:46:13]Kat Graham:  Don't cut him.

[00:46:15]Alyson Charles:  Oh, no, no, no. Yeah. But I did want to make a little bit of a segue, because I also keep hearing in my mind this thing that I want to bring up with you and to not let it go before we get to the end of our time here. And I really loved, I think it was a Vogue video where you just let your natural hair out.

[00:46:35]Kat Graham:  Yeah.

[00:46:36]Alyson Charles:  Oh, I love that-

[00:46:39]Kat Graham:  Yeah. That was really fun. That was really fun. And it went viral. And that was actually from a meditation. I had been in heavy—because it was quarantine and I had time to really—I mean, I don't love just meditating for 15 minutes. Like if I meditate, I can be in there for hours.

[00:47:01]Alyson Charles:  That's Luke.

[00:47:02]Kat Graham:  I just love it. Really?

[00:47:03]Alyson Charles:  Yes.

[00:47:04]Luke Storey:  Yeah. 

[00:47:04]Kat Graham:  Oh, my gosh. Like 5:00 AM to like, I would go until 9:00 or 10:00 AM. I mean, I have a pretty full house with animals and there's just a lot of people in and out in the property. Like you guys said that you live like in farm country, so do I, and it's just like people come in on the property. It's just big. So, I can do that for a long time, but yeah, I was meditating, because I got asked, said, Vogue wants to do a video with you, and I was like reading a lot of Vasistha's Yoga, and having this like nothing really means anything, and all of this is pointless unless you can help humanity.

[00:47:45] And I was just like Vogue, like [making sounds] , I'm not doing that, like let me meditate, let me meditate on it. And I sat in meditation for—normally, I turn off my phone on Sundays unless I'll jump on for, sometimes, like an hour or whatever if I have like an interaction or something I have to do, and then my phone's pretty much off all day, and that was it.

[00:48:13] And I said to my publicist, I said, well, this is what came to me in a meditation, so if I'm not doing this or they want to do something else, it's a pass, I'm not interested. And I said, yeah, they want to do it, and then I did it. And I think that I'm getting closer and closer to all of it, like my entire like full identity always. And I think that that was a really fun video for me to kind of explore that.

[00:48:43] And I think it helped a lot of people, although I don't know, I'm assuming it did, because it went viral and I've heard a lot of great reactions. But at one point, I remember somebody saying, oh, you should see all the comments. I said, I don't give a fuck about the comments. My friends are like, you should see this, and they're like screenshotting the comments, and I'm like, please don't send me comments, I'm not interested in how people felt about it, or if they felt strongly, or didn't. I don't care.

[00:49:08] I just hope and I have faith in some way, because of prayer and meditation, that it helped. My goal was to help, so opinions aren't necessary as long as it helps. And it might have helped one person feel comfortable wearing their hair out, or being themselves, or embracing their curves, or their freckles, or their eyes, or whatever it is, and that's enough for me. And that person might have not left a comment. They might have just changed the way they lived, and that's enough for me. I don't need millions of people to view it. I don't know millions of people to comment on it. I need to know that the person that was meant to see that, to have a shift in their awareness, saw it, and that was my job for that video.

[00:50:01]Alyson Charles:  Absolutely. And that's living by the calls and living by the divine instructions. You are in meditation. You've got that download. You were clear in the intention then. If they're game for this, then this is what I feel called to do. And from that point-

[00:50:18]Kat Graham:  You've got to let go.

[00:50:18]Alyson Charles:  Yes, exactly.

[00:50:18]Kat Graham:  You've got to let it go. You cannot hold on to the outcome, and that is so hard as an actress, let me tell you, because I had an audition yesterday, and I've been obsessing, did I get it? Like God, I've got to take my own advice, you have to let it go, and like live in a divine space of—and clearly, you know what I'm doing, like I'm pretty honest about what I'm doing, so you have to trust, and you have to do your job, whatever that is on this earth, and your true purpose, which is always supposed to be more than just who you are to help humanity, animals, or whatever your awareness is being called to is your purpose, and you got to let it go, and do your job, and say, I did my job.

[00:51:11]Luke Storey:  Well, I don't know how many other 50-year-old dudes watch that video, but I watched the video, too, actually. I don't know if you knew that. So, whenever I interview someone, I just feel into who they are and I find every kind of obscure thing they've done, hopefully, and just going to tap in. But I mean, I'm pretty forthright in my podcast. I mean, I cry all the time on my podcast, like I've learned to become very publicly vulnerable, and it's been a great actual tool for growth for me. But I was watching that like, damn, man, she has no makeup on, like she's doing the whole thing. It was like a video you would have sent to your girlfriend or it's like you were like face time with your girlfriend. I'm like, dude, this is on vogue. com. Like that was kind of a-

[00:51:51]Kat Graham:  Thank you. 

[00:51:52]Luke Storey:  Yeah, that's cool. It was cool.

[00:51:56]Kat Graham:  I mean, that was a time where with everything, and this is still obviously a serious issue, but with Black Lives Matter, and everyone feeling like they just wanted to find their truth more, and realizing how precious life is, and it just felt like the right thing that we needed to do at the right time. And since then, I found moments where I do want to just be like a real person.

[00:52:27] I want to be somebody that I do want to have my moments, and have my books, and have my vibes, and stuff like that, but I do want to be somebody who people feel they have an accessibility to. I think you are less likely to leave a comment for somebody that you feel is an extension of you in some weird way or is a part of you, you're more interested to say—like I learned so much from my audience, we're actually becoming more and more like each other every day.

[00:53:02] And I learned so much from them. And I take them with me in everything that I do, and their perspectives, and their gratitude, over the littlest things. Yeah. I mean, you want to be somebody who—that's the hard part about social media, is you want to show the best versions of yourself, but sometimes, it's actually the most raw, unfiltered parts of you that will be the thing that awakens people. You know what I mean?

[00:53:34]Luke Storey:  Yeah, damn straight. Well, you did a good job with that one. And on that note, also, what I found as I've become more sort of open on a much smaller public platform is that it also gives people permission. It's like you do that, and then maybe another celebrity or just a regular person realizes that we're all human, and is able to embrace that vulnerability and that self-acceptance rather than, oh, so I see this person on the cover of magazines and movies all the time, like you were talking about earlier, that they are the same as me. Like those girls watching that video, going, oh, my God, I've always struggled with my hair, my mom didn't teach me how to do my hair either, and it was always a hot mess, and it always bugged me, whatever their story happens to be.

[00:54:20]Kat Graham:  We got to start giving ourselves more permission to be in our truth. It's scary. It is so scary, but you have to. If God wanted us to all be the same, he would have made us all the same. There is something really profound in the fact that we all look completely different and we all sound completely different. Every part of us is different. How wild is that? And that is not by coinkidink. That is to show us that if we can live with ourselves, and really embrace ourselves, and we can accept each other, even though we're all completely different, then maybe the universe can fully love and accept itself. It could be that deep.

[00:55:18]Luke Storey:  Beautiful.

[00:55:18]Alyson Charles:  Yeah, that was beautiful. I feel like those are a lot of the vibes that you guys are bringing in with the Modernnirvana conference and all the projects that you guys do together, right? I mean, it seems that's one of the threads of the intention, is just to open up that level of infinite expansion into the truth of oneness and all that is. And so, I'm really excited for the conference.

[00:55:42]Luke Storey:  Yeah.

[00:55:43]Kat Graham:  Excited, we're coming to Austin.

[00:55:46]Luke Storey:  Yeah. I'm excited you guys are coming, too. So, for those listening, our individual podcasts will come out on different dates, but August 14th in Austin is the Modernnirvana conference, and we're super excited to participate and get to meet you in person. But perhaps for those listening, give a little overview of how that conference came to be and what they can expect.

[00:56:08]Kat Graham:  So, Deepak Chopra and I did a podcast. It hasn't been released yet. It's called the Consciousness Collective, because I've been obsessed with how different people view consciousness, whether you're a scientist or you're a guru. And Frankie, who, to me, is not just my best friend, but he's somebody who has always represented being a leader for the new generation of spiritual seekers. And he and Deepak did an episode of Consciousness Collective together, and I was like, I need some B roll.

[00:56:49] Like I need like geomeditating, just get like six homies and just like meditate on a beach somewhere, like I don't care, just get me the tape. And he was like, okay, and then cut to the Modernnirvana conference. And I said, a few friends. It was one of those total accident. It was just for B roll. And we realized when 500 people showed up, and Frankie connecting with Bryant over this, okay, there's something here, and then in a meditation last year, probably around the same time that I was meditating about Vogue, I was like, oh, it's a company, got it.

[00:57:29] And then, it's just kind of evolved since then. This conference is really exciting. They have a bunch of vendors that we're really excited about, sponsored by Heart Water, which is a really great water company with 23% of the proceeds actually go back to the communities that don't have access to clean water, and they use a filtration system that uses rainwater, and makes it drinkable. It's such an amazing company. 

[00:57:57] So, we're really excited. We have you guys there. And we're honoring Deepak Chopra. And Dave Asprey is the keynote speaker, so I'm so excited, because I'm like the least biohackey of the group. I'm like, I have crystals, and I have some sage, and some tourmaline should do it. Like I'm that person. Like I don't understand half of it. I just got into red light therapy, which has been great.

[00:58:26] But it's such a great way to bridge science with spirituality and wellness, and how to take care of your body with, okay, and here are the tools that you can take home with you to help you with relaxation or energy, and great people like you both are going to be speaking to help educate people on what they can do to be their best selves. I mean, that's what we want. We want you to be your best self. And what does that look like? And it can look different than what you might have thought it would be. So, it's a super fun group. I mean, we're totally explorers of wellness and giving you the tools that we all need to get there.

[00:59:15]Luke Storey:  Yeah, I'm stoked. Especially after going to the, last Modernnirvana in LA, down by USC, like downtown LA. Super fun, really cool event space. And I was like, oh, these guys are doing cool, because as you said, there was a lot of spirituality-guided meditations, journeys, and this kind of stuff, but then out in the tech hall were just all sorts of rad things to geek out on, which I love BrainTap and all these kind of things.

[00:59:42]Kat Graham:  Yeah, BrainTap will be there. Super fun.

[00:59:43]Luke Storey:  Yeah, these guys are on to something cool, because that's my message too, is merging those two worlds, so I'm stoked. And we're also starved for human connection. Like I miss the events, I miss connecting with people, so it's going to be fun.

[00:59:57]Kat Graham:  Yeah. What's really great is we have Wellness for Humanity there. I mean, we're going to have people show up with a negative COVID test, but in case you haven't been able to get one, we have on site testing, which is going to be really great. You can wear a mask. It's not mandated, but we're all going to be doing our best to keep it safe. Tickets are limited, so we don't want to have a crowd of people.

[01:00:20] We are keeping it very controlled. And you couldn't be in a safer place, with these experts of wellness and giving your body everything that it needs to be at its highest capacity. I mean, for me, the first event that I would want to go to post-COVID would be a wellness event, personally. So, that's, for me, my spiel, but it's going to be so great to have you both there.

[01:00:46]Alyson Charles:  And thank you so much for having us. We're really looking forward to it. And I think you guys really picked the right city. I mean, I'm sure, as you know, Austin-

[01:00:56]Kat Graham:  Clearly. 

[01:00:57]Alyson Charles:  Yeah, we're here. And so, it makes it a very easy commute for us, but the consciousness community here is just astoundingly powerful.

[01:01:08]Kat Graham:  I'm so excited to meet everyone there.

[01:01:10]Alyson Charles:  Yeah, it's going to be incredible.

[01:01:12]Luke Storey:  So, in closing, Alyson, do you want to invite Kat into, guide us through a little.

[01:01:18]Alyson Charles:  Yes, and thank you. I know, I figured you might have forgotten or-

[01:01:22]Kat Graham:  Sure, I did, but that's great.

[01:01:26]Alyson Charles:  So, yes, for the closing of every Ceremony Circle podcast episode, the guest guides listeners in whatever mini-practice rituals, sacred song, anything, poem, whatever they feel called that would just be lovely medicine for the listeners. So, I heard you were open to doing a brief guided meditation.

[01:01:47]Kat Graham:  Yes.

[01:01:48]Alyson Charles:  Okay. And so, whatever you're comfortable with, and if you need a moment to just kind of center and tap in, whatever you need.

[01:01:57]Kat Graham:  Okay. I totally forgot we were doing this, but this is awesome. The boys get to do the meditations usually, because they do them so much and I'm usually the last one that gets asked to do it, because—randomly. I don't know. It doesn't matter. Okay. Anyone who is listening or watching, close your eyes and bring your awareness to your breath. Breathe in love. Breathe out gratitude. Now, as you breathe in, bring your arms above your head and bring them down in prayer position over your heart.

[01:02:48] Now, put your hands on your heart and feel presence in this moment. This moment could be any moment. You are here now. Feel gratitude for the beating of your heart. Feel gratitude for your sight, that you can hear, that you can breathe, that you can see. Now, send gratitude out to your loved ones, your family, your friends, anyone that you've encountered in the past 24 hours. Now, think of a moment, any moment that you can truly be grateful for.

[01:03:54] Could be in the past and present. Call that moment into your being and feel immense gratitude. Call it irrational gratitude. Let it bring a smile to your face. Breathe it in and breathe it out. Is that a coincidence or were you guided in that moment? Remember to walk with this gratitude, gratitude for the trees, for the wind, for the sun, for your safety, for your health, for your mind. Take three deep breaths, and when you're ready, open your eyes.

[01:05:02]Luke Storey:  Alright. I'm going to talk to the guys, and tell them, you got to start leading some meditations. 

[01:05:20]Kat Graham:  Awesome. Will you do that, because no one ever asks me?

[01:05:30]Alyson Charles:  First of all, I could tell he was crying, number one, so powerful energy. And number two, yes, I didn't want you to feel pressured or anything, but I was just hopeful that we could experience you in this way, so I just want to thank you for being willing and open, especially when you're like, oh, right, I'm guiding a meditation today.

[01:06:01]Kat Graham:  Right. It's great. And you know what? The default is always gratitude. Whenever you're struggling, whenever you're confused, or you're worried about an outcome, and you don't know what's happening, and you feel lost, like just gratitude. It's just a straight connection to sources. The best prayer, so always fall into gratitude.

[01:06:22]Alyson Charles:  Yeah, that was incredibly powerful. It brought to me a very specific thing, and I'm guessing it did for you as well when she said to think of a moment you're grateful for, what revealed or what moved you?

[01:06:34]Luke Storey:  It's funny. I was actually just reflecting on the gratitude of just sharing this interview with you as a very recent moment, kind of a present moment. Just loving life, man, and having someone amazing to share it with. Yeah. The takeaway there for me is, what did you say, like irrational gratitude?

[01:06:54]Kat Graham:  I call it irrational gratitude.

[01:06:55]Luke Storey:  I like that.

[01:06:57]Kat Graham:  Part of my meditations, I do this thing, and when I'm sitting, I practice, I call it irrational gratitude, and I'm just grateful. And I fill my entire being up with gratitude to the point where I usually just start bawling, crying. And yes, I think of specific things. I think of all the people that I'm helping or I think of the things that I have, but most of it is gratitude for things that might not even be in existence, things that I'm just so grateful that I have.

[01:07:35] I just call it irrational, because it's more gratitude than I have normally expressed, things that in our human mind, we don't necessarily think of. I just drop to my knees and I have just pure gratitude. And then, I find like every little thing, I have a roof over my head or clothes on my back and clean water, and I just feel it, I just tighten my whole body, I mean, just so grateful, and so happy, and just so grateful to God. And yeah, it helps, it works, and I feel so much more connected to God. And I do it with nature, too. I feel so grateful for nature, for sure.

[01:08:22]Luke Storey:  Thank you for sharing that, and thanks for coming on today. And I look forward to see you August 14th here in Austin, Texas.

[01:08:29]Alyson Charles:  Yeah.

[01:08:31]Kat Graham:  Yes. I'm super excited and I hope that anyone listening or watching felt the love that we have for you guys, and excited to see you all in person. And yeah, thank you guys for your podcast.

[01:08:45]Alyson Charles:  Yeah. And we'll be sure to, of course, have the link for people to join us at the conference on our show notes and post it everywhere, so we can have a really lovely consciousness expanding party. And yeah, just thank you. 

[01:08:59]Kat Graham:  And fun.

[01:09:00]Alyson Charles:  And fun, yes. Lots of fun. And thank you so much for bringing all of the wisdom that you've gained through your courageous earth walk and thank you for all your energy here, sister.

[01:09:12]Kat Graham:  Thank you. Yes. Ditto. Really.

[01:09:15]Luke Storey:  Thanks, Kat. We'll see you soon.

[01:09:29]

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