[00:00:00]Luke Storey:  I'm Luke Storey. For the past 22 years, I've been relentlessly committed to my deepest passion, designing the ultimate lifestyle based on the most powerful principles of spirituality, health, psychology. The Life Stylist podcast is a show dedicated to sharing my discoveries and the experts behind them with you. Alright. 

[00:00:25]Christine Hassler:  Alright. 

[00:00:25]Luke Storey:  Here we are. 

[00:00:25]Christine Hassler:  Here we are. 

[00:00:28]Luke Storey:  We meet again. 

[00:00:29]Christine Hassler:  I'm so excited to see you.

[00:00:30]Luke Storey:  Likewise.

[00:00:31]Christine Hassler:  Was Dispenza the last time I saw you? 

[00:00:33]Luke Storey:  Palm Springs.

[00:00:34]Christine Hassler:  Wow. It's been a minute.

[00:00:35]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And that's when I had first started dating Alyson.

[00:00:38]Christine Hassler:  Yes.

[00:00:39]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And we went out to eat and, yeah, that was an exciting time.

[00:00:44]Christine Hassler:  And I was so excited because I knew her well through Instagram, so I knew her through my phone, but I was like, that's an awesome match.

[00:00:50]Luke Storey:  And it was really actually, and I don't want to get into relationships because we're going to do another podcast, so as I was preparing my manuscript, I was like, no relationship stuff, Luke, save it, but it was actually really expanding for me to go eat with you too. And just to witness like a conscious evolving couple is really inspiring.

[00:01:13]Christine Hassler:  Thank you.

[00:01:14]Luke Storey:  Yeah, because that's one thing that's a challenge, and I think for many people, is you're really committed to your path, and you might meet someone that you like or love, and they are on a different path.

[00:01:25]Christine Hassler:  It's hard. I've been there.

[00:01:26]Luke Storey:  Yeah. I have too. So, I was like, seeing you guys do your work together, and helping people, and serving based on your gifts and your wisdom was really neat.

[00:01:35]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, I held out for almost a decade for him. I waited, because I mean, I was divorced, and then thought I'd find somebody pretty quickly after that. I never thought it would be a decade, but it was almost a decade. But it was worth the wait, because to have someone that I can, one, just totally be me and I don't have to hide any of my woo-woo stuff, or any of my psychology stuff, or pretend is great. And then, to have someone that values what I do so much is everything.

[00:02:05]Luke Storey:  Yeah, it is. It's fun. It's fun. I'm experiencing that too. There's one thing he said, and I'll probably repeat this in our podcast, but I've quoted you so many times, and I think the first time I quoted you, I was like, who was that? And then, eventually, I was like, oh, yeah, it's Christine, but we were talking about the feeling you get when you meet someone. And just the nature of co-dependent, addictive relationships, and all of that stuff, which I've explored ad infinitum. And you said, Luke, when you meet the right person, it just feels like, I think you said, it doesn't feel like a drug. 

[00:02:41]Christine Hassler:  It doesn't feel like fireworks, yeah.

[00:02:42]Luke Storey:  It feels like home. I was like, oh, shit. Like I used to think that would have sounded boring.

[00:02:52]Christine Hassler:  Where's the high? 

[00:02:53]Luke Storey:  Yeah. But having enough experiences where it felt like a drug, both the good parts and the downside of drugs, I thought, wow. Yeah. And it was starting to shape up that I have that sense with Alyson and what you described to just really being able to be your fullest, most brilliant sloppiest self, and just get nothing but unconditional love in return for that is pretty magical.

[00:03:16]Christine Hassler:  It really is.

[00:03:17]Luke Storey:  Yeah. So, anyway, we'll get into that. I want to start, I've been listening to your podcast a lot, which I always do before I'm going to interview someone. I just consume any content they have. And you commute quite a ways here in Austin if you're staying in the outskirts, so I can get a podcast in just about everywhere I go. but I was really enjoying the coaching ones that you do with people. And I was really getting a sense of your gifts and wisdom. And based on that, it was like going to be such an easy conversation for me.

[00:03:48] And unlike most podcasters, I typically kind of skip people's origin stories because I don't know, I just get bored, I guess, because I already know it, because I've researched the person. So, unless there were like key nuggets or takeaways that I just have to throw in there to create context, I typically just kind of like get right into your knowledge base. But I did want to briefly touch on your former career in Hollywood because I feel like we're both sort of refugees of that world, right? 

[00:04:17]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:04:18]Luke Storey:  And I was in it for, oh, God, like 17 years. And I think you moved there when you were 20.

[00:04:26]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. And I was in it before that. So, I was an actor as a kid.

[00:04:30]Luke Storey:  Oh, okay.

[00:04:30]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. And so, I grew up in Dallas and there was this place called the Young Actors Studio. And the reason my parents got me into acting is because there was a lot of teasing at school, and an I hate Christine Club was started, and I just didn't have friends. And they saw me just start to really wither away, and get depressed, and was put on antidepressants. And they thought acting might be something where I could find my voice again. And it was a really good call by my parents. 

[00:04:59] And I was resistant at first because I was so insecure. But when I got into acting and someone gave me lines to read, it was like, it took the pressure off of being me because I just didn't like me. I thought me had no value in the world. But I would read those lines and I could be somebody else. I could be funny, or I could be dangerous, or I could be all these different people. And I loved it. I loved it. And I think when we love something, it also gives us such a relief.

[00:05:26] We tend to be kind of good at it. And so, I ended up getting scouted in Dallas because the woman who ran the studio would bring in agents, and casting directors, and spent a couple of summers out in the valley in Hollywood doing auditions and all kinds of stuff. But eventually, I realized rejection was so hard for me. Rejection is my core wound. If you want to be an actor, rejection, rejection, rejection, and more rejection, and rejection. 

[00:05:56] And they give you reasons too. Like your hair is the wrong color. You're too fat. You're too thin. It's like really hard. And after doing that for a while, I just said, I can't do this. It's too much. But I still love this craft and I love this industry. So then, I went to college, and decided to go behind the camera, and pursued a career in production, and eventually, agents.

[00:06:14]Luke Storey:  And this isn't true for all people because I'm a huge fan of film, and the arts, and all of that. And Hollywood does produce a lot. But I think when you get behind the scenes in Hollywood, it's pretty creepy. It's difficult, I think, for people that aren't in it to understand like the politics, and just so much of the depraved nature of the industry, and where it's located in the whole thing. It's hard core. I think the further I got away from it, the more I realize like, wow, I was involved in a really weird industry. 

[00:06:53]Christine Hassler:  It is. It's so magical in so many ways. And like you said, there are incredible things about it. But I think about me and the reason I was drawn to Hollywood. So, I was drawn into Hollywood because I was desperately insecure and wanted to prove myself to the world. Like that was one of the things that drove me to this industry. And I think that drives a lot of people. So, you've got a lot of insecure people looking for a way to fill a void, and that's going to create a lot of issues. And like I moved out there when I was 20. I quit my job like 25.

[00:07:22] So, I was only in it five years, but I dated, at the time, a really big wig in Hollywood. So, I really got to get in and see. And at first, I thought, oh, wow, this is so cool. I'm meeting all these celebrities, but it also was like pulling the curtain back on The Wizard of Oz, going, oh, wait, these people are just as messed up inside as I am. Like there's no hope for me down this road. So, really seeing that was part of what eventually made me leave the industry, because I was like, I don't think this is the answer. This isn't the answer to what I'm looking for. This isn't going to be the thing that, all of a sudden, makes me feel better about myself.

[00:07:57]Luke Storey:  I'm going to kind of speed to the end of the story, and ask you, I think, a really important question for so many people right now that have had their lives overturned by COVID, and so many people are without work, and the world and this country are just kind of upside down. And I think a lot of people are probably have either lost their job, or career, or are really realizing as they've been working from home or working remotely, et cetera, or have been considered non-essential, that what they were perhaps doing for work was not their true calling, and their mission, and passion. And I know you do a lot of coaching to help people discover what that is. 

[00:08:39] What would be sort of an overview of your blueprint for finding out what your true purpose is here on the planet, A. And B, what about those people who perhaps have a grandiose idea about what their purpose is? Like I think I talked about on the show the other day, I call it the American Idol syndrome, where like, I'm the best singer in the world, and everyone in the room is like, oh, my God, you're tone-deaf, like you're not going to make it as a singer. So, I think that's something that's kind of a two-parter. Like how can we really zero in to what our unique gift is, and then also reconcile that what we're passionate about might not be the thing we're most talented at or have an aptitude for becoming highly successful in?

[00:09:26]Christine Hassler:  Well, that's a big question. You might have to remind me of some of those parts, but I think I got A and B mostly. I'll start with A, and then you can help me. So, for me, the purpose of our life is not tied to a career at all. And I think this is where a lot of us get off track and where a lot of us suffer in terms of our career because we think that our purpose on the planet is to do something or to be something. And what I've learned over the years, often, the hard way, is that, really, our purpose is to grow our consciousness.

[00:09:54] Our purpose is to return more and more to love. Move away from fear into love. Deprogram a lot of the beliefs that got programmed early. Heal some of the wounds. Really evolve our consciousness. And have our soul, and if you don't like the word soul, you can just think of like your higher self really evolved so that things that bothered you five years ago don't bother you today. That really is the purpose, growth and evolution. Our career is an expression.

[00:10:22] It's just something we get to play with, just like we get to play with relationships, and enjoying amazing food, and we get to play with travel. It really is an expression. Now, that said, I know that having a fulfilling career is really important. Like no one wants to go to a job that's toxic every day. No one wants to go, and just sit, and just be miserable every day. And so, it's like, how do we find that sweet spot between knowing that we can't find the purpose of our life and our career, but we also want to be satisfied.

[00:10:54] So, there's a couple of ways I like to explore it. He said the word passion. So, if we look at the original definition of the word passion, do you know what it is? Suffering. Passion of the Christ. So, the actual origin of that word is passion. And speaking of compassion, co means with, passion means suffering. So, when we're being compassionate, we're being with someone's suffering. So, we've evolved this word passion over the years to mean this thing that we love to do.

[00:11:23] And it clicked for me when I was like, wow, the thing that I love to do, coaching, and facilitating, helping people really grow, comes from my suffering. I never would have gotten into this work if it hadn't been for my own suffering, my own struggles, my own heartbreak. It was because I needed a way out of my own suffering. So, often, how we find our passion in life or even our purpose is to look at our suffering.

[00:11:52] What are the things that we've really struggled with? What are the things that we've gotten to the other side of that make us guides in a lot of ways and that make us really connected to it? Because when we feel so connected to something, it feels more purposeful. So, that's always a really good place to look. Where have you suffered? What are the things that you've gotten to the other side of? What is the wisdom you've gained? And how can that translate into—it doesn't have to be, alright, well, I've struggled so much with my life, I'm going to become a coach or a therapist.

[00:12:19] You could just think of certain lessons that you've learned. Maybe because of that, you're naturally just empathetic. So, you want to do things that involve people, that involve understanding people. Maybe you've had to figure out a lot of stuff out in your life because your parents weren't around and you had to like fend for yourself. Maybe you want to do something where you're really good problem solver. So, we can start to connect the dots. And another place to really look is what we love to do as a kid. Our inner child is so wise and we are so tapped in to our truest gifts when we're little. What did you like to do as a kid, just out of curiosity?

[00:12:54]Luke Storey:  The thing that came to mind right away, and it's funny because we were talking about hunting moments ago before we recorded, but when I was a kid, I lived in a country. It's very much like where we are at here is like where I grew up in Northern California, and also lived in Colorado and Idaho. So, I grew up in the country. And it was catching animals. And not killing them, I actually didn't like killing them. Even fishing, when I was a little kid, I was soft. You know what I mean?

[00:13:20]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:13:20]Luke Storey:  Even if you catch and release, like taking the hook at them, like, I think, his gills are ruined like I'm a bad person. But my dad was really rugged hunter-fisher. So, the way to spend time with my dad was to interact with nature. And even though I didn't like killing things, I like catching them and playing with them.

[00:13:35]Christine Hassler:  What did you like about catching and playing?

[00:13:39]Luke Storey:  I think it's just an innate human tendency to hunt and capture creatures, probably for the purpose of eating them, but when you have a McDonald's down the road, you don't need to eat the gopher snake that you caught under a log in the apple orchard. I think it was just like that connection to nature and just my fascination with all of the different species of animals that exist out there, and the way that they look, and move, and act. 

[00:14:08]Christine Hassler:  See, curiosity, right?

[00:14:09]Luke Storey:  Yeah. There you go, yeah. 

[00:14:10]Christine Hassler:  And that's so much what you do now. Like now, you catch a podcast guest. It's just a little different. He's not going to let me out, guys. And you're curious about it. And there's that fascination. And so, it's like there are always clues. There are always clues. So, those are the kind of questions we can ask ourselves. What's been my suffering? What have I learned from that? How can I evolve my suffering into things that I love? What are the things that I love to do as a kid?

[00:14:36] And it's not a direct translation. Like if you love playing fireman, it doesn't mean you go be a fireman. But what did you love about that? And can you extract those qualities? Because so often, we're pushed into a career path by expectations, pressures from our parents, pressures from society, fears about money. If we grew up in a lot of scarcity, we saw our parents struggle, it's like, oh, I can't possibly pursue art because my parents struggled, I better go to law school.

[00:15:01] So, oftentimes, we choose these path based on fears, based on unresolved issues, based on things other people told us. And then, we reached this point where we're 10, 20, 30 years into your career, going, who am I? Like how did I get here? And then, the bigger question, how do I get out? Because it's become such a comfort zone. That's the hardest thing with career transition, is jumping into uncertainty. Actually, it's the hardest thing in just life, it's just jumping into any uncertainty.

[00:15:27] I think we're seeing that so much this year. People are just massively triggered by the amount of uncertainty. And we're realizing, wow, like we really don't do well in mass uncertainty. So, when we're thinking about making a career transition, we've got to be okay with the uncertainty and know that we may not jump from a job we hated right into a job we love. It might be, when I was little and I used to cook spaghetti, I throw noodles against the wall, and if it stuck, it was done, if not, more time.

[00:15:57] And sometimes, it's like that. You just throw a bunch of noodles against the wall and see what sticks. And I know people listening are like, well, I have to pay my bills. And I went through that too when I did the job transition from Hollywood into what I did now. I was a hand model. I was a personal trainer. I worked for another company. I did bookkeeping. I did whatever I could to start to build this up. So, sometimes, we need those jobs that just give us a security when we're building something we love. It just doesn't happen overnight.

[00:16:26]Luke Storey:  Yeah. I think there's a lot of great information in there. First thing that struck me was that our purpose doesn't necessarily equate to what we do for work. And I think that that's something that would be difficult for me to accept, doing something that is not my true, deepest passion for a job and having to relegate my passion/purpose into something that's a hobby. I think that's something difficult for people to reconcile. So, it's like, how do you find a vocation that you don't totally hate? You know what I mean? 

[00:17:03]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:17:04]Luke Storey:  That you feel like you're making a meaningful contribution to society, and you're paying your bills, taking care of your family, yourself, but at the same time, knowing that like that's what you do, that's not who you are, and that distinction of—I mean, for me, I view my purpose here in so much the same way. And that is like, I'm going for enlightenment. I want to evolve as much as humanly possible while I'm here in this realm, in this body. And a lot of it is just, I don't want to keep having to go through this karmic cycle.

[00:17:32]Christine Hassler:  Go through the same thing over and over again, it's like, I'm not doing this again, yeah.

[00:17:35]Luke Storey:  It's like here to learn, and to evolve, and to change. And so, I think I am fortunate, in that a lot of what my career now entails is actually just doing that work with myself, sharing what I find to be meaningful and successful with other people. 

[00:17:52]Christine Hassler:  Well, here's one thing I've noticed that may fill in some gaps here. I mean, I've been coaching people for 16 years, so I've noticed a lot of patterns over the years. And I've had a lot of people come to me because they're miserable in their career. And they come to me, because they say, I need you to help me figure out what I want to do with my life. I'm like, sure, we'll eventually get there, but we're going to start with childhood and we're going to start with how you got here.

[00:18:15] Before we look at where we want to go, we have to look at how did we get to where we are. Because if we just think about, okay, how do I get to where I want to be and we don't look at where we've been, we're just going to be in a loop. We're just going to repeat things. We'll maybe get the next job that we think is great, but we have a toxic boss again, or we're not making the money we want, or so on and so forth. So, people come, they say, I want a career change, and I say, let's dig a little. 

[00:18:40] Let's look at how you got here. Let's look at some limiting beliefs. Let's look at the patterns. Let's look at the unresolved stuff. Let's look at emotions that you swept under the rug 20, 30 years ago, and you still haven't lifted it up, and just swept more under there. And what I've seen is that as people make their own evolution and their own healing, their purpose, just let the job be what it is, naturally, by default, another opportunity comes, or they have an insight, or because they've transformed, the people they work with aren't bugging them as much, or all of a sudden, they get that promotion, or they have a new relationship to their job.

[00:19:19] So, this looking at our purpose, being that evolution and that development, it handles so many other things in our life. I mean, I've really built my career. Yes, I've done things and done like linear, plan-based, goal-oriented things, but most of it has come from making my number one purpose my own healing and my own evolution. And as that happens, different opportunities come in, different insights come in. And it's so out of the way we're taught. We're taught, work hard, do this, have a plan, that to go into, oh, if I just work on myself, things may start working out.

[00:19:58] That's a big leap for people to make. But I really see that as one of my purposes, is being like, alright, I know you're here, and you want to get here, but you're not going to get here the same way you got there. So, we've got to find another route. And often, it is going inside and doing that work that can be really terrifying, and really confronting, and can kind of go, I just wanted to change my career, now, I'm dealing with what happened to me at six years old? Like I just want this to stop.

[00:20:25] I just want a different job. But that different job is never the answer to the problem. Anybody right now that's miserable in their job, I would question you, and really ask like, where else are you miserable? Like where else are you not being authentic? Where else have you said yes when you really meant no? Where else are you not speaking your truth? We don't just end up somewhere without any reason for being there.

[00:20:50] And when we can take real personal responsibility, not total self-blame, but just responsibility, so we move out of victim and start to realize, wait a second, like I do have some choices here. Even if I can't change my job right now because I have to pay my bills, I have a choice in how I relate to it. I have a choice in how much I complain about it. I have a choice in how much I blame others about it. So, we always have choice.

[00:21:16]Luke Storey:  That's really good. So, it's like being in a situation in your life and career that's unsatisfactory seems like it's the root of your problem, right? Because every day, you're going in like, oh, God, here I am in the cubicle again or whatever your situation happens to be. So, it seems like I just need to fix these exterior things, and then I'll feel contentment, and all will be well. But really, it's about the root cause of what ended you up in a situation that is unhealthy for you.

[00:21:47]Christine Hassler:  Exactly. I mean, I had an amazing life at 25. I had a job people work years for. I was dating somebody that could give me access to anything. I was hanging out with celebrities. I was making stupid money for a 25-year-old, and I still wasn't happy. And I'm so glad I learned that at a young age of like, the answer is never in someone or something else. Those things never make us happy. Sure. There are things that are more aligned that can bring us way more enjoyment.

[00:22:20] And we were talking earlier about, relationship that's not a fit versus a relationship that is, big difference, but a lot of that is because of who we're being. You found a lot of your own answers inside before Alyson came along, same with me with Stef, and same with my career. Like I had to get to a place where I was really like okay with me before I started having a career I really, really love. So, you're absolutely correct from my point of view. Like we look to the exterior, such a human thing, we look at the exterior to either blame or to make us feel better. And it's neither one of those things.

[00:22:57]Luke Storey:  Yeah. That's the lowest hanging fruit, is you're uncomfortable by some parameter in your life, and it just seems like if you fix that surface thing, then you'll solve your problems.

[00:23:06]Christine Hassler:  All will be well.

[00:23:08]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And also, kind of in the side hustle transition too, I think that the initiative that it takes to make that change does come from the inner growth, right?

[00:23:26]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:23:26]Luke Storey:  So, when your life is more aligned to your spiritual purpose, then you start to become more curious and more magic starts to happen. You start to manifest different relationships and be tuned into science that you're given, hey, there's a little nudge, go this way, go that way. And that was my experience with starting this podcast a few years ago, and moving into this health and wellness space as a career.

[00:23:52] There was no plan to do that, I just started getting pulled more professionally into what served, which happened to be for me, my life's purpose and career happen to align, but it's probably due to the fact that my life's purpose had become more and more clear. And so, there became a discord between what I was doing professionally to where it just became unbearable, even though it was a job like yours that many people thought, oh, my God, that's the coolest job ever. It's like a shoeshine boy for celebrities, basically. They call you a fashion stylist, but really, sometimes, you run around buying Spanx at Target and whatever. 

[00:24:35]Christine Hassler:  Spanx are great.

[00:24:35]Luke Storey:  Yeah. But it's just like, at one point, I'm going, why am I doing this? I'm not really helping people. I mean, I'm helping someone get through a photoshoot, but it's not really having an impact on their life.

[00:24:49]Christine Hassler:  So, when you asked yourself that question, why am I doing this? Was there an answer?

[00:24:53]Luke Storey:  Oh, yeah, like so many of the things I've done. And this goes back to the American Idol syndrome a little bit, too. Like I used to be a musician, and then I would have a waiter job or a number of other illegal jobs that we won't mention here. But it was always about the music. And over time, as I started to work on myself, I realized, yeah, I'm very passionate about music and I love music, but I don't want to do music as a career solely because I love music, I want to do it because my self-worth and my identity was attached to it.

[00:25:26] And when that didn't pan out and I had never made enough money playing music to support myself as even like a broke-ass musician, let alone ever hope to buy a home or achieve any of my financial goals, then I just kind of was haphazardly thrown into the fashion and entertainment industry. And that was not something I ever really enjoyed or felt I was particularly great at, but it sounded cool. You know what I mean? So, as I started to dig deeper, I was like, wow, once I stopped playing music, I was like so relieved. And I thought, oh, why am I relieved? I thought I love music. I'm like, no, I love music, but I don't love it as a job because my motives for doing it were based on validation.

[00:26:09]Christine Hassler:  There's so much pressure. The stakes are so much higher when what we're doing is—because the ego is so tied to surviving. And how the ego survives is through validation, through feeling like we belong, feeling like we're somebody, feeling like we have meaning in our life. And a lot of those things are important. The ego isn't a bad thing. It's natural. But that validation thing, that's a really big one, and when we outsource that, whatever we outsource it to has the power.

[00:26:37] So, like in that situation, like the industry had the power, or the gig had the power, or whatever it was, because we're outsourcing that validation, which is a human need. We need to feel like, hey, you're pretty cool. Like good job. Like we all need that. It's that when we switch from, I need it from this thing out here, to, I can really give it to myself and I can get it from people who are my soul family. 

[00:27:00] People I really trust, and who really see me, and who aren't validating me based on what I do, they just see me for who I am, it's like, oh, that's the validation I was always looking for. I was never looking for, oh, Luke, you're such a great musician, or, oh, Christine, like you produced a great movie. It was, Luke, I see you and I really, really like you, period. That's what we're all looking for. But because we don't get a lot of that, especially as children, then we're looking for that thing. Like that thing to make me feel like I'm enough. 

[00:27:33]Luke Storey:  Yeah, show the world that you're worthy.

[00:27:36]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, it's a human thing. I have yet to meet one person who doesn't deal with the I'm not enough monster. We all have our version of where it shows up in our life. And it still shows up for me. I'm sure there'll be a part of me that watches this podcast, and goes, oh, I shouldn't have said that, or that was a stupid thing to say, or we have that inner critic that's like, you didn't do good enough, and we're tied to this part of us that beats us up, because we think that without that, we'll just crumble, that we need it to move forward or to be better. 

[00:28:08] And what I've learned about the inner critic over the years is that it actually really doesn't make me better. It pushes me not always to the things that I really wanted. Like pushes me hard, but it doesn't make me better. What I found that actually makes me better and makes me grow is that voice of compassion. And so, I've had to learn because I have a fierce inner critic. She's better over the years. I've worked with her, but she used to be ruthless. Ruthless, like anything that I did, any goal I accomplished, I'd celebrate for maybe 0.5 Seconds, and then it was right into, what could have been different, or what I could have done better, what the next thing would be. 

[00:28:48] And I've had to learn to work with that inner critic and talk to it, because we tend to think our critical voice is us, but it's not. It's just a voice. And so, I've had to talk to that part of me, and go, okay, Christine, like you're being really hard on yourself, is there another way we could talk about the situation, and talk back and forth, and separate it out so that I could find another voice inside of me? And we can't criticize our inner critic, because a lot of times, when the critical voice comes up, we're like, oh, I shouldn't judge myself, I'm being mean to myself, or there's my inner critic again, and then we're just criticizing the inner critic and we're in a vicious cycle.

[00:29:21] So, I've had to learn to even love my inner critic and know, on some level, she's just trying to help me. She's just trying to protect me from rejection, protect me from feeling alone, protect me from messing up, protect me from shame or embarrassment, protect me from not living up to my expectations and being disappointed with myself, but I've had to work with that part of me so that I can do that. I can still protect myself from those things, but in a much more loving way.

[00:29:47]Luke Storey:  You mentioned earlier limiting beliefs, and this is something that I ponder a lot because there's a belief that one can find within themselves through that inner critic, right? 

[00:29:59]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:29:59]Luke Storey:  Like who am I kidding to try to do this as a career? Who am I kidding to try to date that person? Whatever it might be, right? And there's a part of you that's observing that phenomenon of the inner critic. And I would call that a limiting belief because it's something that you're aware of and it's a belief system. It's something you hold to be true, whether or not it is. But underneath that is this, and you mentioned the word shame too, underneath that, for those of us that had challenging childhoods, which is probably 99.9% of the population, there's something that's below a belief and it's a felt sense of not being worthy. 

[00:30:39] Even if, in a cognitive way, we're thinking, oh, I'm a good person, like I'm good-looking, I'm successful, like all the boxes might be checked, but for so many of us, myself definitely included, there's an underlying sense of not being deserving of love, or of success, or whatever it is that a healthy, fully integrated human being would be able to cultivate and manifest in their life. I think in a lot of the manifestation, success-driven teachings, it often has a hard time getting at the root, like way, way underneath there.

[00:31:20] And that's been definitely true for me. And I've done a lot of deep excavation in the past couple of years, and I've moved mountains with the assistance of plant medicines and all sorts of things that have just really, really moved the needle for me. But what do you teach or recommend for people to get underneath that conscious belief into that felt sense of who we are, and in that, finding that sense of deserving and self-worth that we might be able to build a life on top of and not feel like we're a fraud.

[00:31:52]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, great question. So, I think that at the core of that belief of not being deserving or I'm not enough is because there's a separation from God, or from love, or from source, whatever we want to say it. Like I'm sure you've had plant medicine experiences where you've really felt unconditional love and you felt that God energy, and usually like, I'm so loved, I finally get it. And as babies and as children, we're still really tapped into that.

[00:32:23] We're still really tapped into that, I'm just going to use God energy, insert whatever word works for you. And then, life happens and that cord starts to get fuzzier. And eventually, a lot of us, especially if our innate relationship with God and our spiritual self isn't nurtured, we lose that connection. So, who do we project God on? Mom and dad. They become God. They become the two people, or whoever was your primary caretaker, that you're looking for, for that love. 

[00:32:58] Because think of it, when we come into this world as new souls, we just come from this world of so much love and we come into the human world. And so, we're still looking for that unconditional love and deservingness. So, it's like, oh, you two people will give it to me or whoever is that parental role. And so, when that person, mom or dad, doesn't love us that way or see us that way, it's devastating. And we take everything so personally as children. I mean, as adults, we can start to separate some things. 

[00:33:29] Like if somebody says something crappy to us, we can kind of go, oh, they're having a bad day, not take it personally. But as children, especially from our parents, anything they say or anything they do, they could get divorced and tell you it wasn't your fault, but still, on some level, you believe it was. So, it's like anything is taken so personally. And we're just looking for that love. We're just looking for that unconditional, I want to know I'm enough, I want to know I matter.

[00:33:55] And so, to me, that's really at the core of most people's issue, is there's certain things that happened in your life that made you go, oh, wait, I'm not safe. Oh, wait. I really can't be who I am. Oh, wait. I'm really not enough. And we all have different significant events or it can just be cumulative years of having a parent who is emotionally unavailable and feeling like we weren't worthy enough to have their attention. But that's really, when I work with people and we start to get to the core, I really try to help them unpack.

[00:34:30] Like what were some of those early life experiences that made you start to feel like you weren't lovable, that you weren't enough in some way? Because as kids, there's what happens, and then there's a meaning we give it. And as kids, if we had, let's say, an emotionally unavailable mom or an alcoholic father, we couldn't say, oh, well, she didn't get the love she needed as a child, and so she just can't love me or he just has too much stress in his life and can't handle his feelings, so he's drinking.

[00:34:56] We can't make sense of it as children. We just think something's wrong with us. So, we've always got to go back. That's why I'm such an advocate teacher of inner child work, of going back to our childhood and giving ourselves what we didn't get. So, what that looks like, and let me just preface this by saying, you don't have to remember your childhood to do inner child work. That's the number one question I get when I talk about inner child work.

[00:35:20] People say, I have no memories of my childhood. Doesn't matter. Because whatever you're feeling now, anxiety, not enough knows, low self-worth, overwhelm, scarcity, you felt as a child. So, all you have to do is sort of ride those feelings back in time to your childhood. And even if you don't remember the actual events that were happening, you can connect with that little one inside of you and give her the chance to express feelings. Is it making sense so far? 

[00:35:49]Luke Storey:  Mm-hmm.

[00:35:50]Christine Hassler:  So, what that looks like is actually going back to maybe when we were three years old or four years old, if you know that was a time when, let's say you had a sibling born, and all of a sudden, you went from being the center of attention to the attention got diverted. And all of a sudden, you started feeling not enough or you started feeling like there was more pressure on you to be good because there is a baby. There are all kinds of things that happen in our childhood. 

[00:36:16] We can go back to that three or four-year-old, even if we don't have the memory, we kind of know what happened, and just connect in, and be like, how are you doing? How are you feeling? Because as children, we're not really asked a lot. How are you doing? How are you feeling? What's going on in there? Oh, you're angry. Okay. Be angry. That's okay. I'm here. Be as angry as you need to be. Do you want to hit that pillow? Do you want to make some sounds? Go for it.

[00:36:39] We usually get, be quiet, you're too loud, be good girl, be a good boy, or there's so much chaos in our house, we have to stuff all our emotions inside. So, we don't really get the opportunity as children to really emote and really express what's going on. We don't feel safe enough to do that.

[00:37:17] That is like the sweet spot of really being able to change your life, is when triggers come up, because most triggers have nothing to do with what's going on in present time, they're always tied back to something, I won't say always, most of the time, tied back to something, and if we can find that inner parental voice, that's like, I'm here, I love you, you are safe, I got you, what are you feeling? What is this reminding you of? My favorite question to ask anybody when they're triggered, is what is this reminding you of?

[00:37:47]Luke Storey:  That's good. I like that.

[00:37:48]Christine Hassler:  Because it's like, in that moment, there's what's happening and we're so mad of what's happening, I'm like, what is this reminding you of? When have you felt like this before?

[00:37:56]Luke Storey:  I wish I would have known that last night because Alyson and I had a moment last night. And I mean, it's rare that we have a moment, and when it is, we're usually laughing about it within a short period of time, and then seeing what it was, but that would have been a great question last night, because it happened to be that I was the one that was in the air and having that pointed out. But I didn't think the punishment fit the crime. Basically, like I had just been spaced out, forgot to include her in a text thread, and things got wonky, and it had hurt her feelings.

[00:38:32] She's probably in here going, can you stop sharing about every detail of our personal life? But, in the talk, I'm sitting there thinking, what the fuck, man? I didn't do anything? And it's got something. It wasn't like I was maliciously attempting to exclude someone from the plan or not, whatever. I'm generally pretty thoughtful, especially about someone I care so deeply about. But we both eventually arrived at, oh, you used the words that's reminding me of this, but we're able to get to what was underneath that.

[00:39:06] And once I could see in her experience what was underneath that, it was so easy for me to see, oh, yeah, duh, of course, that was her feeling experience, that makes total sense logically now. We're in the moment, typical male/female brain in the moment, I'm like, this makes no sense. I'm trying to be compassionate, but I'm like, you're nuts. Like I didn't do anything wrong.

[00:39:29]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. 

[00:39:31]Luke Storey:  But seeing what it perhaps reminded her of or what was underneath that, you're instantly in that place of compassion, and empathy, and then can see, oh, okay, I can see how that situation was perceived as such. And there are so much healing and forgiveness within that.

[00:39:47]Christine Hassler:  And it was felt that way, like if it had a trigger. So, if that was you and me in that situation, it would hit the trigger of middle school and being left out of anything, everything, not invited to parties, and feeling like I wasn't likable, it would have hit that trigger. And we know we're triggered when our reaction doesn't quite match the circumstance, when it's like a little bigger than what's going on. It's like, oh, what am I getting so upset about this? It really isn't that big of a deal, but it's a really big deal. That's we know, boom, trigger. Like go see what this really reminds you of.

[00:40:17]Luke Storey:  That's really funny, because I find a lot of the time when I get triggered, it's like I've become frustrated because things aren't working. But my triggers don't usually include other people. It's like inanimate objects, and technology, and just time, and you mentioned overwhelm. It's more that. It's like I find myself triggered by just circumstances that are annoying, because I'm trying to get something done, and like, make shit happen, and things are not going along with whatever my schedule happens to be. And so, that's funny. I'm going to start inquiring with myself. What does this remind me of?

[00:40:56]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. What does it remind you of? That feeling overwhelmed as a kid or feeling like do everything on your own. 

[00:41:01]Luke Storey:  I just got it. It's not being in control. Yeah. When things are not in my proposed time schedule, and done with the precision of excellence and perfection that I demand that of every situation I'm involved in.

[00:41:19]Christine Hassler:  Whoo, it's a lot of pressure. 

[00:41:20]Luke Storey:  Yeah, it is. I know. Try living inside this head.

[00:41:21]Christine Hassler:  Oh, my gosh. I have my own to deal with, that's okay.

[00:41:24]Luke Storey:  But yeah. And then, I can pretty quickly trace that back to so many situations in which I had no control over my own circumstances of safety when I was a kid. And so, when I'm in a situation now as an adult and things are spinning out of my perception of control, at least it's frustrating.

[00:41:42]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, it triggers that little boy inside, who's like, things are scary, things are out of control, I want to feel safe, I want things in control. So, when things are controlled, you feel safe. When things aren't, it triggers that little guy inside, who's like, who's taking care of me? I'm unsafe. It's chaos right now. So, it makes perfect sense.

[00:41:59]Luke Storey:  Do you find that men are more resistant to the concept of inner child work or have a more difficult time accessing that communication?

[00:42:09]Christine Hassler:  Sometimes, not always. Women have difficulty with it too, especially women who have been reinforced for their smarts, and have lived a lot in their mind and a lot in their head. Anyone who has lived a lot in their head and who has just kind of like gone through their life without ever looking behind and going, oh, again, what did I sweep under the rug, has a hard time with it because so many of us don't remember our childhood. So, pretty much most people are resistant to it, because they're like, I don't remember my childhood. 

[00:42:38] I'm like, well, you remember enough. Even if you don't have specific memories, you know the context of what's going on. I think the hardest part that I find with men is that for the most part, men are conditioned to be strong, and to be resilient, and like just to get over things. And women are, too, to some extent, but it's, I think, more in the male ethos of like, vulnerability is weak kind of thing. And so, it's often harder for them to connect to those raw emotions of that little boy.

[00:43:07] I have three nephews and I have lots of friends who have daughters, and I swear, Luke, the little boys are more sensitive. The daughters are kind of like sassy and just do their own thing, and the little boys are just so sensitive. And I'm not saying they're weak, or crybabies, or anything like that, their hearts are just open. And I just pray it stays that way. But to see these little boys, and then to work with men like, wow, men have really had so much of that tenderness and that openheartedness of that little boy conditioned out of them.

[00:43:42] So, that's the hardest part, is deconditioning a lot of that. It's not cool to cry. I need to be strong. I need to provide. Because that's one fear I hear from so many people, especially men, if I go and deal with all the stuff from my past, how am I going to provide still? Like I could fall apart. My whole world could fall apart. That's a big fear. But people find that as they go and deal with that in a healthy way and a guided way. Actually, it's easier to provide and it's easier to keep things together. 

[00:44:16]Luke Storey:  That's an interesting distinction between the sensitivity and vulnerability between males and females, because I think we have this perception, at least in Western culture, that men are stoic, and tough, and resilient, and women are emotionally driven and-. 

[00:44:38]Christine Hassler:  We have more access to our emotions.

[00:44:40]Luke Storey:  Yeah, or more emotionally sensitive, et cetera. I used to go see this woman named Dr. Pat Allen.

[00:44:47]Christine Hassler:  I love Pat Allen. 

[00:44:48]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And I did some sessions with her and interviewed her. I think she was on one of maybe my first 10 podcast or something, but she would always talk about, at her events, you do these weekly kind of meetings, and I wish I could get the terminology of it, but she basically said, you will never find anyone as tough as a woman and that men are tough physically on the exterior, but incredibly sensitive emotionally and have a much harder time being resilient to emotional pain and hurt, whereas women are just more demonstrative about their emotions, but they're actually much tougher inside emotionally and much more resilient.

[00:45:31] And that used to always strike me because she would repeat it every week in her little intro monologue. And I thought, what? But no, it's counterintuitive. But then, as I grew over the years and had more life experience, especially in the realm of relationships, watching how the two genders bounce back from heartbreak, then it became more apparent to me that men are, I mean, I would say more because there are always exceptions, you can only generalize so much.

[00:46:01] But in my experience, the most guys I know, if they are experiencing betrayal, or a loss of love, or something like that, I mean, it can take them years to come out of it and be kind of ready to get back on the horse. I have observed women that they seem on the surface as devastated by a breakup or whatever it was, a couple of weeks later, kind of dust themselves off, and they're good to go. And again, I'm generalizing, but it's something I have observed and it's a curiosity to me because it is counterintuitive.

[00:46:32] We think like, but guys, we're just not in touch with our emotions, and therefore we're invincible. But I know, man, I feel so deeply, and it was terrifying for me as an adult, dude, to become emotionally available, and vulnerable, and really authentic. And, of course, having the discernment to be able to determine whether or not whomever I happen to be in relationship with, male or female, was someone who could hold a safe space for me to do that, right? 

[00:47:08]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[00:47:08]Luke Storey:  And so, as I started to kind of stumble through my vulnerability and authenticity, I was like, oh, right approach, wrong person to attempt it with.

[00:47:18]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. I like to say, don't go to a Chinese restaurant when you want nachos, you go to the right person.

[00:47:23]Luke Storey:  But yeah. Anyway, it's an interesting observation, especially when you're looking at little boys, and little girls, and having had the experience of, without even calling it inner child work, it's just been what's come up. For me, there has been so much work going back and taking care of that. 

[00:47:45]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, nurturing that part. 

[00:47:46]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And a lot really through ceremony. I mean, I hate to always be the plant medicine guy because I also feel a sense of responsibility that I don't think those experiences are for everyone at all times. And they can be quite dangerous, actually, for people that aren't in the right space and the right setting. So, I always give that caveat, but I still have to be honest in those situations.

[00:48:11] In particular, last year, I went to Costa Rica and did four ayahuasca ceremonies there at Soltara, and a lot of it was around me wanting to really get to the root of some of my blocks and patterns as an adult, especially in relationships. And I mean, there are so many things. We could talk for hours. And I have already done podcasts hours on it. But based on this, there was this clear realization that there were times in my childhood where I was not looked out for and protected. And of course, when that happens, then I had to develop my own ways to do that, that were extremely destructive.

[00:49:01]Christine Hassler:  The best you could. 

[00:49:02]Luke Storey:  To my own moral fiber and to all relationships in all things, right? And so, because at times, there was no one around to like take care of that little dude, I developed all destructive ways to do that. And then, had to kind of unravel those and find healthier ways to do that, but still, it's like, well, we still have to learn how to take care of that little guy. Even though you can heal like the damage that's been done, how do you not keep doing that? Like, where is the adult in the room, kind of thing? Right? 

[00:49:35]Christine Hassler:  Right.

[00:49:36]Luke Storey:  And so, there was so much work around communicating to that little boy that like I'm the adult in the room now.

[00:49:44]Christine Hassler:  I got you.

[00:49:45]Luke Storey:  And it was [making sound] was and is so incredibly healing. I think the realization like—so, I get so embarrassed when I cry on my stupid podcast.

[00:49:59]Christine Hassler:  Oh, I think it's so amazing.

[00:50:01]Luke Storey:  But people seem to like it. Maybe they're entertained. I mean, it's real. It's realness.

[00:50:06]Christine Hassler:  This is healing. 

[00:50:07]Luke Storey:  I think we need more realness. But it was like, trying to see if I can articulate it. It wasn't the acknowledgement that that little two, three, four, five, six year old little Luke, it's not like that someone I was and that person's gone, that person is totally present right here, but there's also now an adult with 50 years of experience, wisdom, education, and in the art of living life that is in charge of shit now that can handle the parameter, and the boundaries, and the things that need to take place to keep everyone functional and safe.

[00:50:46] And so, it's an interesting thing because there's a balance of finding a home within your heart as that innocent, pure self that you still are, but also having an adult in the room that's able to create a safe life where you can keep that inner child safe in a functional way that's not limiting. And not based on fear, but just based on discernment, prudence, wisdom, and gained maturity. And so, it's a beautiful experience for me to have because I never really related to the inner child thing. I was like, cool, I'll go back and like deal with the childhood trauma, heal that, and let's keep it moving. But I'm going to take the little dude with me, like we're done, like I'm not that kid anymore.

[00:51:31]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, close that door.

[00:51:31]Luke Storey:  But you are that kid still.

[00:51:34]Christine Hassler:  You are. And thank you so much for sharing that because I think that share was a great explanation of everything that we've been talking about. It's like there is a hurt little boy who felt so lost and who so needed someone. We need, as children, someone to take care of us and someone to show us the way. And we don't get that. That's a developmental stage that we miss. So, we have to find a way to get it. And we're making these decisions from a place that hasn't developed, right?

[00:52:06] So, you make "bad decisions". And then, we beat ourselves up for those decisions. It's like, no, no, no, that was the best you could do. That was the best you could do given what you had. And we can't beat ourselves up for that. We have to get to forgiveness, and go, okay, that was the way I've protected myself so far, now, I've got to find a healthy way to do it. I've got to find a healthy way to make myself feel safe, make myself feel like I belong, make myself feel like I matter, make myself feel that I'm nurtured, because these are all big, big human needs that we have.

[00:52:39] So, I love that. I love that you have a relationship with little Luke and you know that he's in there, all ages are in there. And then, there's the inner parent. There's the inner mother and father. Just like we all have masculine and feminine energies, we all have that inner parent that represents both that healthy mother and father. And we can't look to our biological parents or whoever raised us to give us that. We have to do that for ourselves. And when we do, then not only do we forgive our actions knowing we did the best we could, but then, there's much more healing we can have with our own family of origin and our parents, and go, oh, wow, they were really doing the best they could.

[00:53:16] But before we can get there, we got to get our feelings out about the shitty job that they did do and let our inner child have a voice about that, but eventually get to forgiveness. My favorite visual that I've seen, I don't know who the artist is, but it's a child sitting in the lap of an adult, and then sort of spirits holding them both. And I love that visual because it's like, there's little me that I get to hold, and then God or Spirit holds me as well. So, when my inner parent's like, well, who's there for me? That's when I can really go to my spiritual practice, and go, The Divine Mother, Father is there for me.

[00:53:52]Luke Storey:  Wow. I love it. Where do I want to go now? So many juicy directions. Other than honoring that you are all of your ages in a culminative way now, what are some other practical ways that people can develop more self-love and self-worth? Because I think as we alluded to a bit earlier, so many of us feel that sense of lack and that we don't deserve. And so, it's all of this external validation, accomplishment, success, getting the husband, the wife, the house, the career, et cetera.

[00:54:37] And even if we do, through our own sheer will, achieve some of those things, there is still that nagging thing that there's something wrong with us, that we don't deserve that right or that lack of self-worth. It just undermines everything we do and we sabotage or we're just not in vibrational alignment with those things that we feel we want in our life. So, what are some practical ways that we can learn to love ourselves more and identify that? Is it looking in the mirror and doing affirmations? It's like, what are the practices, the practical things that we can do to honor ourselves in a more meaningful way?

[00:55:12]Christine Hassler:  Well, I don't think it's a one-size-fits-all approach for everybody because I think that we have to consider what were the ways that we were most hurt or how are the ways we felt the most unloved and we've got to direct our self-love in that direction. So, an important thing to remember about self-love is it's really not something we need to learn. It's just something we need to remember because love is who we are. Love is the most natural thing that we do.

[00:55:41] And so, that helps me feel not intimidated by, I got to learn to love myself. It's like, no, no, no, I just need to remember. So, a lot of it is just removing a lot of things. It's noticing when we go down that road of self-beat, and criticism, and just that story that runs about how we're not enough, and just one hand on our heart, one hand on our belly, and just go stop, not stop, you piece of shit. Just stop, this is not the direction I want to go right now.

[00:56:13] I forgive myself for judging myself and just take a breath because that self-beat and that critical thinking is like a neural highway in our brain and it's well-grooved. So, it's just habitual that we just go there over, and over, and over again. So, really good mental activity is just to notice your thoughts, one hand on your heart, which is all about I am love. One hand on your belly, which is I am safe. And just say stop, this is not the direction I want to go.

[00:56:41] Take a breath. Forgive yourself because you want to forgive yourself for judging yourself, because one of the ways we forget how to love ourselves is because we're so busy judging ourselves. Like if my native language was Spanish, and then at four years old, I go and only speak English for 40 years, I'm probably going to forget Spanish. I'm going to have to remember a lot, but I'm going to need to stop speaking English so much, and go back, and learn this other language.

[00:57:06] So, that's a big part of it. Another big part of that for me, which is super simple, is we've got to connect to that little one and that compassion inside. And so, pictures at various ages or a picture, I have one picture probably when I was four that I keep on my phone. And if I'm ever in just a place where I'm not in a place of self-love, I will just look at that picture, and I'll look into my own eyes, and there's something about connecting to yourself as a child, and looking at that picture that just brings you into your heart, and elicits so much love and so much compassion.

[00:57:38] So, something as simple as that is great. Other things that I think are important to really nurture that self-love is what do you have in your life that nurtures and soothes you? Because that is a human need we all have. And that's where most addictions, eating disorders, where a lot of those get started because the person is looking for how do I nurture myself? How do I soothe myself? And if that wasn't provided, if you didn't get nurturing and soothing as a child, and you can get a lot of pleasure as a child, too, you're going to go for something that gives you that fix.

[00:58:13] What calms me down? What gives me a moment of pleasure? What soothes me? That's why so many people go to substances, and then you have to keep upping the ante because you need more to have that feeling. So, putting practices in your life that really nurture you, that feel really nurturing, that feel really soothing, learning ways to calm yourself down. One of my favorite things to do when I was dealing with a lot of anxiety is I wrote a script for myself that was calming, that's like you're relaxing, you're breathing deeply.

[00:58:45] I can't remember what it was. Sorry, I wrote an I-am statement. And I recorded it on my iPhone and just listened to my own voice, calming me down, because whose voice are we listening to the most? Our own. It's incredibly hypnotic. So, making audios that you record yourself with the statements that you really want to reinforce to make yourself feel more in love with yourself is so powerful, and just listen to it over, and over, and over again. And all of a sudden, like your brain starts to go, oh, that's the voice I'm listening to.

[00:59:19] That's the information I'm listening to. And then, we've got to take the external actions, because again, there's that inner child in us that's always watching us, is like, what are you doing that's making me feel safe and loved? So, we've got to look at who are the people we allow in our life? What boundaries do we have? What are we continuing to tolerate in our life? If we're in toxic relationships, if we have no boundaries with people, that's going to bring our self-love way, way, way, way down and our self-worth way down because there's a part of us that's like, oh, I'm tolerating the shitty behavior.

[00:59:48] I must be shitty because this is what I'm tolerating. So, that's when we've got to like really drop the people pleasing thing, and not care what people think, and put some boundaries in place, and maybe realize some relationships have expiration dates, and it's time to move on. And that is a self-honoring act, not a selfish act. A lot of times when I talk about self-love, people are like, but that's so selfish, I'm like, no, it's self-honoring. 

[01:00:14] You taking care of yourself, you having boundaries, you're doing things that really nurture you isn't selfish. That's self-honoring. And when we're remembering how to self-love, we've got to look at, alright, what am I doing in my life that's self-deprecating, that's not self-honoring at all? And how do I have some boundaries and take some actions that really reinforce, hey, I love myself enough to say no to this. I love myself enough to get this person or this action out of my life.

[01:00:42] So, it's the combination. We've got to do the inward things, the talking to ourselves nicely, the connecting with the inner child, the doing the things that nurture and soothe, and we've got to do the outside work, and change things in our life. So, the part of us that's watching us all the time is going, do you really love me? It's like, oh, alright, she's doing some self-honoring things, I guess I am starting to love myself more.

[01:01:03]Luke Storey:  Wow. That's great. Thank you for those. Those are all really doable and practical. I think something that stands out there is the creation and practice of boundaries as an act of self-love. And I remember when I first started to finally get over people pleasing, and learning how to say no to things, and not participate in relationships, et cetera, there was a period in which it was so exhilarating to finally be more honest and to have the courage to just like cut people off and just stand up for myself, that there was this kind of pendulum effect, where I was like pretty hardcore at first. 

[01:01:46]Christine Hassler:  You're like, oh, I'm kind of an asshole now.

[01:01:52]Luke Storey:  Yeah. I just was like, oh, my God, this is so empowering. I'm finally standing up for myself, and then eventually found some balance. But I think the distinction there for me between an act of being selfish, as some people might perceive boundaries to be, and self-love is, when it's a healthy boundary, I feel this rush of self-esteem. I just feel really good about myself. Even if I have to be pretty firm and harsh with the other party, if that boundary involves other people as they normally do, I don't feel guilty, like, oh, God, I was kind of mean to that person. I actually feel awesome inside. 

[01:02:35] And I might have been kind of mean because that's what was called for. It was an appropriate response or an appropriate boundary, and it had to be stated in a way that was firm enough for the other person to hear it and honor it. And that's kind of the inner guidance that I use to determine whether or not I'm just being mean, or abusive, or excluding someone out of a lower place, or if I'm doing something that is actually a self-love-based practice, it will feel really good.

[01:03:06] It's a little bit like, shit, did I really just say that? Did I just stand up for myself like that? But the feeling is not a feeling of guilt. And when I have had to address someone in a really firm way, it might appear on the surface that it's coming from anger, but I don't feel the emotional hangover that I would if I was just being reactive and spewing anger on someone to punish them or acting out of my wound. It's a really interesting distinction there.

[01:03:33]Christine Hassler:  And I think we've come to another distinction between men and women with this one, because I'm sure a lot of the women listening are going, I feel so guilty when I set a boundary. This is one thing I've noticed. And again, we're making generalizations here, but men tend to be better. They tend to be like, I set the boundary, I did what I did, and like the person's upset, I'm okay with it because I did what needed to be done. Women, again, generalization, tend to set the boundary, and then feel so guilty and are so worried about how the other person took it.

[01:04:04] And that's often what stops a lot of people, men or women, from setting the boundary. They're so worried that the other person is not going to be okay. And that's the thing with setting boundaries. Often, the other person isn't. And you can't wait until you know the other person is going to be okay to set a boundary. That's what keeps most people from setting boundaries is, wait, more time, more time, and then eventually, the person will be okay with it. No, you just have to do it, and then if the other person is upset, you got to let them be upset. 

[01:04:34] Because if you're setting boundaries, you're probably tiptoeing on codependence or you're already swimming in it, and you're probably in some people pleasing behavior, and so you're learning in that is to deal with the upset. That may be part of the lesson. I mean, I have lots of clients that come to me, and they're like, I did it, I set the boundary and it was the right thing, but now, I feel awful, and my mom's so upset, and I don't know what to do, and I think I'm going to just call her, and tell her, never mind.

[01:04:56] I'm like, no, stay strong. It's okay. Let her be upset. That's part of the enmeshment and the codependence you're breaking with people, is knowing, yes, it's my responsibility to speak truth and love. You can set a boundary and still be loving. Boundaries don't have to come from a place of hate, or judgment, or anything like that. You can be totally loving and set a boundary. In fact, that's the way I recommend doing it. And then, what happens after that is not your responsibility.

[01:05:25] Not at all. And that's the lesson for the boundary setter, is dealing with someone else's upset and knowing it's not our responsibility. And that's so hard for a lot of people, especially with a parent or someone you really love, with people that you don't have that much attachment or that much history with, a little easier. But when it comes to somebody that's like big in your life, whoo, it's difficult. And you got to be in that uncomfortable place if somebody is mad at me. 

[01:05:54] And that's going to be okay. That's when we've got to source our self-worth from within, because a lot of people that have trouble setting boundaries, they get their worth from other people liking them. So, as soon as that boundary set, someone's upset, it's like, oh, where did my self-worth go? I'm not like that anymore. I'm not seen as like the person that can handle it all or the person that this person can go to. And so then, all the self-worth stuff starts to come up, and then it's like, great, another opportunity to learn and grow.

[01:06:20]Luke Storey:  Wow. I love that. I love that. Yeah. It's interesting how in my experience when I've had the wisdom and the clarity to create boundaries in relationships, which to me just usually means just speaking my truth, and then living by that commitment, right? 

[01:06:41]Christine Hassler:  Yeah.

[01:06:42]Luke Storey:  It's just gaining a bit of integrity. And I think, yeah, that's what the feeling is that feels so good when one finally starts to stand up for themselves because it's just the feeling of integrity. You're like, I'm actually saying and acting in a way that is in alignment with my truth. And that's a really great feeling. What's interesting about it is that even if feathers get ruffled, I find in a relationship with someone that you want to keep a relationship with, but you just need some space, that truth always seems to have the effect of healing everyone.

[01:07:23] Even if the receiver of the boundary gets butthurt and runs off on fire, even if the relationship between you and that person does not persist in the same way, or the same degree of intimacy, or it might dissolve completely, there's still a healing effect because when that person gets butthurt, unless they're just complete bypasser, they're probably going to have to stop and face the pain of that perceived rejection and look inside for a moment, go, huh, wow, that person just shut my ass down. Like what is it about me that would elicit that type of firm boundary? And there's a healing to that if someone is open and available to it, is there not? 

[01:08:06]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, 1,000%. And that's what prevents resentment in relationship. If you don't have boundaries of people and you let them walk all over you or you let them just walk a little bit all over you, you're going to have resentment. It does not lead to a healthy relationship. So, setting boundaries is like, this is what I'm doing, and I've even said this to people that I've set boundaries with who mean a lot to me and I want to have a relationship with. I say, I know this may sound selfish or this may hurt, I am doing this because I love you and because I want a better relationship with you.

[01:08:38] And they can't always hear that if they're hurt, but then that's their opportunity to really go and heal. There are three ways to have a relationship, and I like to use the visual, the sliding glass door. So, with a sliding glass door, you have all the way shut, all the way open, or the screen. And all the way open is people pleaser, walk all over me. I have so little self-worth that I have no boundaries in my life. And then, sometimes, those people can go to, I'm just going to slam the damn door shut completely so nothing gets in. That's barriers, not boundaries. Nothing gets in. No fresh air gets in. Nothing gets in.

[01:09:14] But the boundaries is a screen, where it's like, oh, yes, the sound of birds, a breeze, but let's keep the mosquitoes out. Let's just have a nice relationship here. And that's really what boundaries are. Like it lets the good stuff flow and it keeps some of the stuff that puts us in unhealthy dynamics with people out. And like we've talked about, it can be hard to close that screen door, but if you've got that sliding glass door all the way open, eventually, you're going to get to a point where you're just going to want to slam it shut and the relationships in your life are going to be really challenged.

[01:09:46]Luke Storey:  Do you think that resentment is always the end result of people pleasing? 

[01:09:47]Christine Hassler:  Either resentment of others or of self.

[01:09:56]Luke Storey:  Yeah, right.

[01:09:57]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. It's either I'm mad at everybody else or—I was just talking to a client today who's really discovering just years, and years, and years of people pleasing. And she's like, I'm so angry at myself. I'm so mad at myself. I was like, alright, well, let's work with that. But eventually, what she got to is that these years of people pleasing, it was like a total lack of self-love and a self-betrayal. She's pleased all these other people and she's put everyone ahead of her. 

[01:10:27] And her and that little girl inside of her is going, what about me? Why am I last on the list? And we are often so good at loving others, and so good at being compassionate with others, so good at being there for others, but we often suck at it ourselves. So, that's another self-love tip, like especially for the parents out there, or pet owners, or whatever, people that you care or if you have things that you take care of, you're good in nurturing that child, or that pet, or whatever it is, turn that on yourself.

[01:10:54] And that's some of, I think, the parenting paradigm we're moving out of, is some of the parenting paradigms for years was like, put all my energy and love into this kid. And I think even some people have children because they want unconditional love. They want something to love them so bad. I noticed people that had anxious attachment styles growing up really want to have a baby because there will be something that they just can have and will be there forever. 

[01:11:20] And we're moving more into, I'm going to really love myself first, this child isn't mine. It's my responsibility to hold a loving environment, but I'm not going to love myself through that child. I'm going to love me. I'm going to teach that child to love him or herself, and we're going to share and love together. So, it's a much different way to hold any relationship, especially the parent-child one.

[01:11:44]Luke Storey:  What are the attachment styles that people have? And how does one learn what they are as they play out in their own life? Like I have no idea what mine is, for example.

[01:11:56]Christine Hassler:  Oh, really? Oh. Well, we could figure it out. So, there are basically four. So, the secure attachment style is when, I mean, it's pretty obvious, you had a secure attachment so your parents weren't perfect, they made mistakes. But if they made the mistake, they repaired. For example, your dad was 20 minutes late picking you up to the soccer game. He was really sorry when he got there. I'm sorry I kept you waiting, you must have been scared. I'm really sorry.

[01:12:20] And it didn't happen over, and over, and over again. So, a secure attachment style, there's some consistency. You knew your parents loved you or whoever raised you loved you. There was consistency. They did what they said they were going to do most of the time and there was an emotional availability. You could feel that they loved you. You could feel the connection. Again, doesn't have to be perfect, but it's consistent. And then, you've got the anxious attachment style, which is where there's inconsistency.

[01:12:46] So, someday, you show up to mom and she's in a great mood and wants to play. In other days, you show up and it's like mom's in a mood, and you accidentally broke a dish, and you're in massive trouble, so you kind of don't know where you stand and it makes you feel very anxious. That's anxious attachment style. The other side of anxious attachment is when there's an enmeshment with the parent. So, the parent is like so in your life, and watching your every move, and maybe fulfilling some of their emotional needs through you.

[01:13:16] So, it creates a codependence that's also tied into an anxious attachment style. Then, we've got the avoidant attachment style, and that's when you can just think avoidant attachment style is neglect. So, maybe parents were there physically, they maybe weren't abusive, but they just weren't available. They weren't emotionally present. You just had to figure a lot out on your own.

[01:13:39] Most people with avoidant attachment styles felt like they were grownups by the age of six, and just felt like, I'm on my own. And it creates a sense of distrust of people in relationship. It's like keeping people at a distance. And then, the disorganized attachment style is just when you grew up in utter chaos, tons of abuse, or alcoholism, or just chaos, chaos, chaos, and you just don't know sort of where you are. So, any idea which one yours is?

[01:14:08]Luke Storey:  I have all of those. 

[01:14:08]Christine Hassler:  We have bits of all of them, yeah.

[01:14:09]Luke Storey:  All those styles in equal measure because everyone you went through was like, oh, yeah, that fits. I mean, I think, I'm guessing as one evolves, and heals, and grows in maturity that you eventually revert back to the more secure attachment style, right? 

[01:14:29]Christine Hassler:  Absolutely.

[01:14:30]Luke Storey:  As you start to identify and ferret out in enmeshment the tendencies, and codependency, and all of that. 

[01:14:37]Christine Hassler:  And neediness or like somebody gets close, and then as soon as it gets too intimate, you're like, let me sabotage this or let me move away from this. That's more of the avoidant. And so, how we heal attachment styles, honestly, is in relationship. Most often intimate relationship, but even friendship. That's really how we heal them. And you're right, we move more and more towards secure. So, mine is anxious. And we pretty much have one predominant one. And how I heal that is really not being codependent to my relationships.

[01:15:11] Like learning how to fulfill my own needs, and not be needy, and also not worry so much. Like a typical indicator of an anxious attachment style is you're dating someone and you don't know where you stand. And the communication is like [making sound] and you're anxious, anxious, and then you get a text from them, and it's like, oh, I can relax now. So, it's that needing that connection and not really feeling safe without that person, or without connection, or conversation with that person.

[01:15:45] And the avoidant, like I said, is, okay, I'll let you get this close, but any closer and I'm going to either sabotage this, or I'm going to run, or I'm really not going to let you in. And how you heal that is really working on relational intimacy in relationships. So, being vulnerable, letting people see you. When I work with people that have that attachment style is like a little bit of time, and a little more vulnerability, and a little more, and a little more until they start to be like, oh, alright, I don't have to run.

[01:16:12] I can trust this. So, it's really about leaning into a relationship. And then, with disorganized, so much that comes from trauma. So, that really is doing trauma work. Working with trauma-informed therapists, healing that trauma so that your nervous system can handle and process being in a relationship. Because with the disorganized attachment style, it's like you're always waiting for the shoe to drop, and it's really hard to be present and grounded in relationship.

[01:16:37]Luke Storey:  Wow. That's such powerful information. I was tracing back to—my first style would have definitely been avoidant, just never allowing for the potential of being hurt, or abandoned, or anything. So, just keep everyone at arm's length. But then, as I started to evolve more spiritually, and grow, and heal some of those things, then I would say I've became much more the anxious type, because I was just learning how to be vulnerable, and openhearted in that way, and it was terrifying.

[01:17:20]Christine Hassler:  Yes, it is.

[01:17:21]Luke Storey:  And as I alluded to earlier, not having the skills of discernment around, like being able to—well, not that it was even like their fault, per se, but just trying to build healthy attachment style in relationships without having evolved and grown to the point where I could even handle that or attract someone who was also able to hold that, right? 

[01:17:47]Christine Hassler:  Right.

[01:17:47]Luke Storey:  So, it's like two people with different levels of attachment style, or availability, or unavailability, kind of like cobbling that together. But it's funny now, though, kind of on the other side of a long, long time of being very avoidant, now, I would say, there's still a little bit of insecurity sometimes. I'm like, are we cool? Like you mentioned that texting, oh, my God. I remember that. When I first started to open my heart in relationships, and I'd be with someone who was on the kind of polarized, more avoidant spectrum, and just like waiting for that text, and like, oh, my God, so much anxiety. And then, it comes in, it's like, oh, God, everything's fine. I was tripping.

[01:18:31]Christine Hassler:  It's okay now. 

[01:18:31]Luke Storey:  They weren't mad or whatever. They're not dating someone else now, it's okay. I'll just be so paranoid. And I see that pop up, I mean, thankfully, not much, because I'm with someone who's so solid and is there, but there's still like every once in a while, send a text, or something, or I think I've done something wrong, and I'm like in trouble, and there's that like bad boy of mommy's mad kind of energy, and I'm just like, oh, God, I just can't stand it, it's such a gross dynamic. 

[01:19:03]Christine Hassler:  But it's good to see it and to know. And anxious in attachment, people are like flies to honey. They just attract each other because the soul's always seeking to grow. And I always tell people, if you're attracted to someone like that drug, like if it's like 10+ attraction, you just can't get enough, run the other direction unless you want to be in an issue-based relationship and really work on your triggers because that's what it's going to be. And I'm like, this is such a setup because it's set up so that we're so sexually attracted to someone. 

[01:19:33] Because if we had our wits about us, we'd be like, no way. Like so many issues, so many red flags, but because we have this like chemical attraction, it's like, oh, this person is totally my person, and then all the issues pop up. I call them issue-based relationships and they're great because they serve a purpose. They serve the purpose to show us what we need to work on. They're usually not the relationships that like go the distance, but they're super important in our journey. 

[01:20:00]Luke Storey:  Yeah, that's a great distinction. Yeah, I really am grateful that I'm done with this type of relationships.

[01:20:06]Christine Hassler:  Oh, my God. Me too. Me too. I had such a thing for avoidant guys, and I was like, I will be the one that changes them. My love will make them open their heart. No. No. Only he can do that.

[01:20:20]Luke Storey:  In terms of something you mentioned earlier about being self-critical, I think those of us that are really on the path of commitment to our evolution and growth, and this, I think, comes from all of my years in recovery, in order to become the person you want to be, it's really important to see those things about yourself that you don't want to be. So, there's always this kind of uncovering of character defects, or flaws, or things that are wrong with your personality, the way that you think, the way you feel, the way you act.

[01:20:59] And so, there's this excavation always going on of like looking for the next thing that is screwed up about me. And it's been a lot of work for me to actually build a practice into stopping, and saying, let's look at all that's been accomplished every once in a while. There's the risk of patting yourself on the back too much, thinking, well, I'm done, carving the turkey. 

[01:21:27] But I think for myself, I'm still quite critical, and demanding, and perfectionist because I'm just conditioned by my own methods of growth to be looking at the next thing that I need to fix or overcome. So, how does one find balance in giving themselves some credit for what they've accomplished and gratitude for the grace that God has shown them to help them along, but still not blinding themselves to the things that are lurking in the shadow of it that still could use addressing?

[01:21:59]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. Well, it's interesting. As you were talking about that, a deer walked by, and deer medicine is so much about gentleness. And it's about like just being gentle with ourselves. And I think in those early years of diving deep, like there's always seems to be a point in someone's life where they're like, I'm going all in, on therapy like I'm going in. And it's like once you're in, you can't turn back. It's like you dip your toe in the water for a while, but I'm sure people listening can relate to that moment, you're like, okay, I'm all in.

[01:22:28] And like, there's no turning back because I'm not falling back asleep, I'm just not doing it. And so, we go through this period where we need to dig and we need to look for kind of every little thing because we need to excavate a lot. Like we need to move a lot out. But then, we sort of reach a point where it can become an addiction. It's like everything in our life, how did I create this? What is this reminding me of? Like what issue is this through my childhood?

[01:22:51] And we need to sometimes go, you know what, I'm human, and I'm going to mess up, and I'm going to get triggered. And I have found that sense of humor is so important in evolution . Just look, like sometimes, I do shit, and I'm just like, oh, my God, I did that again. Like that's hilarious that I'm still doing that. I know better. And I have a really good laugh about it, or I laugh with my husband or good friends about it. So, that gentleness and that sense of humor, I think, is so important in the balance.

[01:23:18] And yeah, the credit, the acknowledgement. We often look at how far we have to go versus how far we've came. And I think it's important to look back and give ourselves a pat on the back, but also go, whoa, I've come this far? I can keep going. Like if I've come this far, there's really nothing I can't handle. When I've had things come up in my life lately, I look behind me, and go, oh, I got this. I've come through so much. So, I think looking at how far we've come, acknowledging ourselves, because there's a lot of people out there still snoozing.

[01:23:51] There's a lot of people still asleep. I'm sure a lot of people listening can think of their own family, and go, wow, I'm the one person in my family who's the black sheep, who's waking up to consciousness. And being proud of ourselves is important because that's another childhood need that many of us didn't get. Is mom and dad really being proud of you? Not just of your accomplishments, but just of who you are. So, that sense of pride, and like, yeah, proud of myself, of going to some dark places, I feel I handled some pretty tough shit, I'm going to acknowledge that.

[01:24:22] And when things come up or I repeat a pattern, I'm going to look at what I need to look at, but I'm also going to have a sense of humor about it. That's one thing I've discovered with my own journey. When I was really first in it, especially when I was getting off antidepressants, I was like hitting pillows, and doing my anger work, and doing my release writing, and digging, and going to my trauma therapist, and somatic therapy, and just like I'm just going for it.

[01:24:48] And I needed to because I needed that kind of like dramatic shift, and there is a lot to deal with. But now, it's like I can have a lightness about it, and I can have a gentleness about it, and I can shift things quicker, and I don't have to beat myself up as much. So, I think that balance, when we begin, and it is a little off-balance because we've got a lot of stuff to do, but eventually reach a point, where it's like, wow, I've done a lot and I have far to go in terms of my vision and values, because that's really the switch.

[01:25:20] It's like we reach a point where we stop reacting from our past, and creating from our past, and healing, and dealing our past, and we're like, whoa, what's my vision? And what are my values? And now, I've kind of got this blank slate, I'm not reacting and creating from my past anymore, whoa, like what do I want to create? And that's the exciting part. And I'm not saying we get there, we don't still have triggers, but because we've got this vision and values pulling us forward, it's easier to manage those triggers because we've got that groundwork done.

[01:25:50]Luke Storey:  That's so awesome. So, it's like the shift of focusing on what we do want rather than what we don't want, right? 

[01:25:58]Christine Hassler:  Exactly.

[01:25:58]Luke Storey:  But in the beginning, there's a period of like, well, you really got to look at what you don't want because what you don't want is what keeps showing up, right? 

[01:26:06]Christine Hassler:  Exactly.

[01:26:06]Luke Storey:  Because you're stuck in those patterns, those neural pathways that just keep firing you in the same wrong direction.

[01:26:15]Christine Hassler:  And this is where a lot of people get stuck and they think their failures because they read all the manifestation books, and they do the Dispenza meditations, they do all the things except go back and deal with their past hurts and trauma. And they're like, why is my life not changing? Why am I not moving forward? I read all the books. I do all the things to create a different future. It's like, well, you got to clean up the past. And I see this over, and over, and over again.

[01:26:40] People that do the work to actually heal and clean up the past have a much easier time creating the future that they want. But people that try to create the future and do all this manifesting, envisioning without cleaning up the past, just end up repeating the past. Because remember, the nature of the soul is to grow. The soul isn't going to be like, oh, you can skip that lesson. Oh, sure, skip that one too. Oh, skip that one too. Just have everything you want. It's going to be like, no, got to learn these things. 

[01:27:03]Luke Storey:  Right. When it comes to that point in the journey where one has done a lot of the deep work and now is sort of just spot check, dealing with things as they come up, and you're starting to develop that vision for what you want in your life, whether that would be the person that you want to blossom into in a more internal sense, or things that you want to achieve or accomplish, the home relationship, career, et cetera, how can one work on their vision while not getting in the trap of, I'll be complete when, I'll be whole when, I'll be worthy when, I'll be happy when? 

[01:27:47] There's a balance there of being in content with you, your life, your relationship with God, your relationship with your friends, mates, et cetera in the now, but also exercising that desire that you have inside to achieve, to be, to do more. From my perspective, it's focusing on how you want to feel rather than the thing. So, let's say the thing that you want is like a brand-new house and you think that's going to make you happy.

[01:28:17] The thing I want is this house that we're in right now.

[01:28:19]Christine Hassler:  I want this house, too. This is pretty awesome.

[01:28:21]Luke Storey:  Yeah. 

[01:28:21]Christine Hassler:  But I think that's a legitimate desire and you should go for it. But when we tend to that when, then, like when I have the house or when I have the relationship, and again, we're focused on the thing. So, how we get there faster and healthier is, how do I think that thing is going to make me feel? So, if you know that having this house really isn't going to make you feel any better or different about yourself, you're just going to really freaking love having this house, but it's not filling any void inside of you.

[01:28:49] You're really coming from a place of, yeah, this just sounds like an awesome expression and something I want to experience in my life. Not when I have this house, then I'll feel successful, or when I have this house, then I'll feel happy. Then, we know it's actually just a healthy desire because it's more about how we feel about something than wanting it to fill a void. So, for people that are in that stage where they're still working out a lot of the past and have that tendency to go to the when, then, stop focusing on the thing or the person, focus on the feeling. 

[01:29:21] So, think, alright, when I have this relationship, then I'll feel confident, or when I have this great job, then I'll feel enough. Okay. I want to feel confident and I want to feel enough. How can I start feeling those things and generating those feelings right now versus making them dependent on things? So, that's really how we know the distinction. If we're wanting something to fill a void, and we got to just let go of that thing, and generate the feeling we think it's going to give us, but if we're just like feeling drawn to something or called to something, not because it's going to fill a void.

[01:29:51] But just because it's just cool, it's just awesome, it's an experience that would be cool to have, and it's not coming from scarcity, it's not coming from lack, and we don't have devastation if we don't get it, then it's like, wow, that's just a healthy way to have desires because it's normal for humans to vision and have desires. And I was talking to some people the other night, and I was like, I realized a couple of years ago, the feeling I was chasing for so many years was just being content. And content is not something that people have tattooed on their arms or have gold necklaces saying content.

[01:30:26] It's not one of those words that's like really hot for your word of the year. But I was like, all those years, I just wanted to feel content. I wanted to feel like I was enough, I had enough, I had done enough, contentment. And when I reached that point in my life, it wasn't because I checked any boxes, it was because I got to a place inside myself where I wasn't searching for anything anymore to make me feel a certain way. And so, now, anything I desire is just like, oh, that would be cool, and I'm content if it never happens. We want to have the high intention and low attachment. So, be intentional about things, have visions, but low attachment so that if it doesn't happen, totally fine.

[01:31:08]Luke Storey:  Beautiful. You have such great answers to all my questions.

[01:31:11]Christine Hassler:  Well, you ask great questions.

[01:31:13]Luke Storey:  Thank you. It's really, really good stuff. Let me see. Okay. So, I'm observing you in your public figure dome. Of course, when I interview someone, I look at every page on their website, and really get a sense of what they're doing in the world and what their message is. And I've got a sense of your message, but what you're doing seems to be a lot. You as a personal brand, I mean, I'm like, Jesus, how many courses does she have? And I guess now, you're not doing in-person events, I'm assuming, because of the thingy, but I'm like, damn, homegirl is busy. 

[01:31:50] Like I guess the question is, what are your thoughts or practices on work-life balance, because you seem to be someone who is very prolific, successful, doing things, helping tons of people, tons of offerings, yet I'm assuming you're in a healthy, happy relationship, you're living your best life? How do you succeed, achieve, drive, push, allow, and yet also still just have time to do you, and your life, and family, and friends, and all of that?

[01:32:21]Christine Hassler:  Well, I learned this one the hard way. I do, I write, I do a lot of keynote speaking, courses, podcasts, and have a coaching practice, and train coaches. So, it is a lot. And luckily, I have a woman named Jill who's worked with me for over a decade now. And she's like, without her, I'd have a nervous breakdown by now. So, she's amazing. I have that incredible partner and support. But I am someone that can push pretty hard. And again, that comes from some of my wounding. 

[01:32:55] And I would just go, and go, and go, and go, and go. And then, after 12 years of doing that, my health started to go. Adrenal fatigue, weird viruses, heart palpitations, panic attacks out of nowhere. And that was the wake-up call for me that I'm doing too much. Like I'm doing too much. And I also wanted to bring a relationship into my life. And I really didn't have the space for it. I said I did, but I really, really didn't. And so, it was that health crisis that made me go, oh, okay, some things need to change.

[01:33:30] And what I was able to realize and the fear I tapped into is I felt like I was struggling, and I felt like if I dropped any one of those balls, the whole thing would just come crashing down. And the lesson for me in that is actually doing less can create more. And another lesson was really tapping into my feminine energy because my core essence is feminine. That's who I am. But I had so many masculine mass and adaptive strategies on top of that, that that just kind of became my go-to.

[01:34:00] And it was that physical breakdown that made me go, whoa, maybe I can't do all this. Maybe my mind can, nut my body, and my nervous system, and my soul is tired, just needs to stop. And so, I was able to really go, okay, what do I really love doing? Do I love getting on planes like a lot? I mean, when quarantine hit, we didn't get on a plane from March until July, and that was the longest I had been on a plane in about 12 years. So, I was just like going, going, going.

[01:34:31] And I really started to question, like what feels aligned versus—because I used to ask the question before of, well, if I stop doing this, what will happen? Like what will break down? And I was able to put that question aside and just go what feels most aligned. And it was really, Luke, a trust experiment of like, is it really okay just to do what I want to do? Like do I have to do all these other things? Can I just focus on what I want? And this is uncertainty, right?

[01:35:00] The only way to know is to do it. There's no crystal ball with these things. And so, it was really surrendering, and going, alright, I'm going to keep working on myself. I'm going to rest. I'm going to rejuvenate. I'm going to start saying no to things I don't want to do. I'm going to clear a lot of my plate, a lot off my schedule, let myself heal. And the interesting thing that happened is as my body healed and I got married, I started realizing, wow, like things are still coming in.

[01:35:24] Like I don't have to push and force so much. In fact, without having such a full plate, things that I didn't even think of are starting to come in that are more aligned. And that's the thing about tunnel vision and being just in that masculine energy is when we're so busy and so focused, it's like the universe is going, hey, over here. Like I'm trying to get your attention. But because we're so much looking over here, it's like we miss it. And so, it's been a beautiful experience for me to really drop into that feminine superpower of receptivity, because that is, I mean, feminine superpower, basic anatomy, we're the receivers. 

[01:35:59] And to trust it and to trust that I don't have to do, do, do, do, do in order to really have the life that is fulfilling to me. And then, I also had to look at over-responsibility. I have a little bit of that caretaker, I need to help as many people as I can thing. And so, I really had to look at that, and go, you know what, everyone's a sovereign being. Everyone can find their own way. I'm not the savior. It's not my responsibility. And like the person I need to take care of most is me because if I don't take care of me, I am worthless to anybody else. So, it was a journey.

[01:36:33]Luke Storey:  That's really great, though. That's really great. Yeah. Hearing that, I'm going, I think I need more feminine energy. I've just been grinding. But also, like what you were talking about the feeling. It's that the end result of those things that we're working toward, right? It's not the thing. So, I was reflecting as you were speaking on just being in this really lovely house out in the country here in Texas and I just feel so good here. So, my thought is, well, if I want to feel like this, then I need to get one of these. And that's the feeling.

[01:37:14] But that feeling could be with me anywhere if I were to cultivate that feeling. And then, the kind of human need that I identified in there is a feeling of security. I think so much because of the way things are in the world right now, and not feeling safe and comfortable in my soon-to-be former home of Los Angeles. I'm there for 32 years, and I'm there, I do not feel safe. I don't feel secure for a number of different reasons, which I'll probably illuminate in a solo cast one of these days once I get out of there. But it's like that feeling of security can be had anywhere if one really goes about cultivating that and celebrating that.

[01:38:02] Because when I look at the world around me, and especially when I'm in a place where it feels very volatile and temporary, it's difficult to find that. But I think that's really what I'm looking for. So, there's this sense of urgency with career, and money, and finding a place to live. It's like that sense of urgency and pushing comes out of a fear of not having security, and safety for myself, and my small little family of two pets and one lady. So, it's like, hmm, that's interesting. So, perhaps one can just fast-forward to the feeling of security-

[01:38:41]Christine Hassler:  And then, you're more likely to draw in what you like because our environment does play a role. Like it absolutely does. We cultivate the feelings and we want to not be attached to things and the relationships, where we live, our job impact us. But we want to do the inside-out approach, not the outside in. We don't want this house to give me this. We want to feel this, and then draw in this house so that when you get to a house, you're like, oh, this is it, I can relax.

[01:39:10] Not this house is going to make me relax. It's like you walk in, and it's like, it happens immediately. And that's really the dance of being human because we're living in this 3D, 5D, however you want to say it, world where physical things, and where we live, and who we're with, and how we work, and we're in this game where all that matters. And so, we want to make it as aligned as possible. And how we do that, bottom line, clear out our past and focus on generating the feelings we want to feel so that we're attracting and creating things from the inside out.

[01:39:41]Luke Storey:  How do you feel being back here in your home state of Texas?

[01:39:45]Christine Hassler:  Great.

[01:39:46]Luke Storey:  You, like so many of us in California have done the—I think there's a word for it, like Brexit, it's like Caxit or something. You know what I mean?

[01:39:57]Christine Hassler:  That's good.

[01:39:57]Luke Storey:  Yeah.

[01:39:58]Christine Hassler:  Calxit, or Cali-exit, or something, yeah.

[01:40:01]Luke Storey:  Yeah, something like that. How are you settling back into the Lone Star State here?

[01:40:08]Christine Hassler:  I love it. I kept having dreams about California burning and all kinds of things when I was still living in LA. And I moved to San Diego and got kicked out of two places there because the landlord wanted to move in. And California kept pushing me out. And I married somebody from Australia who grew up on the beach, so I never thought I'd get him to move to Texas. Like I thought we'd have to be by the ocean. And he came here to visit my parents a couple of years ago, and he's walking down the street, he's like, dammit. What? You forget something? He goes, no, dammit. I said, What? He goes, my body really likes it here. I was like, hmm, that's interesting. 

[01:40:54] And then, a year later, right before we got married, we decided to make the move. And we were playing a game the other night with a bunch of my girlfriends and I, and one of the questions was, if you could name this chapter of your life, what would you name it? And my name for this chapter would be grounding. I feel like I'm grounding, and rooting, and I'm not so like all over the place. And I'm creating my family with my husband, and possibly children, and the community, and just like really grounding. And that's really what Texas feels like. It feels like this incredible grounding energy with also this expansiveness of consciousness. Just feels like a really special place to be.

[01:41:35]Luke Storey:  I have to say, that's been my experience here as well. Yeah. I feel very calm and still here. It's really interesting. It's palpable, especially after just having spent a-month-and-a-half in Sedona, as we were talking about earlier, which, yeah, I don't know, I like to think I'm pretty chill. I was psycho in Sedona. Like I was very edgy.

[01:42:00]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. It doesn't work for everybody. Some people's like, it is a vortex and it's amazing. For me, I'm like, give me all this vortex, I'm ready to go.

[01:42:06]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And it's beautiful and there are so redeeming qualities. But in terms of feeling grounded in a home kind of way, it wasn't that. But it's been incredible to be out here. And I love the idea you floated, and Kyle mentioned to me, too, about all of us getting a big-ass property out here, just making our own community, because I notice that everyone here is between 30 and 45 minutes apart. We all know very similar people, and run in the same circles of likeminded people, and that's beautiful, but everyone is kind of spread out. It's so huge here. That's the other weird thing, is like getting a sense of this place on a map is impossible.

[01:42:50]Christine Hassler:  It doesn't make sense, yeah.

[01:42:51]Luke Storey:  Yeah. Because it's like you're like, that thing's just right there. It's just right down the street from the thing. And then, you get in your car, you're like, oh, no, that's 45 minutes. That's like 60 miles. But on the map, it's like, no, it's right there. 

[01:43:03]Christine Hassler:  I know because there's water we have to get around here. So, it makes things longer. But here's what's so cool about Austin. So, you lived in LA so you know this. People are flaky. It's like you never know if someone was going to show up at a plan because something better could come along. Like flaky, flaky. People here, they say they're going to do something, they do it. Like I hosted a little thing at my house Saturday night and not one person flaked.

[01:43:25] And I was like, whoa, I expected at least three. That's the average given there are about eleven people, okay, three will flake, that's the average California flakiness percentage, everybody showed up. And I love that. There's like this, not yearning, but commitment to community, which is really, really cool. And there's not this like, do you belong or do you belong? Texas is just welcoming anyway. And so, I hope everyone moving here from all those other states, like bring your friendliness here.

[01:43:55]Luke Storey:  Yeah. And don't vote for the same kind of people that ruined the state that you're in.

[01:43:57]Christine Hassler:  Please no. Remember why you moved here, please.

[01:44:01]Luke Storey:  When I'm in downtown Austin, sometimes, I see things on the street that remind me very much of downtown Los Angeles, and I'm like, too many people from LA are voting poorly here. Like why is this happening? But anyway, we'll talk about that on another podcast. But I swear, if we do end up here, I am not going to bring bad policies from California to Texas.

[01:44:23]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. Just change your plates ASAP.

[01:44:26]Luke Storey:  No. Oh, my God. You know what's so funny? I rented that SUV out there and I didn't know it had California plates.

[01:44:32]Christine Hassler:  Oh, no.

[01:44:33]Luke Storey:  Yeah, I had no idea. I was like, I've rented it at the Austin airport, and I'm driving around, and, man, all these big Trump trucks are like on my ass. Like, I'm like, dude, I'm going 60. And they're like, pushing. And then, Alyson's like, oh, that's funny, we have California plates. I was like, oh, no wonder. I'm moseying along, trying to get the lay of the land, observing everything, and probably driving slower than someone who knows these roads like the back of their hand and there's big diesel, dually truck or whatever. 

[01:45:03] I'm like, definitely, got to change the plates immediately if you move here so that you don't get run off the road by a good old boy who's in a real hurry. Funny stuff. Well, I think we've covered it. I feel complete. I feel blessed by your presence and wisdom. And I'm going to ask you my last question now, Christine, which is, you may have heard of before if you're listening to the podcast.

[01:45:25]Christine Hassler:  I do listen to your podcast. 

[01:45:27]Luke Storey:  Who are three teachers or teachings that have influenced your work, your life, who you are, who you've become that you might recommend to our listeners? 

[01:45:35]Christine Hassler:  That person that really influenced my life probably more than anyone else, because she got me at such an early age, I started seeing her when I was 22, is a woman. She's no longer living unfortunately. Her name is Mona Miller. She wrote a book called Invisible Warfare. But it wasn't her book that changed my life. I saw her once a week for about 14 years, and she helped me become a coach. And she was the one that held my hand metaphorically, and sometimes, physically when I was moving through my journey of getting off antidepressants. And just was unconditional love and wisdom. I felt so blessed to be able to know her and study with her for so many years.

[01:46:11] My master's degree in spiritual psychology is from a place called the University of Santa Monica, and the teachers there, Mary and Ron Hulnick. The things that I learned there were an extension of everything that Mona taught me, but it was just this beautiful two-year program where I got to really connect with people and bond with people. And I learned so much about myself and really brought the spirituality back into my life. And then, I mean, there's so many I could list, but to kind of cover some of the stuff we talked about, my favorite teachers in masculine-feminine dynamics are David Deida and Alison Armstrong. Intimate Communion, I think, is an incredible book to really-

[01:46:48]Luke Storey:  Thank you for reminding me of Alison Armstrong. I used to listen to her tapes years ago, and I was like, I got to interview her and I kind of forgot. Thank you.

[01:46:55]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. I mean, after my divorce, I really devoured that work because I realized how much in my first marriage I really just didn't understand polarity, and was way more in my masculine energy, and really didn't know how to bring the best out in my husband. And I really wanted to to learn how to have that healthy dynamic. So, Intimate Communion is a great book. Alison Armstrong's stuff is really great too, did a lot of her courses, and really helped me.

[01:47:20] I love her because she teaches in such a real, no frills way, and you kind of have to get beyond, like when I first started listening to her, I'm like, oh, she wants me to be like a 1950s housewife, like this sounds awful. But when you dig deeper and you actually get what she's saying, it's so much about empowerment for both men and women, and that really having that healthy balance of masculine-feminine energy. So, so many good teachers, but those are two.

[01:47:46]Luke Storey:  That's great. Thank you for the reminder. I'm going to see if I can track her down now. Yeah. She is on one of my original goals. Yeah. I wrote a list of all the people I wanted to interview, and I've gotten to a few of them, but she's one that I have to get to. David Deida doesn't do podcasts, you can't get him.

[01:48:04]Christine Hassler:  No, you can't.

[01:48:05]Luke Storey:  So, I got his his protege, John Wineland, a few times on the show, but I find that framework of teaching to be so relevant and useful also. Just kind of same with John Grav. I've interviewed John Gray three times, and hung out, and listen to his stuff over and over again. And it's just like if you take out the political correctness, it's just sort of common sense and biology. 

[01:48:30] And when you're talking about energy, it goes beyond what genitals you have too. Like where do you want to be energetically in a relationship? And how can each party find access to those energies within themselves and have some awareness of how they work and which one you want to be operating from at any given time? It's really, really important for people that want to relate. And I can't wait to what, I think it's Saturday.

[01:48:55]Christine Hassler:  Saturday. We get to have our foursome. 

[01:48:57]Luke Storey:  And that will be my first podcast with four people because I could never figure out how to get my fourth mic to work. I attempted it once and I had to have one woman to sit out the conversation. I'm like, I'm so sorry you came over, but you're going to have to observe, but now, I've got it down. I've got four mics, so I'm looking forward to talking to both of you and doing a roundtable discussion on all things relationships.

[01:49:21]Christine Hassler:  Yeah. Conflict, masculine-feminine stuff, sacred union, sacred sexuality, all the things.

[01:49:26]Luke Storey:  Yeah. I'm stoked because I think one of the reasons I've done so many relationship shows is that's been the final frontier for me to gain some success or maybe even mastery in some ways. I say that lately, but you'd have to ask Alyson if that's true. But I've gotten pretty good at it.

[01:49:45]Christine Hassler:  Yeah, I'm sure you have.

[01:49:48]Luke Storey:  So, you teach what you most need to learn, and I've really focused on that. But aside from that, I just thank God when we're talking about childhood trauma, and looking back at the lineage of my family, and all of the survivors and warriors that I know that are on the path, it's like so much of that comes from the dysfunctional relationship of their parents. So, if we could teach our generation and the generations to follow how to relate in a healthier way, like, oh, my God, the future generations will be so well-served by the work that we're doing. So, yeah, I'm excited to do more of that with you.

[01:50:20]Christine Hassler:  Me, too.

[01:50:22]Luke Storey:  In closing, where can people find you? Website, social media, et cetera.

[01:50:28]Christine Hassler:  Christinehassler.com. You can sign up for my free coaching assessment, take you through a little process, and then Instagram is my favorite social media platform.

[01:50:35]Luke Storey:  Great. Awesome. Thanks for joining me.

[01:50:37]Christine Hassler:  Thanks so much for having me.

[01:50:51]

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