[Luke] All right, Dylan, here's where I wanna start. We're gonna get in a time machine, okay? This is gonna be good. I want you to take me back to the moment when you realized you were busted for selling cocaine. What was happening in your mind and your nervous system when you got the call or heard the knock, or however that played out?

[Dylan] Can you imagine being as relaxed as you could possibly be, or at least having a sense of the biggest relief, and then getting that phone call? So I've never told this part of my story ever. Exclusive, right here on The Lifestylists. This is, this is 100% exclusive. So I always tell the story of, oh, I got busted, and oh, this happened, and the whole nine on that. But what I left out was the prior problem that I had before that. So I had this little trip that I took where I drove myself, oh, about, I'd say about three and a half hours. I was meeting my, one of my closest friends that I had grown up with. He was driving from Texas. I was driving from Iowa. I'm meeting him halfway to get five pounds of dirty, old schwag weed at the time, which, you know, costed me 3 or 400 bucks a pound.

[Luke] But The kind that, the kind that still smells like gasoline?

[Dylan] Oh, yeah. The kind-

[Luke] We used to get that in LA. They smuggle it in a gas tank, and you'd be like, "Uh, this feels very flammable."

[Dylan] Oh, and half the way to sticks and seeds. Yeah. Something you wouldn't see at this point in time, right? Yeah. And so I drove down there and meet him. Now, mind you, I meet him in the Topeka, Kansas, which to me looks like Chainsaw Massacre country at night. I was not sure I was gonna make it out alive. So we start smoking pot together. He's got this really strong fire weed back then. And that's not the greatest idea when you're driving with five pounds of weed, because the car is gonna smell, and I was obliterated.

[Luke] Yeah. That is a rookie move, I have

[Dylan] To admit. That's very just ignorant. And it was, like, middle of the night, which was also very ignorant. And I'm in a huge Navigator, huge, decked-out Navigator, and it starts blowing wind. And I mean when I'm telling you it's blowing wind in, like, the wintertime in Iowa, 'cause this was Super Bowl time. And it was freezing, and I couldn't... The car was shaking while I was driving. Well, I start falling asleep driving home. And I mean, I'm falling asleep and swerving and weaving. And finally I said, "Shit, I'm pulling over. Rest stop." And I pull into a rest stop and fall asleep. It was about two and a half hours. And I woke up, and I didn't even realize where the hell I was, and just wasn't high anymore. Get back out and start driving. I start driving- Five minutes and I see a cop behind me and I'm like, "Oh, dude, really?" And I'm-- my heart is just pumping out of my chest and I'm trying to drive as perfect as I can and, you know, the wind is blowing bad. I'm talking dead of winter. Makes

[03:56]

[Luke] Everyone look like a drunk driver. Yes.

[Dylan] Well, I think at one point I kinda crossed the line and I saw the lights go on and I'm like, "Oh no, no." It's like two thirty in the morning and, you know, the cop comes up and starts questioning me, asking me what I'm doing on the road so late and da, da, and finally says, "Oh, I smell weed in the car. I'm gonna, I'm gonna have to ask you to step out of the car." And I'm just, I'm toast, right? And I got pulled over in a place called Plattsburg, Missouri, population twelve hundred, and I don't know where the hell I am. I'm out in the middle of nowhere and get taken to jail. And come to find out they give me a fifty thousand dollar bond. Now most people go, "Oh, a fifty thousand dollar bond, well you gotta pay ten percent and you get out." This was cash only.

[Luke] Oh.

[Dylan] Meaning you're not getting out unless your mom and dad or whoever comes up with fifty grand. So imagine me having enough trouble just call and collect to get the call home. I had enough wherewithal when I got pulled over and was waiting in the car to call home and wake my parents up at three in the morning and tell them what was happening so they at least knew. And I got taken to the smallest, tiniest dungeon you've ever seen, man. And I've been in prisons, I've been in jails. This is one of the worst things I've ever seen, out in the middle of nowhere. And finally, the next day my mom and dad were able to get ahold of like the head defense attorney who used to be the prosecutor in that town and was able to get me out for far, you know, the normal bond rate. And so I had to go to court every like other month, drive all the way to Missouri to fight this case. Well they wanted to give me a felony charge or two years probation and knock it down and I didn't wanna do either 'cause I didn't wanna do probation in Missouri and I didn't want a felony. So we fought and fought and fought for like a year. Finally, they reduced it against the judge's will to five misdemeanor counts of possession for each pound and a thousand dollar fine. So again, I had to borrow five grand. I thought, "Man, sweet Drove up there, went to the court case, got ripped by the judge about how I didn't deserve that deal. You know, took my licking, paid the five grand, driving home. Biggest relief ever. Get a call about 30 minutes after I left, "Your apartment's getting ransacked right now." And I go, I'm sitting there and I'm silent, and my... I kinda see my mom looking in the rear view mirror and looking at me, and I'm saying, "Okay," and I'm kinda trying to play it off. I had just gotten a big shipment of cocaine in.

[Luke] What's big?

[Dylan] Half a key. And anybody that doesn't understand what that means, that's a lot. And so long story short, the postal inspector had knocked on my door about something completely unrelated, some... I'm not even gonna get into it. Some BS with an ex-girlfriend and a credit card. Well, they saw a bong on the counter, which they then called the drug task force, 'cause, you know, a bong now, no one would bat an eye. But at, in 2008 or whenever this was, '07 or '08, yeah, it was a big deal. So they called them. They came over and immediately entered, went into my room, broke my safe wide open, and found this. So imagine that conversation. How were they able to get a warrant? Oh, I don't know. The

[07:27]

[Luke] Probable cause was having

[Dylan] The bong. Probable cause because of Huh. Yeah. Imagine how that felt to tell my mom and dad after we had been driving back and forth-... and gone through all this, "Guess what just happened?"

[Luke] Oh, man.

[Dylan] Yeah. So that was fun. And so my mom hid me, took me to one of her friend's house, where I stayed. My dad went to my apartment to see what was happening, and it was just torn to shit, just completely everywhere, and that was how I got caught. Oftentimes you will get caught just because you're going to. It's not because you get caught selling it or someone sets you up. Yeah, that happens. I thought I was as buttoned up as could be, but I really wasn't, 'cause if I was, I would've never left the apartment and only sold it and stayed home. But, you Yeah If you're doing that, you're living a completely different lifestyle.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] You know, you're not thinking that way.

[Luke] Do you look at it now, you know, so many years on the other side of that, as a sort of destiny?

[Dylan] I think that it... I had veered off course prior to that so far that had to happen to get me towards my destiny. I don't think that was the Right... but I think it had to happen.

[Luke] It was a necessary catalyst-

[Dylan] Absolutely...

[Luke] To change directions in a meaningful way.

[Dylan] So I don't look back on it in terms of I wish that wouldn't have happened. I wish I wouldn't have been that kind of person. That's where I have the, that mindset of where, okay, I regret this because I don't like who I was. In fact, I hate who I was, but I needed to go through that to get me to where I need to be now because I just wasn't gonna get here otherwise. If I hadn't made those mistakes, if I hadn't have had to learn those lessons and feel what I felt, really feel that I let people down that love me, really feel that I internally was doing something that I hated the whole time, until I understood what that pain meant for others, not just Dylan, and saw that kind of pain, I needed it. I needed it all. And I also needed to be humbled and shown what it was like to not have anything, to sleep with murderers, to have rats around me, and to be strip-searched out of nowhere who knows how many times, and to be just humiliated, talked down to I needed that because now I understand, now I know, now I get it, now I understand what it's like to be reduced to nothing and be forced to rebuild. Now I understand what perseverance means. Now I understand what endurance means, and now I really understand what humility means and selflessness. I did not know what these words meant. only by Webster's definition.

[Luke] So youyou're one of the few people that I know that has experienced my all-time ultimate fear. More so than death actually, and that is going to prison. I've always sensed that in a past life, I was in prisons because no one wants to go to jail or prison, right? Like, everyone is afraid of that. But for me, I mean, it's like just unimaginable in terms of how terrifying that is to me. Mm-hmm. When I was an addict, I was so afraid of that I managed to avoid getting busted, though most of my buddies were, but I was, I was so paranoid because I was so afraid. Yeah. And I think there is something old to it, but I think part of the fear is obviously just the confinement. No one wants to have their personal liberty taken away. But I think part of it too is just from watching movies about prison and, you know, I imagine that you get in there and you're segregated into some racial group, and Mm-hmm... you know, your bunky is trying to, trying to, what's the R word you like, right? It's like we, at least men I think have this sense in prison that, you know, you're gonna be the subject to violence and assault and things like that constantly. And then I have met people like you that have done a little time, and they're like, "Eh, if you know, if you just kinda keep to yourself and you're chill, it sucks, but it's not like it is in the movies." Mm-hmm. Do you... I mean, obviously it, I'm sure it wasn't a fun experience, but was it as terrifying and violent as many of us imagine it to be? I mean, did you have to, you know, become someone's servant so that they didn't take your lunch and all this kind of shit like you see on TV? So

[11:59]

[Dylan] I mean, there are some places called war camps where they're just known for fighting a lot. There are prisons like that were known. I got sent to a prison that was more for drug-related offenses or people that had been busted like using drugs, making drugs. Like in Iowa, a lot of the people were in there for meth-related charges, whether it was stealing the things off of farms to make meth, and they were getting like 15, 20-year sentences for that. It's a serious offense. Wow. And then there was a lot of people that were driving through, passing through that were pulled over because you know the only place in the United States where I-80 and 35 intersect is in Des Moines, Iowa. Oh. So a lot of drug traffickers are driving through, and it's hitting right there. Oh, okay. So I was in one of those prisons. Now, I will tell There are certain things that you see that are definitely present or that happen and some things that I didn't see. I'm not saying they don't happen, 'cause there's federal prisons that are different. There's certain, like, bigger or smaller prisons where who knows what goes on. I can only speak from where I was. And so when I was in jail and got the sentencing given to me, they first send you to like a centralized location. It's a, it's like a prison that they also use for processing. So it is an actual prison, but there's a lot of just processing where you're waiting to get sent to your, where your final destination is.

[Luke] The first- It's a, it's a layover.

[Dylan] It Yeah, exactly.

[Luke] A really shitty layover.

[Dylan] You might wanna... Yeah, I'm trying to think of what the worst layover airport could ever be. so I had two weeks of this, and They put you in there and tell you get 23 and one, which means that you're in your cell for 23 hours and you're out for one. And that's not outdoors, it just means you get to get out. Well, that was bullshit. It was 23 and a half and a half. And when I tell you that this was hell on earth, I was in the tiniest, smallest cell with nothing but a bunk. So there was a guy underneath me who didn't have any teeth at all, barely spoke, and a toilet, and that was it. And when I tell you that I was sleeping on hard iron, the pads were like this thick. And you don't... There's nothing you can do but lay there and stare at the ceiling. And I really just had to sit there and thought and wonder what happened and what I was doing there.

[Luke] So no books or TV or anything?

[Dylan] Oh, I'll get to the books.

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] Here's the best part.

[Luke] So when you discovered the Bible?

[Dylan] Well, not No... not, no, I had been very raised Catholic and always in church.

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] I went down the day that we got to go get books. The newest book out there was from like 1905. So all the books I was looking at were like 1860 to 1890. So I read a book on Christopher Columbus I remember reading it was like 1887 or something, the year 1890, I don't remember, but it was still in the 1800s. And these books were barely even intact. That's all they had. I got a prison guard to slip me a sports section one day 'cause the NBA finals were going on, and he slipped me one under the door. And then you only got to shower three days a week, and you had five minutes, and they were on you that five minutes, "Get your ass out," and that's it. So you ate at 6:30 in the morning, 10:30, and 3:30, and that was it. And it was little to nothing what they gave you. And I normally gave away the breakfast 'cause all they gave you was like dry cereal, and I'm talking like a little thing like this, a pastry which I wasn't gonna eat, and milk. So I traded the dessert for milk, so I could have a couple milks to try to get protein.

[15:45]

[Luke] So worse than a school lunch.

[Dylan] Oh, way I would've given anything. That's imaginable. Yeah. I would've given anything for a school lunch. So two weeks of that, then I finally... They just come out of nowhere and tell you, "Okay, we're going to the next spot," which is better because you actually get to go outside and have some freedom to roam. Your room is not locked. This was like a door shut, like a real dungeon locked. So this was about 60 days, and they don't tell you when you're going anywhere. They come wake you up and say, "It's time to go," because otherwise you could call home or try to tell people where you're going. They don't tell you where you're going. So 7:00 in the morning, they take everybody out and they start taking you to prisons all over the state of Iowa, and you don't know where you're going. It's just wherever they call your name, you get dropped off. So imagine this. I'm sitting with chains on my legs and my hands in a box. Can't move, can't drink, can't eat nothing from 7:00 in the morning. And guess who was on the last stop of the day? Me. 7:00 in the morning, I didn't get to my final destination, so I drove through the entire state of Iowa until 7:30 at night, and I got to stop to pee once when at one of the prison stops. They let us use the bathroom. Never fed us, fed us anything. Nothing. Zero. So I didn't eat all day and drink anything all day. They didn't give us anything.

[Luke] You're a pioneer in fasting.

[Dylan] Oh, ultimate fasting. That was my best years of fasting were in there. So then I finally got to my place Get there, and what they give you is a pair of steel-toe boots, a pair of jeans, and a shirt, and that's it until you can buy things of your own or that's just what you got. Then you know what? I take that back. There were two or three pairs of jeans and a few pairs of shirts and the boots. You had to buy shoes. The $45 pair of New Balances meant you were rich if you could buy those, and I mean rich. So after all of that and getting in there and getting a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, so I had some juice, I went out to the prison yard. So first day out there, never seen a prison yard or anything. One of the first things I see is a guy with no shirt on and a big swastika tattooed on his chest, and I'm sitting here going, "What the fuck is going on, man?"

[Luke] That's just like the movies.

[Dylan] That is just like the movies. So I played college basketball, and I was I was playing heavy basketball at the time. So I started walking around, went over to the basketball court. I'm in jeans and steel-toe boots, and I just waited, and I was waiting, and I said, "um, next I'll play. Next game." And I went out there and f-cking ripped it down in steel-toe boots and my hair that I had been growing out in jail and waiting 'cause I normally always had hair like this, and I had just been growing it. Really long hair bouncing around on the court and just went out and tore it, tore it up and got instant respect. So that saved me right away because all kinds of people that were standing there watching took note. And then from there, I was in that medium security for about three weeks before they sent me to the minimum. Now mind you, I was in a cell of four, and the guy sleeping under me was in there for murder. So I had a murderer sleeping underneath me too. So it went from just one interesting thing to the other till I finally got sent to the minimum side because I was on a smaller sentence. I had a 15-year sentence, but I knew they knew that I had the ability to see the parole board in a couple years, and I was not a violent offender. So then they send you to the minimum side.

[19:30]

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[Dylan] I had no, I had no wherewithal for anything other than what was I gonna buy next or what party was I gonna be able to do? Like, what was next for me and what I was gonna buy, or how cool was I gonna look? I never saved any money. I, u-until the very end, which thankfully I did, 'cause when I got out, I had about $25,000 saved, which my mom and dad were sending me so I could buy food every week and kinda live in there properly. Otherwise, I would've been really screwed. Although that experience was absolutely, I don't even wanna say frightening, it was just so humbling and reduced me to nothing. It gave me every tool that I needed. So when I look at it, that may have been the single most invest- biggest invest- investment I ever made because had that not happened and had I not done all that, I learned a lot of street smart. I learned a lot of ability to handle situations that I was in that would terrify any human. I mean, that would And I tell my wife some of these stories now, and I'm just like, "Man, I can't even believe I'm telling you this shit," or that I did some of these things or I was not scared or had no understanding. But I'm thankful because now I'm able to look at people and rationalize with ways of thoughts because I can take myself back to what I was thinking. And so, you know, I was talking to you about this before when you were on my show about knowledge and wisdom and these things, and I can see now when people think things, why they're thinking it, or what's going on up there, where if you've never experienced some of the things that I have, you would never understand what's going on. Why are you making these decisions? What is driving you to do this? How does this seem rational? I would have never known how to answer that before. Now I can look into the depths of what happened and what's causing it and what is the continuous driving force behind it and how to fix it, or at least how to address it. And I know how to communicate well and get people to listen to me because they know that I'm speaking from like a rational sense, not a dictator and not somebody that's repeating something they heard online or some bullshit. No, I've lived it. And I'm-- what I'm telling you is you're not invincible. You will get caught. But I also give inspiration that if you have, you can fix this. You can. You have to tell yourself and know you can, but you could go invest in all these courses and all these classes and all these people that get rich quick and these motivational speakers that are just taking your money. What I was able to go through and experience is invaluable. Now, I'm not saying go to prison and do these things to learn your lesson and get... But some people require a different level of humility to get grace and to understand, you know? And Well

[24:17]

[Luke] Said. Do you think having those experiences has Improved your capacity for empathy?

[Dylan] Yes

[Luke] You know, in terms of being less judgmental on people who are stuck in life and making poor decisions? It helped.

[Dylan] It took a lot of prayer and a lot of nervous system regulation for me to get to that point. But yes, now that I've been able to open up and get myself out of this constant, like, sympathetic nervous state where I'm stuck constantly and I've been able to, then I can think back and remember, and then I'm able to utilize it. It took me a while, though, to get to that point, but yes. Now, when I look back at certain things, I don't have PTSD. I actually have a sense of reality of what happened and why, and the things that I need to look at within people that I can see, you know? And it gives me a better means of understanding, but like you said, it gives me a higher level of compassion Mm-hmm What you're going through.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] And, you know, some people have things going on, and some people are just kinda in a shit bag mentality, but it can be fixed. It doesn't mean you have to be a permanent shithead, 'cause I was. I mean, I was, you know? And I can't get over it. Me too,

[Luke] Brother.

[Dylan] Well, then you know. And you think at the time, like, "Am I always gonna be like this?" Like, "Why am I like this?" But then you quickly realize it's not who you are. It's not. It's who you have either thought you wanted to be or let yourself become, but it's not who you are.

[Luke] I think from my own experience with addiction and some criminality I look at those things as symptoms of an underlying problem, you know? And I think society and the you know, this system of law that we have and the courts and kind of all of this infrastructure looks at someone who's fallen into criminality or addiction as a moral failing. Mm-hmm. Right? Rather than there's a human being that's hurting under there. And unfortunately, you know, when someone's hurting, typically they're gonna go hurt other people- Mm-hmm Whether consciously or not. But it seems like you know, most people that enter into that cycle in the prison system, it becomes kind of a revolving Yeah... situation, right? I mean, I was telling you earlier how you know, I was faced with four years of juvenile detention when I was 14, and thank God, you know, my parents had the wherewithal to get me out of that situation and send me to a really weird boarding school. But I look back on that and I think, man, if I would've got sent away, I mean, it's very likely that I would've just ended up just in a recycling bin in and out of those kind of situations, you know? I Mm-hmm... people that go to prison don't typically get out and turn their life around, right? Mm-hmm. what do you think it was about your character or makeup that prevented you from continuing that cycle and just ending up back in the same situation?

[27:32]

[Dylan] I had a conversation one day with my mom, and I remember where I was sitting. I remember when it was during the day. I remember... I can see it, like, very vividly and clearly, sitting in that chair at that payphone with the collect call, and I was... I had just gotten strip-searched again, and I was bitching and complaining about how terrible everything was, and I did that often. You know, "Woe is me." Every single day something. And she finally said to me, she said, "Dylan, are you really that selfish that all you think about is what you're going through? And how about the people that are just scared to death every day for you, and how about the people that invested all this time and effort into you?" Because, you know, prior to that, I had a finance degree. I had, I think, 10 certifications from NASM in different aspects of personal training and health, and I had studied and had really solid grades and had made a secondary life probably to hide the one that I was doing, but I had done a lot, right? But it was still kind of a facade. And I didn't really know what to say, you know? Because it dawned on me then how selfish I was, and ex-girlfriends had told me I was selfish, and others had said I was selfish, and I knew I was selfish. I knew I was, because it was always something about me. And then we-

[Luke] Were you an only child?

[Dylan] Yeah.

[Luke] Yep.

[Dylan] And I'll, I'm gonna tell you something about that too.

[Luke] Me too.

[Dylan] So you know.

[Luke] I, well, I think most people I know that were the single child tend to be geared more towards self-centeredness.

[Dylan] Well, hear.

[Luke] Just an observation. I'm not saying it's always the case. There are of course exceptions, but I know for me, that had a lot to do with it. It's like when you grow up as a kid and the entire family unit is kind of centered around That's it... and you're getting all the attention, it's very easy to kind of acclimate to that and give yourself all the attention. You know?

[Dylan] My mom tells me a story, and I kinda remember it, but I kinda... I think I do. But she says that, I think I was three, and her and my dad asked me if I wanted a brother or sister, and my response, "Well, do you have to love them?" "Well, yes, of course." "No." No. And I never had a brother or sister. I think there was a sense of relief 'cause I don't know that they necessarily wanted another kid. I think I was too much. But that was my response. Yeah. So that probably tells you all you need to know.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] But then she said to me, "Were me and your dad really that bad of parents?" And then I... That kinda broke me.

[Luke] Ooh.

[Dylan] That, I started to kinda cry a little bit, and I caught myself 'cause there's, you know, I don't want anybody in there seeing me crying, obviously. But from that moment, that's when I started to say, "Okay, what am I gonna do? How am I gonna fix this?" I am not gonna sit here and tell any lie that I knew exactly what I was gonna do when I got out and da-da-da. That's bullshit. But what I did know is that I was gonna figure it out.

[30:38]

[Luke] Mm-hmm.

[Dylan] I will tell you with certainty that I was determined to never go back there, and I watched people get out and come back in there, and I saw exactly what you're saying. And I was dead set on, "You'll never see me here again," and I busted my ass in there in terms of pushing myself. I was up at 3:30 and 4:00 in the morning, and there was... You had a timeframe where you could go work out before your first count and breakfast. So 3:30, I'd get up. I'd go do my... I had a little shit job where I'd go wake people up for their medications. Then I'd go right outside. And I mean, I'm talking blizzards, rain, lightning, whatever, I went outside. And I remember working out with a jump rope in the winter, and it wouldn't swing 'cause of the wind. It was blowing. So I would run cold water on it and turn it into a ice rope, and I'd do sets of 500 till it snapped, and then every day they'd give me a new one. Like, I did, I ran sprints on ice. I twisted my ankle. I fell. I did whatever. Every... Never missed a day the whole time, and they, the counselor saw me. the, some of the things I did training-wise to even now it sounds insane. I don't even... I... It's like I don't know how anyone would believe me, but I did it every day. And I pushed myself to the max, and I was able to become trained, and not just physically, but mentally. Trained to deal with the circumstances, trained to accept them, trained to stop feeling bad for myself, and to learn how to overcome and not just be Dylan-centric.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] And then, you know, I was, I was reading the Bible and praying consistently, but I was trying. You know, I know now that it wasn't the best, but it also was helpful, you know. And I'll get into later what I do now, but it was setting the stage for me. And it was a process of healing that I needed and a process of learning how to not be so self-absorbed and indulgent and more about others. And it took me a long while after that, but that got me on the right path of worrying about everybody else and not so much myself.

[Luke] Well, it's funny because I think the the corrections industry in general probably hopes that's what's going to happen, right? I Yeah... like that's the best possible outcome- Mm-hmm If somebody's breaking the law and harming other people, right? That they get put away for a while and have some time to think and reflect and come out and choose differently. Yeah. You know, it's just unfortunately, it's rare. I think a lot of that probably has to do with A lot of people that are locked up are addicts, right? Mm-hmm. And you get out of prison and you don't have the kind of support that's necessary, the addiction's just gonna kick right back in. I mean, you know, I watched this for 20 years, people going in and out of rehab, you know. Mm-hmm. Same kind of thing. And it's like, if they don't wanna change, they're not going to.

[33:39]

[Dylan] Yeah. Well, here's the thing. look, I'm like as non-bitch as they come, so I am not worried about getting yelled at. I'm not worried about, you know, anybody telling me anything I need to fix or improve or whatever. I'm not scared of any of that, nor do I really worry about it one way or another. But I will say this, in fairness. You're not in there to have a party and get treated well or any of the sort, but it gets to the point where you do certain things and you abuse people verbally so much that you infuse anger in these people to where they just, they're angry when they leave and they just wanna kill somebody by the time they get out. See, that, I don't think that's helpful. That's, I don't think that's rehabbing people. Yeah. I think taking you out of the world, punishing you know, having these strict rules and things you have to follow and taking everything away from you is a lot, right? But then when you start getting into some of the verbal abuse and the yelling at people all the time, the constant things that go on that develop anger and rage in people, I don't think that's beneficial, and I think that's part of the reason why you see people go back because they're so pissed off at the world when they get out.

[Luke] Yeah. Well, they're-traumatized. Exactly.

[Dylan] You know?

[Luke] Most people that get into drugs and crime are, you know, responding to some sort of trauma and pain, and so you put them in a place and cause more pain. It's like, duh. Yeah. You're just, you're making a powder keg just ready to go unleash on society, hence the revolving door, you know?

[Dylan] Well, it's like an abused animal. Of course, after a while you're not gonna see that loving animal that most animals are because they've been abused. What do you expect? They're gonna be on guard. They're gonna be full of anger and rage. And so there's a fine line, right? Like I said, it's not supposed to be a treat to go in there, but at the same time you gotta factor in all the things that you're taking away from somebody in doing it. It's like, when does it hit the point where, okay, now you're actually, you're making it worse. Yeah. You're not rehabilitating people. Like I said, I, uh... Look, I, you're not gonna get any bitch out of me. I got what I deserved, and there were things in there I know I needed. But man, like, sometimes you don't need to just get yelled at for the sake of getting yelled at and called a piece of shit and a scumbag and everything just 'cause. Yeah... that's not helpful.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] You know? That's that old school drill sergeant shit that's not helping.

[Luke] Full Metal Jacket.

[Dylan] Yes, exactly. That's exactly what I was thinking. Private Pyle, you

[Luke] Know? All right. So so I got a funny thing to share with you. I really resist the temptation as a podcaster to go look at, like, the iTunes charts, right? Yeah, and every once a year, every couple years, I just think, "Oh, I wonder how my show's doing," right? Yeah. And what's out there? Who are the other podcasters? And inevitably I'll look at, you know, the top 10 in my category, alternative health and whatever And I'll see a couple in the top two, three, four, five that I haven't heard of. I'll screenshot it and send it to my team and go, "Who the F are these people? Where did they come from? What are we doing wrong here, man?" Yeah. Right? I'm, like, 10 years in just grinding, giving this thing all I've got, and I'm number 25 or 50 or whatever, right? Yeah. And your podcast is one of the ones I've sent my team like, "Who is this guy? What is he doing, you guys? We're missing something here." Yeah. Kind of just taking a left turn here. you seem to be one of these cats that just... And maybe you were doing stuff that I just didn't know about before that, but you seem one of these guys that, you know, hit the health and wellness scene running and just, like, came out of nowhere.

[37:12]

[Dylan] Mm-hmm.

[Luke] Now, if I didn't know you as I'm getting to know you know, today in the chat we had the other day, I would think you were a fed, you know? I mean, you're not doing political content, so that's very unlikely, but sometimes there's these meteoric rises of people in the space, and I just feel like this can't be organic. Mm-hmm. It just, like, they come out of nowhere, a Sean Ryan or, I don't know, just different people, and I'm like, "What? Who is this guy?" Yeah. You know? I don't think you're a fed. But, I hope not. But I'm yeah, the... Someone would be at the door by now if you were. and they're probably not gonna make a fed out of you based on the story you just told about your past. No, I don't think so. But yeah, I'm gonna fast-forward, and then we can jump around a little bit. I'm kind of a nonlinear host. But I'm curious at what point did you get into podcasting. You know, what was Mm-hmm... born of, and how did you seemingly just come out of nowhere and just be dominating like you are?

[Dylan] I had a pretty large built-in audience, and I'll explain. So when I got out of prison, I got sent to Maui, which was my parents lived. And when I, when I was sent there I got this email about a testosterone booster. And, you know, I'm a big athlete. I was a college basketball player, always into sports and athletics, always. And I was like, you know, I lost so much weight in prison. I was training so much, but I certainly wasn't getting the nourishment, so I was the skinniest I'd ever been since... I dropped down to a weight that I was in early high school, and it was just too skinny. Like, you know, it was like a 10, 10 or 11-year-old weight for me. And I saw some of the advertising. I thought, "You know what, man? I'm just... I'm f*cking going hard, you know? What else am I gonna do? I go to work, and I can't do anything. I'm on parole. I don't... I'm scared shitless to do anything." So I started getting into it. I started getting on these bodybuilding forums, and then I started to study all of the aspects of hormones, steroids, and how People were utilizing different methods of training and incorporating diet, steroid use, everything. 'Cause I was into steroid use from the baseball era. Fascinated, right? Not using it, but fascinated. So within, I don't know, two, three months, I got found by one of the big companies under that was seeing me post all the time, and I got into conversations with them, and people were following me like crazy 'cause I was posting all my workouts and all this shit that I was doing 'cause I had done this in prison, so I came out doing it.

[Luke] You already had the discipline. Oh, yeah. yeah.

[Dylan] But I was eating. And this

[Luke] Is, this is YouTube or, like, just-

[Dylan] Well-...

[Luke] On forums?

[Dylan] For forums first. Okay. And so I made a big name in just, like, a few months, and most of these people had been on there years and didn't have names. But I was crazy intense, like, super intense, and I was posting pictures, and I could eat now. So I was getting... You know, I had six, almost eight abs at one point without taking shit, you know, which was unheard of. So then I got into this, and they came to me and said, "You know" We think we can make something out of you. How is your ability to record? How do you speak in front of people? Can you do videos or anything?" Well, you know, before I got in trouble, on a lot of my cocaine nights, I was making these YouTube videos, like sports debate stuff, 'cause I was into that, and I... Nobody was watching them. I just put them on YouTube for fun, but I sent them to them. Kind

[40:39]

[Luke] Of like my videos on YouTube. So I had a look at that stuff. I'm just like, "Really?"

[Dylan] Yeah. Oh, man.

[Luke] 489 views. I'm like, that's Rick Rubin or Joe Despa- you know, like, huge people. I'm like, "What is wrong?" Anyway.

[Dylan] Oh, it's bad. And looking back on these, it's

[Luke] Terrible. Content creation in general is just mystifying to me, especially- Oh... nowadays. It's just... Anyway.

[Dylan] If you saw what I was using, this was 2007 when I was making these videos, and the fact that I was even able to figure out how to do it and edit them the way I was doing it is still astonishing to me. Anyway, they saw it and they said, "Okay, here's what we want you to do, and we're gonna invest all this time, money, everything, 'cause we're gonna make you huge. But we want you to talk about steroids, SARMs, and peptides." And I'm sitting there going, "You want me to talk about f*cking steroids when I just got out of prison? And I have no clue what SARMs and peptides are. I have zero idea." So I learned legally it was completely fine to talk about them. I'm not selling them, so that's fine. And I told them, I said, "Okay, I'm interested, but I don't know what some of this sh*t even is. I need literature, I need data." Well, there's very little data. You know, so I really discovered-

[Luke] You'd have to read Russian to understand peptides back then.

[Dylan] It was... There were seven that you could... Seven or eight that you... They even sold on research markets. So I just inundated myself. I stayed up every night and every time when I was at work, 'cause I got a... I couldn't get a job. I got a job selling cell phones. So when there was no customers, I was reading. Long story short, within a year, I had a million subscribers on YouTube.

[Luke] Wow. Back then.

[Dylan] Yeah. Nobody Wow... talking about the things I was talking about. And I, and people either followed me to love me or to absolutely hate me, because, like, I was causing rifts in my education. Because I was teaching people how to use them, but also speaking out against them at the same time. So it's like, here's how you use them safely. All these meatheads and these just juicers are killing you, and they're killing themselves. So I was pissing a lot of people off, but all of these people that are out there using them that are clueless were now learning how to use them safely. Well, safer. I shouldn't say safely, but a lot safer- Mm... 'cause they're still highly dangerous. And so I was developing a huge following, but also making a lot of enemies. I got attacked left and right, man. And so one of my channels eventually got shut down 'cause they were doing everything they can to shut me down 'cause I was costing steroid dealers money speaking out against use. Oh,

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] And anyway, I mean, I was devastated, bro. You know, losing a million subscribers, what kind of work and money that was doing. And it took me a while and I restarted, and I grew the channel again And I'm telling you, grew it, spent all this time doing it. COVID time hits, and I didn't say shit about COVID. I could care less about making videos about that. But people that were doing anything extreme were getting just shut down left and right. So I got shut down again. And I actually got that channel back, like, three or four years later on appeal, but it was toast. Once you get it back after that long, it's rendered useless. So that's when I started working on my Instagram, and so I started building that like crazy and started making content, shorts, clips, and nobody was shutting anything down. And then I got a big opportunity. I got invited to speak at Mr. Olympia with a bunch of doctors and me, the online guy. And I mean, I was ready going in there, dude. Like I don't ever wanna say, "Well, I know more than a doctor," 'cause I didn't go to get my PhD, but I was versed in that type of thing way more than most of them were. And there was a good back and forth from a doctor's viewpoint and from somebody that coached bodybuilders and professional athletes and thousands of people, 'cause I was training all sorts of people. I have NDAs I had to sign because if they brought me in, they know why they were bringing me in, right? Big names writing me for anything. And I got invited to speak there. And then on top of that, the guy that invited me, he said, "Okay, I got somebody I want you to meet." And it... Her name was Monica Brant. She was a former Ms. Olympia, and she invites me to co-host her podcast at the event. So I went from doing nothing to not having a breath of air 'cause I co-hosted with her, and then I'd-- When it was my turn to speak, I'd leave and go speak and go right back to the booth. So three days straight of just... It was, like, 8:00 or 9:00 in the morning till 5:00 or 6:00 at night. But it was amazing. I made all these connections. Well, she was being sponsored by a company called StemReGen, who happens to be, like, in the biohacking sphere, one of the most well-known name companies there is. They sponsor every event. So they were watching me speak, and I was interacting with them, and they were kind of blown away by what I was doing and I was fascinated what they were doing. So I make all these contacts, and I'm all excited, man. Me and Queenie fly home, and it's... You know, I'm going to the gym right away 'cause I had missed gym days. I go to the gym, and it was, like, 10:00, 10:30 at night. And I called her when I was coming home. I said, "You know what? I'm gonna stop at CVS. I don't feel good. Like, I don't feel good at all." And I said, "I'm gonna buy a COVID test 'cause I feel really, like, un-unwell." And sure enough, I had COVID. Dude, when I woke up the next day, I couldn't move. Like, literally couldn't move. And I was laying in bed, and that's when I Was like, "Well, I can't do anything today, so I'm just gonna..." I pulled out my phone and I looked StemRegen up and started to see what the hell they were doing, and that's when I found this biohacking space of people. I didn't know any of the people I interviewed or talked to.

[46:26]

[Luke] Oh, wow. Yeah.

[Dylan] And I told-- called her in and I said, "You know what? I think I just figured out what I was put here to do. I've been doing everything wrong." And that was the moment where I was asking God, like, "Why is this happening when I'm supposed to be making all these contacts today?" And that was one of the first times I said, "I'm just gonna trust you," 'cause I've always still pouted and wondered why this has happened to me. And I sat there, dude, for I don't know how many hours, and I just started reading. And that was about the same time I was deciding to start my podcast, and I just started reaching out to everybody. I said, "I'm so and so. I'm doing this." And everything I did from then on out was me not taking no for an answer. All these people that are gate kept that you can't get to, I just was so fricking relentless and did it all. And my first guest was former UFC champion Miesha Tate. That was my first guest that I had, and I met her when I was with, interviewing with Monica at the event. And I just started there, and that was like January of 2025 or Decem- it was the end of December. And you know, I had a really strong following, but in a totally different world.

[Luke] Yeah. Yeah.

[Dylan] And I carried that into what I do, and it was like, man, it was like this light bulb of discernment and understanding of what I was meant to do. And that's when it started, and here we are.

[Luke] I spent a long time adding healthy habits to my daily routine, but it wasn't until I started paying attention to what was really draining me that everything changed. Here's the short version of the story. Years ago, I lived under two massive cell towers in LA. No matter how clean I ate or how many health protocols I followed, my sleep was terrible, my nervous system was fried, and I felt awful. So that experience sent me down the rabbit hole of man-made EMFs and how to reduce their effects. And that's exactly when Leela Quantum became a key part of my strategy. Here at home, I use their quantum block to create a more coherent environment. And when I'm out and about in the world, I wear their Heal 360 capsule. It's quantum charged with these little titanium spheres that generate a coherent field around the body. The result of that is that I get home feeling more like myself, especially after travel or long days in EMF-heavy environments, which heads up is any urban area. And when I'm flying or expecting higher exposure, I take it a step further. That's where I add their EMF-blocking clothing. It shields against 99% of measurable wireless radiation. So if you don't wanna spend your life living in a Faraday cage and you wanna be healthy at the same time, here's what you do. Visit lukestory.com/LeelaQ. That's L-E-E-L-A-Q. And if you use the code LUKE10, you're gonna get 10% off your first order. Now, obviously, we can't avoid the modern world, but you can move through it with much more resilience, and that's why you wanna get over to lukestory.com/LeelaQ. It's incredible. So it's like you were in this other kind of dimension of the health space. It's like just amazing convergence of timing, right? Mm-hmm. Where like you have some expertise in relationships and then you stumble across this massive thing called biohacking.

[49:49]

[Dylan] Yeah.

[Luke] Let's talk about you know, something I actually haven't talked about on the show which I think could be useful to people especially right now. A, first off I want to know what SARs are. SARS? Is that what SARMs. SARMs? Okay. Yeah. That. But peptides have become all the rage. hormone replacement therapy has become all the rage and I think a lot of people now, I mean there's a lot of opportunistic companies kind of coming into the space- Mm... of peptides specifically and I think a lot of people don't know necessarily what they're doing. Mm-hmm. So you have much more knowledge about this kind of category than I do so perhaps we could start with your perspective on where some of the kind of public figures in the biohacking space are leading themselves or other people astray.

[Dylan] Yeah. Yeah. so when I discovered these, when they were brought to my attention, I don't want to act like I'm Christopher f*cking Columbus here. I... When they were introduced to Yeah... and I found them it was called a research chemical site is where you can buy these and that is labeled not for human consumption.

[Luke] Yeah. I'm familiar with these sites.

[Dylan] Right. Yeah. So I learned very early what they were and have now watched the evolution and I know owners of all of them or used to. And I spoke with them and got data on everything and I knew everything and I've talked about the whole entire underground market, how it works. I mean, I know everything about it. Steroid underground, peptide underground, SARMs underground. They're... The peptides and the SARMs were strictly sold as research chemicals and very little data, very few studies and the thing is with the SARMs, the selective androgen receptor modulator so it acts on the androgen receptor They were designed to prevent muscle wastage. So think about diseases and at the time, like HIV, which was more prevalent at the time when they were coming out with these, and osteoporosis and cancer, things that would debilitate you and your inability to hold onto lean muscle or anything at all. So these were really to help prevent like bone density loss and sarcopenia and things that would add to your suffering or potentially kill you sooner. And so that was their intent. So but with the bodybuilders, these were, these were promising because they were like steroids without the side effects. They... Now, they weren't as drastic on what they could accomplish muscle-wise, but they were way better than any, like, natural supplement. It was like this in-between, but we're not looking at all of the side effects that steroids were causing initially. So with steroids, especially oral steroids, you're looking at A high level of toxicity because to take an oral compound, you have to run it through a process that's called C17 alpha alkylation, which allows it to pass through and pass through the liver. But to do so, you have to alter it, and when you alter it, that's when you start to see the liver damage, the kidney damage, the blood pressure, the cholesterol. And with injectable steroids, well, there's a slew of side effects with those, depending on which ones you're using, anything from estrogenic side effects to high levels of anger, acne. I mean, and the list goes on and on and on, depending on what you're using. So-

[53:16]

[Luke] I think most people are familiar with roid rage.

[Dylan] Yeah, and that's one of those concepts-... that's a whole nother topic. Is

[Luke] That a real thing?

[Dylan] Potentially, yes. But some people say it, they just don't know what they're saying.

[Luke] Okay. But yeah. What's... I'm coming at this from a, especially in the in the you know, kind of hormones and all of this kind of stuff. I'm coming at it with very little information. In terms of steroids, what's the difference between, like, the anabolic steroids that body bills- bodybuilders use that have these side effects and someone just on hormone replacement taking testosterone? Is there a difference?

[Dylan] Okay.

[Luke] And like HGH, human growth hormone. Yeah. I remember about 15, maybe 20 years ago, I was doing HGH and-

[Dylan] Yeah...

[Luke] I've experimented with some of this stuff. Never with the, like, bodybuilding steroids, but some of the other stuff here and there over the years, peptides for a long time. But I still don't really get the difference 'cause it's not really in my world.

[Dylan] Let me school you then, my friend.

[Luke] Please.

[Dylan] Okay. So HGH is completely different 'cause that's really a peptide or growth hormone. So if you look at peptides that are growth hormone releasing hormones and growth hormone releasing peptides, so that's like your CJC 1295, your ipamorelin, sermorelin, those are not the same as taking exogenous HGH. So you're taking synthetic HGH on one end, or you're taking these, which are growth hormone releasers. So you take them, and it allows your body to release growth hormone naturally.

[Luke] Okay. So they're a catalyst rather than a substitute.

[Dylan] Absolutely

[Luke] Right. Okay. Okay.

[Dylan] Now, when we're looking at TRT or HRT, because it's the same thing it's just hormone replacement therapy, testosterone replacement therapy. It's the same thing. They just like to use different letters. So you asked a good question because what's the difference between taking testosterone as a steroid or taking it as a TRT treatment? Well, it's a steroid either way.

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] The difference is it, you're using it as a medication, which means the dose that you're taking is what you need to get back to your normal state of testosterone levels. So if you have a hypogonadal condition, which means that you have low levels of testosterone, then you are taking X amount of TRT to get you into optimal levels, and that's a whole nother discussion. but let's just say we're trying to get you to a healthy state. Now, if you're all steroids, anabolic steroids, are derived from testosterone, so they're just altered versions of testosterone as the base.

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] So if you're taking more testosterone than what you medically need, then that's like running a steroid cycle.

[Luke] Got it. Okay.

[Dylan] So that's when you're considered on cycle. That's when you're juicing. That's when you're juicing, and that's when you're creating problems.

[Luke] Okay.

[Dylan] No, despite what any meathead wants to tell you, that, "Oh, the bullshit" you know, that... No, it causes problems. Here's a good equation for anybody listening. Let's say that I'm taking 100 milligrams of testosterone a week. That's a fairly standard TRT dose, and this is dependent upon how severe of a condition you may or may not have. You can take that 100, multiply it by five to seven, and that's where your total testosterone number should be. So you should be between 500 and 700 total testosterone, and if you're not, then there's other problems that we would look at that could be bounding up testosterone, for example, like high levels of SHBG. But that's generally where you'd be. So if you think to yourself, most steroid users are gonna do at least 500 milligrams of testosterone at least when they're running a cycle. So five times five is 2500, but five times seven is 3500. Where you really to be healthy, you need to be about arguably 600 or 700. Some people like to be at eight. So the higher level that you walk around at, the more stress and strain you're putting on your heart, your organs, and your cholesterol's certainly gonna go up, prostate problems. 3500, and most steroid users will say, "Oh, 500's standard." No. No, that's not standard. Testosterone also converts to estrogen, so you're looking at an extremely high rate of estrogen conversion, especially if you're predisposed to it.

[57:40]

[Luke] Is that, is that where the emotional dysregulation comes from?

[Dylan] That's part of Ah... for sure. but then they wanna put you on a, an estrogen blocker or an aromatase inhibitor. Now, those are similar but different, but those have so many different side effects, too. So it's like robbin' Peter to pay Paul. And a lot of people can have neurological side effects and anger issues because of the hormonal changes, and some people are more susceptible to anger and rage, and so they do that and it causes a, more of a problem. And there's certain steroids that cause that more than others. Trenbolone, Halotestin, those are known for causing aggression and anger. So if you have any sort of those types of things going on, you definitely want to stay away from those 'cause it's really-

[Luke] Or go do a lot of therapy first. Oh,

[Dylan] Most people will tell you they've lost, and this is not even me exaggerating, they've ruined relationships, girlfriends, marriages because of those steroids that I just mentioned that they use. So When people are saying, "Oh, they're on steroids," when they're taking a normal TRT dose, they don't know what they're talking about. They're ignorant as can be.

[Luke] See, that's me. I've never understood the difference.

[Dylan] No, but some people say it, like, stupidly. You know, "Oh, they're taking steroids," when they're taking a therapeutical dose of something, and, "Oh, that's... They're jacked." TRT does not get you jacked. TRT puts you back at the level that you're supposed to be at. So here, let me ask you this. If you have a condition, any condition, and you take a medication and it gets you back to your normal state, is that cheating or is that getting you back to being healthy? So if you have low testosterone, guess what? You're gonna feel like shit, you're gonna have low libido, you're gonna have very high levels of brain fog, you're gonna have an inability to gain muscle, inability to lose fat. So if you take testosterone and it puts you back to where you're supposed to be, how is that f*cking cheating? How is that doing anything special but putting you back to where you need to be? That's always my argument to people.

[Luke] So with the testosterone you know, a lot of people have concerns about downregulating your own body's production, right? Mm-hmm. 'Cause you're sending a signal to your body, "Hey, I got this. You don't need to make it anymore." Yeah. So most of the people that I'm kind of aligned with would be using, you know, pine pollen and other ways to boost testosterone naturally out of that concern that you don't want to, in a sense, become addicted to exogenous testosterone.

[Dylan] Mm-hmm.

[Luke] Can one take testosterone for a period of time and then bounce back, or are you kind of in a lifelong relationship once you start that?

[Dylan] Well, here's the thing. If you already have low testosterone, unless there's an underlying thing that I can go in and fix, which I always go and look for, so I brought up earlier, if you came to me and I looked at your blood panel and you said, "Dylan," like, "my total testosterone number is low," and that's not even the one we wanna look at, but I'll get to that. I'll say, "Okay, let's look at your other markers, and let me see if there's a potential reason that's causing it that we can fix." And then I'll of course have questions. "Are you a prior steroid user? Have you used a lot of drugs? Have you been, you know, led a rough lifestyle?" That I can look at that are telling me. But I'll look, and like I brought up earlier, if your SHBG is high, which is your sex hormone binding globulin, if I lower that will free up the bound testosterone and your number's likely gonna go up. But let's just say that you... There's nothing I can find. There's no way to actually fix this. You can take natural ingredients to an extent, but if you have a really strong condition, they're not gonna do a whole lot for you. Now, for women, I like to look at that because women and they're... That when they have low testosterone in menopause especially, that's when we can look at more natural things that would boost them as opposed to just putting them on HRT. I like to try it for men and let's see if it works. What are you gonna lose? But if it doesn't, well, yeah, if you take exogenous testosterone, it's gonna blunt your production. But if you're already not producing it and you're never gonna produce it, well, then what are you gonna do? You're gonna... 'Cause it can, in extreme circumstances, that could kill you if it's really severe. But your quality of life's shit. It's just pure shit, and that would fix it. So yeah, you would need to stay on it because if you take it and you stop, well, you're not ever gonna recover production you didn't already have. let's say you take it and you have good production, and let's say you use it for a year, and then you say, "Okay, I wanna stop." It's going to be rather difficult to kickstart it. Now, there's ways and means. We look at Clomid, Novadex, and clomiphene as ways to jumpstart production, but again, there's no guarantee on that. And some people will say, "Oh, it's easy to come back." I've seen people that bounce back, and I've also seen way more people not, especially the older you get, especially if you're a steroid user. So yes, there are things that you can take to try to jumpstart that production. But again, you know what Novadex is? It's a breast cancer medication for women. Clomid is a male and female fertility drug. So how long do you think it's wise to take these to, you know, jumpstart production? So, you know, I always give people the honest facts. I can pull out the kitchen sink and run all this shit, but is it, is it just creating another problem? And is there a guarantee? No, there's no guarantee, but we can try. I know all the methods, but it doesn't mean they're gonna work

[1:03:15]

[Luke] I used to think burnout was just the price you had to pay for being productive. Then I found something that helps me stay focused for as long as I need without feeling smoked afterward. It's called NuCalm. It uses a neuroacoustic software to help shift out of fight or flight and into deep recovery in, like, 10 minutes. And the cool thing is there's no gadgets to buy or haul around. You just throw on headphones, open the app, and within minutes, you start to downshift or upshift if that's what you're looking for. I've been busy writing a book for the past couple years, and it's one of the most mentally demanding things I've ever done. I'm talking hours and hours of deep focus, revisiting old memories, and organizing a ton of ideas. So before I start a writing session, I'll use one of their flow state tracks to get me into zen. Then I'll lock in with a focus track for the next few hours of writing. And I'll tell you what, my wife can attest to this. When I have those headphones on, it's literally impossible to distract me. I'm like a machine. Then afterward, I'll use Recharge or Rescue to help my brain and body recover from hours of intense work. Just 20 minutes of that feels like a full nervous system reset, and NuCalm science supports that. I highly recommend you check out NuCalm, and here's how you do it. Go to lukestory.com/nucalm to start your free seven-day trial. That's free seven-day trial, folks. You'll also save 15% off your subscription. So whether you need better sleep, sharper focus, or a fast reset, NuCalm has a track for it. And again, here's the link, lukestory.com/nucalm. That's N-U-C-A-L-M to get that 15% off. And whether or not you buy it, I highly recommend you at least give yourself seven days for free. A couple years ago when I was on a fertility journey with my wife, and we got pregnant and then had a miscarriage and then, you know, worked through that, and then when we felt kind of ready, we started trying again, and nothing was happening. And my wife's like, "Well, maybe you should go get your sperm tested." And I'm Mm-hmm. "Moi?" Yeah, I was like, "Are you kidding?" Ugh. "Okay, I'll humor you." Like, I'm so healthy, you know? I mean, I'm the health- I'm healthier now than I've ever been in my whole life, with the exception of this tinnitus thing. That's the one thing I haven't been able to heal yet. So I conceded and I went and got tested, and it was, like, in the toilet, just no sperm. And then I heard someone mention that using testosterone is one of the two main things that'll tank your sperm, the other one being taking a lot of saunas or hot tubs and hot springs, which I was doing constantly. And I was on, at that time, a just as an experiment, a really low dose of testosterone. I didn't even get mine tested. I was just like, "I don't know." Mm. "I wouldn't mind being more motivated," you know? So I was taking a little bit. and then, you know, got that test, and it was like, it was quite emasculating in a, in a way, to be honest. You know, it's like, I don't think any man wants to feel infertile, you know? Yeah. And then I did something. I forget what it was. It wasn't HGH, but it was something with an acronym like that. HCG. That. Mm-hmm. Did a you know, a shot of that here and there, and, you know, started using ice in the on the wedding tackle in the sauna, and within two months, I was, like, back up to, you know, my fighting weight on the sperm count, and all was well. But I think there's probably a lot of men out there that don't realize that if they're taking testosterone at the same time when they're trying to conceive, it could cause problems. Is that a common side effect and a guaranteed side effect, or does that just happen to some men?

[1:06:50]

[Dylan] When you take testosterone, aside from one caveat that I will tell you in a second, you have two hormones, a luteinizing hormone and a follicle-stimulating hormone, and that's, you know, the male hormone that produces testosterone. But when you take exogenous testosterone, those tank, zero, which inhibits your sperm count as well. It's not just your testosterone production, it's your sperm count. Now, I found a way when you're using testosterone that will still produce sperm. Most doctors and fertility clinics, 'cause I too went through what you did, and I'll explain that in a second, will tell you that it's HCG and Clomid that will do the trick, but if you're a steroid user or testosterone user and you don't wanna stop, that is not gonna work. I mean, I'm not I shouldn't say it's not impossible, but you know how they always say it only takes one? Well, you're probably not gonna have many, so you better be a f*cking strong one, right? HMG, which is not really prescribable, is the key to that, but you gotta get that more underground. HMG with HCG and Clomid I've seen work on a lot of people that it shouldn't work on. So that's my thing there for anybody listening.

[Luke] It's just, it's weird. It's counterintuitive. You would think if you have higher testosterone, you're more virile as a male, right? You would think like, "Oh, I have more sperm because I have higher testosterone." It's, it doesn't, on its face, it doesn't really make sense. No, I know. The math is weird. I know. Well, here's the kicker- Which is why I didn't, I didn't know that, you know? I was just like, "What? That doesn't make sense. It should be the other way around."

[Dylan] Well, there's an oral form of testosterone now called Kyzatrex that I actually know the founder, one of the creators of it. And the... See, oral testosterone was always a problem. There were different options in the past that just didn't work. Well, this one is different, and it allows you to maintain your LH and your FSH. And if you were on TRT, it will pop them back up if you switch to this.

[Luke] Oh, wow.

[Dylan] Yes, and it doesn't have the estrogenic side effects. It's like liquid gold to somebody like me, right, that studies this and loves it. So that's an option for people. But yes, if you use steroids or testosterone, you're certainly going to inhibit your ability to have children. And I always tell the younger guys that are thinking they know everything, 'cause I was there And a lot of them are either under the impression that I'm full of shit or that, "Oh, I don't wanna have kids." And I always tell them, "Hey, man, you're gonna... You think you don't know, and I didn't either. And you're gonna- Yeah... meet a girl that loves you and that you fall in love with, and then you're not gonna have the ability, and you're gonna wanna Yeah... beat yourself up forever."

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] So-

[Luke] That was, that was my story. I never wanted kids in my whole life until I met my wife. Right. And it was like, "We need to do this now." It's like, yeah.

[Dylan] I I kinda looked, and my wife was standing there when you said that 'cause she looked at me 'cause we went through the same thing at the clinic. Oh. And I was flat-ass zero. And I went back for a recheck, flat-ass zero. But I smoked pot for 30 years. I did all those steroids. I did all the cocaine, had an eating disorder. I mean, you can't... And my dad had a low sperm count, so I don't think

[1:09:56]

[Luke] Maybe that's why you're the only child. Yeah. You're the one shot.

[Dylan] No. I, you know what? I had, and I always say this, there were too many close calls in my life that that it was impossible, so I probably never... It was probably never in the cards. I have two stepkids that are my kids that I couldn't be more blessed with, and I have three grandkids, so I have, I have no issue. And I always said I could never be the dad that my dad was. He coached me on everything, was there for everything. The way I work and the way I am and the way I roll, if I couldn't be the kind of dad I had or similar, it's just selfish, dude. Like, this, you got kids to see. You got kids, and you can't be there. And I, you know, again, that journey of not being selfish-

[Luke] Yeah...

[Dylan] I was like, you know, and I told Queenie, like, "I love your kids so much. They're my kids. I'm not worried about that." 'Cause she was worried about me.

[Luke] It's interesting when you speak of your parents. It sounds like they were loving and supportive parents.

[Dylan] Oh, to the max.

[Luke] And it's interesting that you ended Going down the path you did, I find most people had some sort of problematic childhood or dysfunctional parents or parents who modeled addiction or other issues. Yeah. It's always weird to me when someone is like, has, comes from a healthy family unit, and they go astray. I'm always- You couldn't have Like, why?

[Dylan] You know? Yeah, you couldn't have gotten a healthier unit or family-oriented, like, way that I was brought up and raised. You can't. I don't know how you could. I'm from an Italian family and my mom was a, my mom was an English teacher, so she was brutal on my academics. And, you know, it was every time I got home, I couldn't play till my homework was done. When I was in school, like in elementary, you know when you have spelling class and everything, man, I wasn't getting out of the car if I didn't ace that shit before I was getting dropped off at school on Fridays, 'cause Friday, you got a pretest Monday and the post-test was Friday. And I wasn't getting out of the car and I was embarrassed going in late till I aced it when I walked in. And my dad was a, an assessor and he taught me multipli- multiplication tables and division tables when I was in like first grade. So I was so far ahead of the curve in how I was raised that he coached me on everything I ever did, every sport. You know, my parents weren't rich, but they understanding now that they maxed out credit cards to give me whatever I wanted and to see, you don't understand that type of thing when you're a kid. But I see now what they did and they just sacrificed everything they could have ever done so that I could have anything I wanted.

[Luke] Well, maybe despite the fact that you took a pretty major detour, you know, perhaps that was just part of your journey, but it could be I'm guessing there's a pretty strong possibility that the reason you didn't go to prison and then stay there for the rest of your life was some seed planted by your parents' character, right? Absolutely. Whereas if you had grown up and experienced a lot of trauma and addiction and the classic kind of dysfunctional family, you might have been one of the guys, you know, going in and out of the door rather than having the awakening you had and changing course.

[1:13:07]

[Dylan] Oh yeah. They taught me and gave me everything. My mom instilled faith into me when I was young and you know, it was always a major part of our house and I had more love than I knew what I could do with, which became strange to me that I became so hardened for a while. but once I figured out why and was able to release it, now I'm like ultra loving. I mean, I still have some fierceness, don't get me wrong, but it's not nearly as prevalent now. It's more of only fierce when I gotta be, not just 'cause. Yeah, I can

[Luke] Tell.

[Dylan] You know? Like, but man, I swear to you, I sometimes when I pray I'll go, "God, I just love." You know what I mean? Like, I appreciate it and love that you have endeared me with so much that I didn't even realize I had. And then I look and I realize, man, sometimes I was such a dick, like, about, around my loved ones that just want time. They don't want anything from me. They just wanted to be around me. And I'd get so pissy, and then it breaks my heart now to realize, man, they don't want anything from me. They just wanna be around me. And it's so flattering and gratifying, but it's also humbling and it's also one of those things where I'm like, "Man, what the fuck was wrong with you?" Like, seriously, what was it? 'Cause sometimes with you, Dylan, it's you try to do so much and try to be the one that gives the biggest gifts or does everything, and nobody wants that. They just want you. Just you. And it took me a long time to realize that, man, sometimes you're just good enough.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] You know?

[Luke] Presence is a real gift when you can give it.

[Dylan] It is, man.

[Luke] Let's take me back to I, there's a lot more I wanna unpack in the hormone and peptides space. Yeah. Okay, so generally speaking, testosterone not great for the sperm count, but there are ways around that if someone chose to do that. One thing I've never really understood when you're doing blood work as a man and you're checking your testosterone, I've never understood the total versus free testosterone.

[Dylan] Mm-hmm. '

[Luke] Cause I've done... It's been a long time since I've done blood work, but I remember working with a couple functional medicine doctors and I, and I get the high number. I'm like, "800, awesome," and they're like, "Yeah, but look at the free," and I never quite clicked with me what that means.

[Dylan] Yeah. So I mean, think of it like we were talking about, freedom, right? So how much is actually free? How much is being used and how much is not? The thing everybody gets caught up on is the total number. Now, the total number's important, I'm not saying it's not, but the free is what's gauging how you're feeling. Sometimes people will come to me and say, you know, "I don't get it because I have all these symptoms, but my number's good." I'm like, "Yeah, but look at this. You see this? You don't have free testosterone. It's bound up somewhere. It's not being utilized. So it's there, which is good, which means you're producing it, but why isn't it being utilized properly?" And then that goes into, well, then that's why they come to me to figure it out, 'cause some, you know, most clinics or doctors, they just, you know how it is. Treat, treat. But why do you wanna do that? We could treat somebody, put them on TRT when they don't need it, and then create a longer term problem. What are you putting somebody on TRT when they have clearly a strong, productive score? Why don't we try to figure out what the hell's going on? So then it's a, you know, it's one of those things most doctors or even endocrinologists don't wanna do: work. You know? Like, literally figure it out. People like me because I'm so proficient in finding things, and part of it's me being stubborn 'cause I just wanna figure shit out.

[1:17:04]

[Luke] Do you, do you believe in the accuracy of blood work? Sometimes I wonder when you're doing hormone panels or toxin tests or whatever you know, it's like it seems like it's a snapshot of where you are today. Mm-hmm. And I've never done a bunch of blood work in a row to see if it changes over the course of a month or something, but I think many of us that get into the functional medicine space and work with a, you know, a doctor who uses blood work as a means to kind of guide your health journey, I mean, we just take that to be the gospel truth. Yeah. That's not-... you know, our bodies are dynamic and they're changing all of the time. Mm-hmm. So I wonder how often people are putting too much credence in their blood When it's going to be changing continually based on sleep Mm-hmm... sun exposure and EMF exposure and how much blue light you're under and all these other inputs, right? It's a great question. There's a lot- 'Cause I don't really do blood work anymore 'cause I'm like, eh, I don't really know if it's valid. You know? Unless I had a lot of symptoms or something going on that I was trying to fix, but I used to do it just out of curiosity, and I really- Mm-hmm... you know, I put so much weight in those blood tests, and I don't know that I ever really felt that much different when I applied the interventions to bring the blood work back to a place where I wanted to see it. There's some numbers that I feel are

[Dylan] Very important that will be more accurate than others, where it's like circumstantially. For instance, if you take your testosterone level and you're not fasted or it's not in the morning, you're certainly gonna get a far different number if you've been exercising, drinking caffeine, done something stressful, had a bad night's sleep. Certainly, the number's gonna be off, and it's probably not indicative of where you're really at. Cortisol levels, again, can be different throughout the day. And when you're looking at, like electrolytes, for example, potassium, sodium, those are often not where they're intent- intended should be given whether I drank a lot of water, sweat, whatever. They're off, right? And it's just, let's say I slammed a bunch of electrolytes before I went in to a thing. Well, sure. No shit. They're gonna be... But is that a clear picture of where they're normally at? And so, but when you look at maybe a cardiac IQ panel of cholesterol numbers, particle sizes, HDL, LDL, those are probably not gonna be skewed. I'm not saying it's not impossible, but those are gonna be more in line regardless of what's going on. But there's all kinds of false positives and false things that can certainly happen. So I do blood work every, like, three months normally.

[Luke] Really?

[Dylan] Yeah, because I found some things in my heart, and I'm very cautious on everything that I'm doing, and I probably go overkill, but I also know how this works, and I'm also very You work out

[Luke] A lot, dude. Oh, yeah.

[Dylan] I

[Luke] Don't

[Dylan] F*ck around, man. True. No.

[Luke] I heard you, I think it was on Ben's podcast, and even he was like, "Bro, seriously?" Yeah. Like, you might, you might wanna chill on the cardio there. Oh. I'm sitting there... Dude, I just, I have always hated exercising. Yeah. I mean, it takes every ounce of will I have to just do the bare minimum, you know? But I think also, I mean, I think some of it is just wired with more physicality, right? Mm-hmm. I've just never been, like, a really physical person- Yeah... in that capacity. And also I've never really been motivated by the aesthetics of it. I think as I get older, it's like, eh, I don't really care if I got a little gut. You know, it's like, who are you trying to impress? Especially after I got married, and my wife loves me. Yeah. She loves my little fat tummy, and I was I might be a little more concerned about it if I was single and dating or something like that. But, you know, it seems, A, you've got someone who's just... They just have that kind of, that kind of chi, that kind of energy that needs to move, right? Yeah. And I'm just, I'd be happy to just sit on my ass and meditate all day long. but I think a lot of people in the biohacking space, especially in kind of the hardcore fitness side of that Could be over-training in certain cases or be motivated by their aesthetic appearance and neglecting the longevity aspect of their health. What's your, what's your take on that?

[1:21:12]

[Dylan] Oh, certainly. There's a lot of vanity for people, and I... Look, I had an eating disorder at a very young age, and so I've always been overly concerned about how I looked. Now, it isn't that I give one ounce of a shit about what anybody says, 'cause I don't. And I always tell people, I laugh, 'cause, like, in the bodybuilding years and those things when I was doing that, I used to tell Queenie, I'd say, "Man, if I really gave a shit about what a bunch of guys said about how I look, a bunch of steroid dudes, and I'm worried about that, I got I need to see somebody and seek some help." I don't give a like, say whatever you want. I don't give a shit. I love, and when I tell you I love, and I mean I love the way that I feel when I work out and what I get from it, and I want that challenge every day. Like, I really do. Now, the, I take days off now, where I used to really overtrain. You sure? I walk.

[Luke] Is that true? Yeah.

[Dylan] I still walk every single day, but I don't do cardio or weight train every single day like and like, before I came here, I did 15 miles on the elliptical and already walked four miles. Oh, my God, bro. And when I, when I go home, I'm gonna go to the gym

[Luke] After I have

[Dylan] Dinner.

[Luke] I can't, I can't imagine. I will, I will say this, to be fair. you know, I have one of these CAROL bikes. Yeah, I do too. The, and the oxygen the EWOT system- Yes... you know, with the mask. Yeah. And so I go low ox gen, high ox gen. I hate riding that damn bike, but every time I do it, which is not enough, as much as I should, I'm, like, so happy all day. Yes. And I go, "Geez," like I don't... I'm not stressed out. Like, I feel more mental clarity, more drive. It's a... Mm-hmm. And then it takes me a while to track, like, oh, yeah, on the days when I, you know, just crush it for 10 or 15 minutes on that CAROL bike, which is really hard, I mean, it's like It's HIIT training Yeah, it's, yeah. Yeah. It's intense, but I think that's why I'm able to do that one, 'cause it's so short. Yeah. Like, I look at the timer, I'm like, "15 minutes? I'll scroll on Instagram and go into a black hole and 45 minutes go by." Like, I can do 15 minutes on this damn bike. Oh, I love it. But I think there, aside from aesthetics, aside from wanting longevity, wanting to be fit, I mean, there definitely is a mental and emotional aspect to it that, like, that's the thing that appeals to me. And I think it might have something to do with, and I wanna get your take on this Okay. Modern man, you know, if you're doing computer work, which a lot of my work is computer work, or I'm sitting here, like most of the stress that I experience in my life is mental, right? I'm not really under physical stress ever. Right. Whereas in antiquity, if I would've been born a couple thousand years ago, or maybe even a couple hundred, there would've been a lot more physical stress than mental stress. Mm-hmm. And so there's sort of this imbalance now where I'm just up in my head stressing out and just tweaking on life, but my body's just laying around not moving much, right? So there's like a mismatch between my ability to adapt to stress because I'm only adapting to mental stress and not putting myself regularly, at least, under physical stress. Yeah. Do you see a correlation? I think what I'm getting at is that the mental and emotional benefits that I feel when I really hit it hard, I think I'm creating symmetry.

[1:24:36]

[Dylan] Yeah,

[Luke] 100%. What's your take on that?

[Dylan] So my whole premise of everything I teach is based around mind, body, and God, and my whole thing is, first and foremost, I have to connect you with God to align the rest of the triangle there. He's at the top. And then I tell this all the time now. My biggest mistake was so fundamental. All I cared about was diet and training without the realization that the mind was the bigger portion of things here, and without that mind and that strong mental health, and I even said this to Dr. Amen, I was interviewing him and I asked him, I said, "Well, how does one train their mind?" And he kind of looked at me and said, "Well, no one's really ever asked me that," like, the training of the mind.

[Luke] You know what he told me? Mm-mm. He said, "Play ping pong." Yeah. Did he tell you that?

[Dylan] He said something about

[Luke] Ping pong. And he broke it down. I was like, oh, my God, I need to get a ping pong table. Yeah. It is something about the hemispheric synchronization. As you get older- Yeah... you know, you have a harder time kind of using your whole brain, and so I thought, wow, that was not the advice I was expecting. No. Well, that's why he's who he is. To get a brilliant- Maybe that's why older people like to play tennis and pickleball and things like that. There's an intuitive- There is...

[Dylan] In a sense. There is. Absolutely. When you understand as you piece it together, your mind controls everything, so your mind will tell you, "I can't," or, "I can do this," so anything physical that you do, your body can do it. It can. Now, it needs training to do it, but it certainly can. I mean, you see people that do some amazing things, what you think you can't, you could. Now, you'd have to bust your ass, and you have to tell yourself you could do it, but your mind is telling you can or you can't. Well, you look at some of the best athletes of all time, what separated a star from a superstar and a superstar from somebody elite? There was the fear they put into others because they were ice cold, because they just lived for those moments, because they were fearless, because they knew. They just knew.

[Luke] Yeah, absence of doubt.

[Dylan] Absolutely. Yeah. And when you have the mind right, you think about this, too, physically, the problems that you have if you are stuck in a sympathetic nervous system state, I mean. How many problems do you end up having physically because your mental is off? And the more stress that you have, the more inflammation you're gonna see, the more disease that you're gonna see. The more anger somebody has, the worse their blood panels are gonna look, I guarantee it. So it starts there, and when your mind is right, then you have the ability to really dial your physical in 'cause you know, you could train well and feel good mentally for a little bit, but if you're still having these issues, it's only... It's gonna be very superficial in how long it lasts, kind of like a bolt of caffeine, right? In a sense. Now, at least you're getting the training for, to make you healthier inside. But if you don't really attack your mental first and take care of it and nurture it, and you have to, you have to be at peace up there, and that's where God comes into play because He brings that peace into your life. Then I can really fix you hormonally, physically. They're all important. I don't wanna understate the importance of not being expold, or exposed to mold and toxins. Like, these are very important, and your blood panels being aligned. But it's not totally fixable if your mind is off. It's just not. Yeah. And I can prove it through all of the years of what I've done and seen. And if you got people on a bunch of zombie medications walking around, they're never gonna be physically right. They're just not. The more medications that people are on for, quote-unquote, mental health, the more problems you're gonna have and not be able to do things physically. I'm not saying that no human alive doesn't need some sort of medication. That's not what I'm saying. But they also don't need to be pieced out like Halloween candy, you know? It's just, it's just ridiculous and when I make statements like that or anybody in our field does that, they, "Oh, they're anti-this." No, fucker, I'm not anti-anything. I'm anti being abusive, and I'm anti not looking for the problem, and I'm not anti just treating everything without looking for the core problem. Yeah, then you can call me anti. But these people make these comments, and they sound stupid because they don't think. They're so one-track minded, they don't see the bigger picture. You can, you can fix things. You can go in and find the cause and fix it. Don't just treat and treat things where you're actually creating a bigger problem.

[1:29:12]

[Luke] Yeah. Yeah. Chasing symptoms and in the chase actually making the cause worse. Yes. Our medical system in a nutshell. I like the point you raised about You know, the mindset and spiritual attunement I've observed in myself to a degree too, but by and large, kind of in the biohacking space. I mean, I feel like it's leaning in a positive direction, but I see a lot of people that become so obsessed with the body and the, you know, the optimization of the body that they are forgetting about the quality of the mind, right? It's like I like to talk about negativity fasting. You know, a lot of people get into fasting, and I go, "That's nice. That's good for you. There's a lot of evidence to support that." Human beings have always fasted because they had to go out and find their own food, right? Yeah. So it's, I think we're wired for fasting, but what about your mind, you know? What about negative thoughts? I like that. What about negative emotions? Mm-hmm. And that's really my daily practice. Anytime I see myself starting to be critical, judgmental, complain, whine. I mean, even just earlier when I said I hate working out, I caught myself like, "Ooh, I don't even wanna use that word." You know, I could say it another way that doesn't have as much kind of energy behind it. Like, it's not something I'm naturally drawn toward. You know? You know? But both are true. Yeah. But, like, which one is healthier for me to walk around thinking? Yeah. I don't wanna hate anything. I don't want hate in my heart or in my mind, right?

[Dylan] You know, what I have actually prayed for frequently recently is nourishment of my soul, and that nourishment will then allow me to really become more well, right, more healed, more healthy. But if you don't have your soul in line to where it needs to be with happiness, with the inner distribution of our emotions being proper, right, where they're really just functioning all in tune, that's how you get aligned. But if your soul is not nourished with what it needs, these idiopathic problems, Yeah... they start to figure themselves out.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] You know?

[Luke] Totally. I mean, the, it's really an interesting phenomenon too, wherein someone has a lot of unresolved trauma or emotional pain and then gets one of these kind of mysterious pathologies like Lyme disease or chronic fatigue and goes for decades and decades and tries every physical intervention on Earth and never heals. Yep. I think a lot of the time there's underlying emotional issues because the It's it, man... is yearning for some attention, right? Yes. Some care. Yes. And another thing I've noticed, you know, as a really, as, like, a health nut, which is what we used to be called before Asprey came up with the term biohacker, you were just a health nut that got into all the weird stuff. Is that it can also, I think I, this is top of mind too, 'cause I just wrote this book about loneliness and connection and all of these things, right? But there have been times in my life for sure where I've actually diminish my relationships with other people because I would become so obsessed with being healthy, right? And the amount of time that it takes doing the sauna, the PMF, the ice bath, taking the supplements, doing the routines, getting your blood work, going to the functional medicine Zoom meeting, all of it, right? It can end up being an addiction really- Mm-hmm... that takes you out of your real life, which is the whole point that you think you're doing all that stuff for, right?

[1:32:54]

[Dylan] Yeah.

[Luke] I'm gonna optimize so that I can go live my life, and in the process, you're not living your life 'cause all you're doing is optimizing.

[Dylan] It's true.

[Luke] It's really, it's a, it's a weird kind of vicious cycle. What's your take on Oh... pattern?

[Dylan] So I just you'll have to see some of the content I did. Again, my friend Kevin Trudeau, he brought that up to me, and he asked me about the people that try to live to be 1,000 years old, and here's my concern. Yeah, I am always gonna look for alternative ways and means, and I'm always gonna look at things from all aspects. I prefer functional medicine all day. There's a, there's certainly a time for conventional, but I'm definitely pro like functional and holistic medicine, and I'm all about modalities and options in biohacking. I love, I love it. I, foundationally I love it, but I see more and more biohackers becoming more and more unhealthy because they try to do everything, and I'm talking mentally and physically unhealthy because they're taking 800 different supplements and don't know what's doing what. And then if you have a problem, how do you know which one's causing the problem?

[Luke] Do you have a Ring camera in my kitchen?

[Dylan] No, I did it too. I did it forever, and then, you know, strange rash or strain, you know, whatever pops up. And I think, too, it gets to the point where there's fear being caused, and people are getting confused by some of the extreme content that's being put out, and it's like, man, I always make this joke. I said, "F*ck, it's dangerous to even wake up anymore because sh*t, your sheet- your sheets, something in your air, something in your..." I mean, literally it gets to the point where people are hopeless, and that bothers me, and that's where when I say like sometimes biohackers are the unhealthiest, I don't mean like all of our colleagues and everything, but people, they put out content, and they do it for clicks, or they do it to get people to watch to do something extreme. They cause people to be confused, and then people think they have to do all of this sh*t. There's something for everybody. And where

[Luke] People are afraid, they spend money.

[Dylan] Well, yes. But you know, there's some things that you're gonna wanna do that I don't necessarily need to or want to do and vice versa, that you specifically for whatever you have going on, you're gonna need. Doesn't mean I do, you know? And if I'm taking three things for my heart, doesn't need, I don't need to take 75, which is what I was doing at the time when I found out, right? And then I created bigger problems.

[Luke] Yeah. I mean I think if People like me that tend to be pretty obsessive, you know, it's like I was an addict before. It's not lost on me that when I got sober, I got addicted to feeling great and optimizing my health, right? Yeah. 'Cause I was really sick and toxic, so that made sense, but it's taken me a very long time to learn how to have balance and remember that the purpose of doing all that is actually to live my life. Yeah. You know what I mean? Well, I remember at some point somebody gave me some oxytocin nasal spray, right? Yeah. It's very calming and, you know, it's good if you're having some anxiety and stuff, and then at some point I'm looking at that bottle going, and I don't know which is which, I don't have the data on this, but I thought, "I bet if I went and hug and hug and kiss my wife, I'd probably get more oxytocin, or pet the dog or whatever, than I'm getting in this stupid bottle." It's true Like, there's oxytocin right here in my house. I don't need to order it online. You know what I mean? That's right. Totally. I think there's... And then to the fear piece you speak of is this, I mean, orthorexia is typically is referring to just being afraid of food, right? And being so paranoid about everything you eat and all that, but there's like I don't know what, if there's a word for it, but, like, environmental orthorexia, and I notice myself often having tension around everything is made of plastic, it's off-gassing, I'm touching receipts. I mean, you just, there's like a thousand, there's a thousand things in your day-to-day life, the chem trails, the blue light- Oh... the EMF. Gosh. And I've found that when I'm really honest with myself, that I have a lot of anxiety around the world. It's like the world is trying to kill me. Yeah. And that's a really mentally and emotionally unhealthy way to go through your life, right? Yeah. So it's like how do, how do you find the balance between, okay, I have some awareness that breathing Teflon, not the great Yeah... so I'm gonna get healthy cookware, just as an example, right? Like, you gotta learn that and you have to have the awareness, but then it turns into this constriction and control where you're, like, living in a bubble.

[1:37:28]

[Dylan] That's right.

[Luke] And that then becomes its own kind of pathology mentally and emotionally. So in your life, how do you learn and become aware, but not live in a constant state of tension around it?

[Dylan] I tried so long, and I mean forever. YouTube videos, be perfect, never make a mistake. Food, never let anybody think that you're eating anything that you speak out against or say or whatever. And I just got to the point because I told I was with Ben Azadi, I talk to a lot about this, about we have the discussions about my just being terrified of fat, like eating fat. And it took Oh, really? You know, it took me till about two years ago where I just never even ate any. Like, and I Whoa For like 15, 20 years.

[Luke] Whoa.

[Dylan] And now I'm

[Luke] Surprised your brain kept working.

[Dylan] Oh, me too. Well, now, I mean, that's the whole basis of my diet almost. but when there are certain facts that we need to say, yeah, sucralose, for example, yeah, it's not great. Don't eat a bunch of it And these dyes and these, all of these things with foods and everything, yeah, try to avoid them. But it doesn't mean that if you have something that has sucralose in it one time-

[Luke] My little nicotine pouches probably have sucralose

[Dylan] In them Well, probably. But if you have it once, is it, is it gonna do anything? Like, really? Really? So we put these fears into people to, like, where I said, you make it to where they can't do anything. There's certain things that you have to look at and you go, "Okay, if I have one of these you know, here or there or do this or do that," it's called balance and it's called, you know, life, that you just can't avoid everything. Otherwise, your whole life is gonna be revolving around you looking and analyzing and overanalyzing every single thing that you do, no matter what. You know, I try to, like, with the plastics you brought up, yeah, I try to keep it minimal, right? But there, you're just... what? You can't avoid it forever. The best thing that you can do is minimize things, cut them out to the best that you can, and hey, if you want something once in a while or something's got it in it, fine. It's not the end of the world. And just because you have one time or another does not make you this... 'Cause some people act like, "Oh, my gosh, you did this. You're evil" or, "They promoted this. It has this in it, da, da." It's like, listen, man. Like-... you know what? These powders and stuff that you want to not have something in it, you, then you tell me they taste like shit and you don't want anything to do with them. "Oh, they taste horrible." Well, okay, but they have every ingredient in it that you want, so what, where do we, where do we connect here, right? Yeah. So, like, for me, I try to minimalize the things that I have, and it's like, okay, I want to take this. Well, it's gonna have a little bit of sucralose in it. Well, that's all I'm having, so it's not a big deal.

[Luke] Another thing that really freaks people out is citric acid. Yeah. You know? It's like everything has citric acid. It's made of black mold. Come on. It gets... It does get a little crazy to a certain point. It's tedious, man. But here's how I kind of make decisions around stuff I'm putting in or on my body, 'cause, you know, not every single supplement I take is just pristine, right? It might have one little excipient or an ingredient that I'm not that excited about. To me, it's like cost to benefit ratio.

[1:40:42]

[Dylan] There you go.

[Luke] Does... Is the thing a net positive despite the fact that it's imperfect in some cases? And I'm pretty picky about supplements and all this kind of stuff, especially because I promote a lot of them, and I like to sleep at night Yeah Have positive karma. But when I'm at home, I mean, I'm much less strict than I recommend other people be, you know? Yeah. 'Cause I just don't wanna live in that constricted, paranoid state, 'cause I just find it... I just don't feel as well mentally, you know? Mm-hmm. So I'm always, you know, aiming toward the kind of balance you speak to of Yeah Okay, cool, let's do the best we can. But living in a constant state of, you know, cortisol poisoning is probably worse than a little citric acid. You know what I mean?

[Dylan] Well, and you know, you become a teacher, and you teach people things, and then everybody thinks that you are perfect. You know, I always tell people, most of the best teachers have made the most mistakes. They just don't make them twice. But nobody's perfect. Oh, that's

[Luke] Good.

[Dylan] Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm, I know from firsthand experience, you know? But I feel like I've gained a lot of wisdom because of the mistakes I've made. But man, like, you can't jump on people because they teach you something, and then, oh my gosh, like, Dylan had a Quest bar because it's got a few processed ingredients. Yeah, well, guess what? I eat damn near perfect all the time. I'm gonna have a fricking protein bar if I want one. It's not the end of the world, you know what I mean? And it's like people do that type of thing. I got over that at this point. It was like, I don't care one way or another. I know how I live and how I do everything, and it's... I mean, most people think I'm crazy as it is with the training and how strict I am with eating and even when I travel and everything 'cause I don't eat out. So it's like, man, I... Listen, if you wanna talk shit, talk shit. I don't care 'cause I'm happy, you know? So say whatever you want. I'm not gonna do anything different or appease you living in mom's basement typing a bunch of shit about me. I don't care. You know? Like, it doesn't matter. Yeah. If you are doing that type of stuff, like that's what you do with your free time, is just type negative shit, like-

[Luke] You got bigger problems.

[Dylan] Yeah. Yeah.

[Luke] I wanna cover one more thing before we wrap it up, and it could be a big topic, but I think you can probably put a bow around it. And we alluded to it earlier, and that's peptides.

[Dylan] Yeah, please.

[Luke] So back in the day when I started working with peptides, they were you know, like gray market and not for human consumption, laboratory use only and all that. And I don't know that I was that safe. I didn't ever have side effects that I was aware of. But now I go on and off a couple here and there, but now that the regulatory agencies are loosening up, I mean, we are in the peptide Wild West. I mean, I must get an email a week from companies like, "Hey, promote our peptides." And it's actually so much work to do the due diligence, right? To, like, really get into their analysis, their certificates, and make sure they're not just photoshopped. I mean, it's like, it's crazy. Yeah. so I found a couple companies that I, you know, that I trust that I'm working with. But you know, with this what's it called? Ozempic? Yeah, Ozempic. I mean, I don't really know a lot about it, but I do sometimes see celebrities you know, photos of celebrities and, I mean, they literally look like monsters. They look Mm-hmm... skeletons. Yeah. And it's pretty recent that started happening to the point where That look is now, I feel like, kind of being pushed on the public as the aesthetic standard.

[1:44:08]

[Dylan] Mm-hmm.

[Luke] Right? Where back, you know, in the '50s, women were a little thicker, and that was what was in old Playboy magazines or whatever, right? And then you had, like, the '90s, the heroin chic skinny, and then the big butts came back in with the Kardashians-... right? You kind of see Yeah... these cultural trends. I mean, I've never seen anything like this. It's spooky looking. I just see that and go, "That can't be good," whatever that is, you know? No. Where do you see that we are with peptides? Do you use any? Do you think they have value? The, what's the safety profile?

[Dylan] Here's the question that I always get: "What do you think about peptides?" And my answer? "Which one?" Because most people now, when they hear that, they think of two things. They think of what you just said, Ozempic or GLP-1s, let's just say, or BPC 157. They have no clue what peptides even are. The thousands that are out there and the premise of which they are used, they're far more than weight loss, and they're far more than just healing injuries. I can go down the line. Selank and Semax.

[Luke] Oh, that one I take all the time.

[Dylan] Two of my favorites, right? So we're looking at really easing of the body. Do you

[Luke] Think the nasal spray is as effective as the subcutaneous injections? Yeah, for those

[Dylan] Two it is. Yeah. There's certain ones that are and aren't.

[Luke] I don't really notice a difference between the nasal spray and injecting that.

[Dylan] No, that one's okay. There's certain ones that are much more comparable to that delivery method. Motzi, cellular health. I like SS-31 'cause it can improve ejection fraction in the heart. But some of these were intended for something completely different. Like GLP-1s are really for diabetics first, and then they were found to show the efficacy in weight loss. But people don't know what they're doing or taking. They're just listening. And can I offer a piece of advice to everybody out there? That's

[Luke] Why you're here.

[Dylan] Don't listen to anything a celebrity takes. What sort of credential or experience does a celebrity have in general? I don't, I don't wanna blanket statement that 'cause there's probably one or two that has some sort of credential. Don't do what they tell you to do. Don't vote who they tell you to vote for. Don't do anything they tell you to do because they don't know shit. They're good at acting or modeling or whatever, and most actors, they're good liars. So the, I don't understand that in itself because with influencers at least are teaching at least most. I should say be careful with that too, but most are at least teaching or knowledgeable at some something. peptide in general, the premise behind it as an alternative medication and for a wave of future treatments is phenomenal. I believe there is such a place for it once we get past this craze and a lack of understanding of what they even are, 'cause it's far more than people even understand. They just like I said, they have this conception that I'm gonna take it and lose a bunch of weight or that I'm gonna take it and heal some sort of injury miraculously, like a torn ACL overnight, and that is not what they are and there's no such thing as a magic pill that's gonna work in one setting. And generally, Luke, what I've seen in my entire life is when something does something for weight loss, there's normally an adverse effect and reaction because it's just completely going against how our bodies were designed. There are people that will fight me tooth and nail about me saying, "You shouldn't take these." And I'm not saying you shouldn't ever take them, but the way they're used is not right. It's misused. "Well, what about the people that are obese? You just don't care?" And it's like, oh, so all of a sudden now the only way to treat obesity is with this. That's what you're telling me? That I'm lost. And the people that get angry if you have a counteract-- "Oh, you're just hating on GLP-1." Really? 'Cause I, what am I selling something that counteracts with GLP-1? 'Cause last time I checked I wasn't.

[1:47:55]

[Luke] The thing that's concerning to me about those is losing fat so quickly, you're mobilizing a shit ton of toxins you've been building up your whole life.

[Dylan] That too and you're, youThat's

[Luke] Scary...

[Dylan] You're losing muscle in the process, and when you stop taking those you will eat again. I know crazy concept. I know people wanna argue with me on that too that have no experience or haven't seen it. And well, just eat. Well, just eat like you're supposed to. Well, most people can't when they're doing it because their mind has shut off that they're even hungry. Some people can when they microdose it, but these are... They're like justifications that people wanna fight back so that they can feel good about using it, and then they'll fight you about it and argue which I just move along because I'm fine either way. Do whatever you want, right? I'm just the teacher and I'm not selling it anything. I'm not promoting anything. Do whatever you want, but I will tell you the honest truth on the good and the bad. There is merit to them to a degree, but not in the way people use them.

[Luke] Is there a difference between the GLP-1s and 2s-

[Dylan] Yeah In terms

[Luke] Of risk profile?

[Dylan] We're getting less risky as we get higher with them, but still then there's nothing long-term there that we can look at. So yeah, they're being made differently, and on paper, yes, they should be less risky, but how do we know? How do we know anything long-term? I generally would say we need to see 30, 40, 50 years of data. You know, you can look at a five-year study or a 10-year study, and certainly it's beneficial, but it doesn't tell you anything long-term at all. And then again, are the studies compromised? How are these actually being controlled? Who's conducting them? What sort of people are we putting on them, and how do you actually know what they're doing? That's a whole nother argument. That's a, that's another podcast, you know? But it... Look, I'm not anti-shit, man. I'm just pro-truth. You know what I mean? Like, and that's it. Do whatever your heart desires. I really hope that you listen and you take care of yourself, but at the same time, I'm not gonna fight anybody over anything. It's not worth it. I don't, I don't have a horse in the race, you know? So.

[Luke] Are there any peptides that you take currently that you're a

[Dylan] Benefit from? I'm not right now, but tesamorelin and KPB are my two favorites, and KPB I Yeah... because we're looking at gut health and inflammation, and I feel like that is the most underrated of any peptide out there. And I like tesamorelin because tesamorelin you lose stubborn fat and still have the ability to gain muscle.

[Luke] Oh, that's quite interesting.

[Dylan] So I love that one.

[Luke] After nearly three decades in the health world, I've learned a few things, and one of the most important is this: the best supplement routine isn't the one you copy from someone else. It's the one that actually fits your unique body, and that's one of the many reasons I love Activation products from Ian Clark. This dude is an OG in the wellness space. He was a biohacker before there was a name for it. Ian teaches how to support your body through his 15 master keys of health. It's a framework built around fundamentals like hydration, minerals, healthy oils, detox, and cellular nutrition. And what's cool is that Activation products even has a one-minute quiz that gives you a personalized protocol based on those keys. My quiz recommended black cumin oil, or as many people call it, black seed oil, which I've already been using for years. So that was a clue that this quiz was on point. The black cumin oil is great for immune and gut health, respiratory wellness, and liver function. And another thing that popped up on the test was Restore for hydration and mineral balance, which is huge because I'm in the sauna so often. And then there's Ease Magnesium, a fast-acting magnesium spray that absorbs through your skin to support relaxation and deep sleep. I have bottles of this stuff all over the house, including in the sauna where I use it most often. It's a great way to get magnesium into your body. Because the smartest supplement routine is the one that's built personally for you. So take the quiz yourself and see what you discover. To take the quiz and explore some of this stuff for yourself, go to activationproducts.com/luke and use the code Luke for 15% off your order. Stop guessing and build a routine that's actually made for you. That's activationproducts.com/luke and the code is Luke. I think I've experimented with most of the kind of top 10, but I'm not that great at reading deep research papers. Right. So I just go, "Oh, it does this and it does that," and I've not noticed the Selank and Semax definitely have noticed, and the BPC-157 I've noticed. Mm-hmm. I've got a funny story. I'm probably not the only one that has this story, but when I first got into them years ago, I don't know, maybe 10 years ago or something I was taking Yeah... for sleep, and my deep sleep scores crushed it, but then I got nervous, kind of like testosterone, that I was gonna somehow down regulate my natural capacity for deep sleep, so I stopped that. But the other one I think it was called melanotan.

[1:53:05]

[Dylan] Oh, shit. And Don't get me going

[Luke] On that. And I took that and got uncomfortably persistent boners.

[Dylan] Yeah. That'll do that, too.

[Luke] Yeah, like, not in a fun way.

[Dylan] I actually had somebody that you should talk to if you haven't on, we were discussing about this, Dr. Michael Christopher, and he's, like, the one that finds melanoma better than anybody in the world, and we talked about melanotan and how dangerous it is and can cause- '

[Luke] Cause it turn, it kinda turns you orange

[Dylan] Too, right? Oh,

[Luke] Dude.

[Dylan] I took melanotan in 2012. I wonder

[Luke] If Donald Trump's on it. Oh. That's why he's orange.

[Dylan] I got so uncomfortably dark when I was living in Maui when I took that when it first came out. Like, I didn't leave the house for two days. It was so embarrassing.

[Luke] Wow.

[Dylan] So embarrassing. But I used to get very nauseous with it, but same, the libido increase on it, too, is-

[Luke] Yeah...

[Dylan] That was the one good-

[Luke] That was the appeal for me. Yeah. I just didn't realize it was that extreme.

[Dylan] Oh, it's,

[Luke] It's... yeah. So that one, that one didn't last long. I didn't turn orange, but I just, like, had nowhere to put my-

[Dylan] I didn't

[Luke] Turn orange...

[Dylan] Energy. But I definitely, I looked like my wife's color.

[Luke] Really?

[Dylan] Oh, yeah. I looked that Filipino, dark Asian, even darker than her.

[Luke] I don't know. I just think that one in particular just intuitively feels a bit sketchy because melanin is so crucial. Like, I donMm-hmm... I don't think you should be toying with your melanin.

[Dylan] No, You know?... I don't recommend it.

[Luke] Yeah.

[Dylan] Okay. I'm not a fan.

[Luke] Okay, good to know. All right, you guys. Well, you can find the show notes for today's episode at lukestore.com/gemelli, G-E-M-E-L-L-I. So anything we talked about that is able to be linked will be there. Tell us where we can find your podcast Mm-hmm... what your plans are for that and anything else you're doing.

[Dylan] Everything is just @dylangemelli. I try to make it very easy, and then just Dylan Gemelli Podcast. And I've got some pretty big things I'm cooking right now in the medical field design, where I'm gonna be building out one of the biggest online wellness sites and centers, I don't wanna call it a clinic because it's far more than a clinic, where you're gonna be able to do everything from getting certifications and classes, peptide certifications, HRT certifications, cellular health, to telehealth and real deep, intricate blood panels Affordable healthcare that I'm working with. I mean, this is gonna be the biggest site of total wellness. I'm gonna have brands. I'm gonna be branding some of my own products, but bringing on brands I know and trust onto the site as well. so this is, like, the biggest wellness conglomerate, I guess I would call it, ever built.

[Luke] Wow.

[Dylan] Yeah.

[Luke] Epic, dude.

[Dylan] Yeah.

[Luke] What's the general timeline on that?

[Dylan] I'm hoping in the next two to three months we should Really?... launched and ready, yeah.

[Luke] Oh, shit. I thought you were gonna say two to three years.

[Dylan] No, no.

[Luke] Okay, so this is brewing. We're,

[Dylan] We're definitely moving.

[Luke] Epic.

[Dylan] We're moving at Olympic 100-yard dash speed.

[1:56:06]

[Luke] Good for you, my man.

[Dylan] Yeah. Awesome. I'm all over it.

[Luke] Well, thank you for joining me today. It's been great to hang out with you, and it's been fun to be in Phoenix and experience a different kind of hot.

[Dylan] I appreciate you, brother. Thank

[Luke] You so much. I texted my wife. I was like, "It's hot as hell here." She's like, "It's hot as hell here." I go, "Eh, it's different here." Eh, it's a little different. Like, you get out... I went out at solar noon today, you know, and took some sun at the hotel, and I was like, "Okay, this is a different kind of solar noon." This is, this is intense.

[Dylan] It's a different kind of heat, for

[Luke] Sure. Yeah, I dig it, but it's good to be back in the desert, and good to see you, man.

[Dylan] You too, my brother. Thank you.

[Luke] All right, you guys, that brings this one to a close. Thanks for listening and learning along with me. Now, if you've been tapped into this podcast for a while, you know I'm all about uncovering the hidden forces that impact our health, and one of the most overlooked and most dangerous is EMF in our homes. We all pay attention to our food, air, and water. We shop organic and use filters and air purifiers, but hardly anyone thinks about the invisible toxins humming through every wall, AKA electromagnetic pollution or electrosmog. And unfortunately, I learned this the hard way living under two massive cell towers back in LA. It destroyed my sleep, turned my brain to mush, and almost wrecked me completely until I finally figured out what was going on and how to fix it. And when I started putting together some really solid solutions, I knew I had to share them. So that's why I created my free EMF Home Safety Masterclass. It's over five hours of self-paced, expert-led training to help you detect and fix the EMF in your home so you can finally sleep, heal, and live without invisible stress. To find it, just go to lukestory.com/emfmasterclass where you can sign up for free. 'Cause once you know what to look for, the solutions are easier than you think. That's lukestory.com/emfmasterclass, or just click that link in the episode description where you can join my completely free training today. Oh, did I mention it was free? Yeah, seriously. Zero strings attached. Just click, watch, and learn

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